In terms of concentration of half-decent circuits the UK is very good. That's what has supported our industry for many years. but the reality is we are starting to see cracks in the system and other countries starting to push ahead rapidly with improving their facilities.

While of course we must be careful in comparing private enterprise (Silverstone/Donington) with government projects like Abu Dhabi because it's unfair.

The challenge of Donington may or may not be removed. If it was it would be a shame but how long can UK motorsport function slipping further and further behind our competitors?

A good example of this is what's happening in karting. In Europe 125cc Gearbox karting has grown and grown. It's become more prestigous and more drivers are competing in it at the highest levels. In the UK our cicuits are either too small, or don't have the facilties to host these types of karts or championships (We haven't seen a major FIA karing event in the UK for 20+ years). The tracks simply aren't big enough. So we are seeing that the UK is falling behind Europe on this matter.

While this financially is on a much smaller scale it shows signs that without proper investment and improvement there's nothing stopping the UK falling behind everyone else.

The layout of Donington pre to the F1 renovation was a good track, but they changed it a bit from the pre-war days, the only change THEN was the hairpin, so almost the same change again has happened. I don't understand why they had to move the pits tho, it was fine where it was (before redgate) and I see Tristan's point entirely. It's a shame really, and they won't get it done in time anyway. I live in Loughborough now, so I wasn't looking forward to race weekend with so many people around, they screwed up the route into Donington and the council are saying people should park in Loughborough and get the bus to Donington -_- if the facilities were an improvement, then there shouldn't be a problem...

The point is, outside of F1 (and even then I'd question those that think we were) we aren't slipping behind anyone. We generally still have great tracks with great facilities. The size of the tracks isn't a problem outside of gokarts - even Mallory, barely over a mile with barely 4 corners, is a challenge and fun - and perfectly 'big' enough - from an F3000 car to a 2CV.

Don't try and compare the UK motorsport scene for the clubman with something like Abu Dhabi. Sure, they might be race circuits, but there the comparisons end. You'd be better off comparing the Italian equivalent of Cadwell Park with Cadwell Park.

Quote from tristancliffe :

Don't try and compare the UK motorsport scene for the clubman with something like Abu Dhabi. Sure, they might be race circuits, but there the comparisons end. You'd be better off comparing the Italian equivalent of Cadwell Park with Cadwell Park.

I made a point of not comparing us to Abu Dhabi because the nature of how it was funded.

I don't have a problem with Mallory/Cadweill etc... If they remain profitable then fantastic.

However I am lookin' 10 years down the line. I can't understand why it's such a bad thing improving some of our circuits. Silverstone and Donington will look pre-historic in 5-10 years time. If the investment isn't there then of course we are in the shitter. Silverstone only made 600k pre-tax last year... it's almost a freakin' charity!

Just because Kartoring circuits are slipping behind dosen't mean that proper racing circuits are too.

Our circuits have never been in a better condition, not only that, in the last 10-12 years we've seen Goodwood revived from a dump and Anglesey completely rebuilt almost from scratch too, there is also talk of sprints/racing making a proper return to Crystal Palace and Aintree. Things are hardly grinding to a halt.

Silverstone and Donington won't look pre-historic except in terms of F1 standards. As race tracks their facilites are easily up to the job of motorsport.

These circuits have been able to invest because Britain still maintains a high standard of racing teams and racing series.

Our teams and race series are the best in the world. They can attract major levels of sponsorship and investment. However if our top two circuits start to show signs of looking old and decrepit the impact could be monumental.

Sponsors and investors need to be wined and dined. And a cold muddy afternoon at Silverstone or Donington won't cut the mustard in ten years time. I think Donington would be worth the sacrifice to maintain the highest levels of standard at our racing facilities.

There are already signs of people investing elsewhere.

UK in general has a good standard and overall better than MOST countries, but we need a couple of ELITE standard tracks to maintain investment in the sport and competitiveness in a world market.

I agree. Britain needs an F1 standard track. We have one - it's called Silverstone. It was ruined for club motorsport years ago, and is the cheaper one to maintain to that standard. Government backed tracks like Abu Dhabi or Istanbul aren't really a valid comparison still - mainly because the tracks aren't that good to race on. Bernie has got the priorities wrong, and is more concerned by image than racing. Sad.

But Donington is already a world class non-F1 circuit. It doesn't NEED to be butchered to maintain Britain's position in the world motorsport arena, it only needs to be butchered to make it viable in Bernie's blinkered eyes.

Look at Snetterton. It's not an F1 facility. Yet people love it (apart from Russells ), come from all over the world to race/test on it, and it is easily a match for any other non-F1 circuit in the world.

Sure, money needs to be spent. Paddocks can always be a little nicer, or a little smoother, with more power points or more space. And I, or the circuit owners, wouldn't deny that. But they don't need massive makeovers or changes. And when they do, they usually go bust - look at Rockingham. Purpose built, money no object. But the only people that race there now are clubbies, and hence the circuit looses money hand over fist because it is still paying for having a circuit with pointlessly 'good' facilities.


Edit: Incidentally, Todt is now in charge of ruining the FIA even more. Another 4 years before the regime can be changed for the better.

Quote from tristancliffe :

Bernie has got the priorities wrong, and is more concerned by image than racing. Sad.

While I agree it is sad, it's also essential.

It's a sacrifice that has to be made. A lot people that sponsor and invest in either teams and drivers are clueless about circuit feel and design. They want to bring their business associates along to race tracks to display their wealth.

I don't think all tracks in the UK need to be F1 standard. That's unrealistic.

Even club racers need sponsorship, and if a driver can invite a potential sponsor to a top class Donington or Silverstone they stand more chance of getting that money.

Of course if it can not be afforded then that's something we need to admit. What I dislike is the attitude that the concept of these improvements for a track like Donington is bad, when they are not.

We'll have to agree to differ. Ruining a circuit for the sake of F1 is not my idea of progress.

Well my core point is that I can't understand how people are taking pleasure in the failure of Donington. it's not good for anyone.

Quote from Intrepid :

Well my core point is that I can't understand how people are taking pleasure in the failure of Donington. it's not good for anyone.

They screwed up a decent track , they deserve to suffer.

:twocents:

Quote from BlueFlame :

They screwed up a decent track , they deserve to suffer.

:twocents:

So you're pleased a UK motorsport venue could be gone within the year?

It won't be gone. It'll return to being the club circuit that it was (with a bit more money spent to sort out the mess they've made).

Donington as an F1 circuit wasn't good for anyone (except Bernie).

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/79695
:worried:

Quote from TexasLTU :

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/79695
:worried:

That was expected, Ferrari's International Assistants playing for own team, what else?

The election was blatantly decided by bribery and blackmail so whoever had Mosely's backing was inevitably going to win, but just because Todt is favoured by Mosely dosen't necessarily mean he will be a bad FIA president, although his track record at Ferrari isn't exactly squeaky clean is it?

who knows could be a case of poacher turned game keeper, plus he has got experience of rallying as well and being french i'd like to think he understands about how important le mans type racing is.

Let's wait and see before we throw our hands up in the air and yell abuse at Todt.

I'd have preferred Vatanen, but Todt is well known as an incredibly effective manager. It's very possible that he could be good for FIA's motorsports. At least he'd probably be better than Mosley.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/h ... t/formula_one/8323753.stm

Quote :

We are not prepared to charge less. Do we need a British Grand Prix? No

Any cheap hitman rates in the yellow pages? This man needs to die!!!!

Seriously..... There are limits to where he can push.... Someone needs to sort him out.....

Quote from Intrepid :

So you're pleased a UK motorsport venue could be gone within the year?

It will go to Silverstone most probably and if it doesn't, it doesn't bother me as I never have and never will go to watch an F1 race. You get more involvement in the proceedings by watching it on television there's nothing to do by watching at a track, all you see is most of the cars pass one corner or two, for most of the laps.

Quote from BlueFlame :

It will go to Silverstone most probably and if it doesn't, it doesn't bother me as I never have and never will go to watch an F1 race. You get more involvement in the proceedings by watching it on television there's nothing to do by watching at a track, all you see is most of the cars pass one corner or two, for most of the laps.

Uhm.....

There are giant screens that show TV coverage so you see whats going on elsewhere on the track....

Or am I wrong?

Quote from BenjiMC :

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/h ... t/formula_one/8323753.stm

Any cheap hitman rates in the yellow pages? This man needs to die!!!!

Exactly, whether we need to British GP or not, we certainly don't need Bernie.

http://www.facebook.com/group. ... id=555775446.239540305..1

gtfo bernie pl0x