I get accused of crashing ALL THE TIME!

It's never on purpose, and I don't hesitate to say sorry as soon as I can. Even when I've been shunted into someone else. ...I KNOW!

I don't drive incredibly fast, but I am a defensive driver, and I will defend my line. And I have had incredible duels - fun races - with racers making laps faster than I.

But I get accused of crashing a lot more by people who don't know when it's THEM driving badly.

When I've overshot a corner, I know I've overshot the corner. I realise that there is a car in close proximity to me, and likely inside me, and I'll back off a bit and let them through. This might even leave me in a position to get right back on their tail, seeing as they've had to slow to avoid me. Then, because they're driving defensively, I can sometimes get a place back, or I can at least follow them and see where their braking happens and where they leave the kerbs - but i digress... There's the FUN! That's why I do this! BUT:

I don't suddenly swing back to the apex to cover a racing line that is NO LONGER MINE. OK?

Let me make this clear - hitting someone in the side or rear of their car means that you have done it wrong! Take one on the chin and admit your awareness fail. You can't just ram your way back onto the track because you're losing a place.

That is simply not good sportmanship, and if there is no good sportsmanship, then the sport is not good. Am I right?

It's a game - yes I know, and to all those who say 'why not?' you'll be playing something else next year, so I don't care.

Everyone I've ever had a good race against - thanks! It's a f**king great game isn't it?

It was actually a good night's racing... but there you go. Right, drunken rant over, off to the club!

This thread is useless without replays!

Don't actively defend and block someone who is several laps ahead of you (if thats the case). You don't have to dive off the track, just don't make deliberate moves.

A lot of drivers and even admins online think its perfectly acceptable to just cut someone up as they attempt a passing move on them, then the typical excuses are that they are 'defending their line', or 'that was a stupid place to pass', it even happens in real life, and it pisses me off big time, seeing as I always try to give people as much passing room as I possibly can and so I expect the same in return.

Heres a prime example of a typical ****wit who dosen't know the rules in action, watch 'ER' Enzo from 1:40 onwards, he gets a bad exit from the previous turn and so I get up along side him, at which point he just turns in on me without so much as checking his mirrors and takes me out of the race, and I get the blame. His excuse was that 'I divebombed down the inside of him' which is untrue seeing as I braked about the same time he did (infact I made a point of making sure I didn't outbrake myself as I didn't want to give him any ammunition seeing as this was about the 5th time he'd done it), worse of all he was quite clearly licking the arse of the admins, preventing me from using my admin powers to teach the ****er a lesson.

what the fuck^q.mpr

Quote from 5haz :

what the fuck^q.mpr

He had overlap, so I would've backed up a bit more.
But it's hard to judge who's at fault.

Enzo steers in without looking and totally missed the car in his mirrors entering blindspot. So indeed, "ER enzo" is the crash driver in this case.

Being slightly ahead is NOT an excuse to steer in like there is nobody else on track. Really typical accident which causes lots of frustration, because some drivers really think everybody should move out of their way.

Also notice Time Schrick, on t1 one grrr typical maneuver causing lots of frustration. THAT is what i think what should be called dive-bombing into an corner.

I wouldn't call Enzo the crasher.

Just a racing accident then.

Quote from BlakjeKaas :

I wouldn't call Enzo the crasher.

Just a racing accident then.

Thats the conclusion the admins came to as well, except he kept doing it every time someone attempted an overtake on him, it was like they thought it was unacceptable to dare try and overtake them.

A lot of accidents are just caused by complete empty headed negligence, yet a lot of people think thats perfectly acceptable, and so this thickshits never learn, and so online racing remains carnage for all but the top few. :rolleyes:

...If I had my way, arses would be kicked, and I am not a prima donna because I actually drive by the standards I expect others to drive by.

This thread wasn't started as a means to shame anyone or point fingers. I simply wanted to firstly; raise peoples' awareness of being aware (i'm aware thats sound weird, but i can't think of any other way right now), and secondly; venting.

The point should have been: Racing is about the racing. If you're fast, well and good, but there's more to it than that. You're just driving a car fast, but when you're on a full grid with other drivers, you are racing.

It's a lot harder than some would imagine.

Control under challenging conditions is the true test of how well you drive, both car and mind.

we need to keep in mind of course, that there will always be people who will ask what the blue flag is for.

but that night - dude, it was like driving against the agk.

Sportsmanship! That's the stuff we need right now! And stories of how badly people (no names) fail at it!

Quote from 5haz :

what the fuck^q.mpr

TBH that was more caused by that guy behind you whacking into your back like a numpty and there was also a bit of lag more than anything, though Enzogay should have given a bit more room into the turn.

Quote from 5haz :

what the fuck^q.mpr

Happens all the time. Partly due to plain ignorance, partly to the limited FOV. Enzo's clearly to blame. On the otherhand I do understand that you don't check your side before every turn. The freaking buttons sometimes are just out of reach.

What's typical for me is to lose the car in front of a chaser, then he can't runaround me. BANG.

Or I get accused of swerving when in fact I'm fighting for grip and traction .

Quote from 5haz :

Don't actively defend and block someone who is several laps ahead of you (if thats the case). You don't have to dive off the track, just don't make deliberate moves.

A lot of drivers and even admins online think its perfectly acceptable to just cut someone up as they attempt a passing move on them, then the typical excuses are that they are 'defending their line', or 'that was a stupid place to pass', it even happens in real life, and it pisses me off big time, seeing as I always try to give people as much passing room as I possibly can and so I expect the same in return.

Heres a prime example of a typical ****wit who dosen't know the rules in action, watch 'ER' Enzo from 1:40 onwards, he gets a bad exit from the previous turn and so I get up along side him, at which point he just turns in on me without so much as checking his mirrors and takes me out of the race, and I get the blame. His excuse was that 'I divebombed down the inside of him' which is untrue seeing as I braked about the same time he did (infact I made a point of making sure I didn't outbrake myself as I didn't want to give him any ammunition seeing as this was about the 5th time he'd done it), worse of all he was quite clearly licking the arse of the admins, preventing me from using my admin powers to teach the ****er a lesson.

what the fuck^q.mpr

Right ok mate, glad to see you've brought ths back up at the time. What the replay dosen't show is me apologsing after the race had finished for turning in too early and cutting him off even though i never saw him in the first place, due to as someone pointed out, Lag. I conceeded it was partly my fault and partly his fault as well. But none the less i did apologise for what i did.

The fact your bringing this back up makes me think you really have nothing better to do with your time, just grow up and move on, its hardly like it was anything important...

OK, so I was demo for sometime and maybe once was I accused of being a crasher. The thing with Demo Racers is that there are very few thing you can do. There's like one cruise server and a few race servers but for the most part, Demo users are idiots that crash you on purpose (Shirtkicker, I am not talking about you, but other demo-ers). They don't know what else to do but bump and nudge people...

Oh, and Shirtkicker, I wouldn't worry about people calling you a crasher. Defend your actions once or twice and if they persist just forget it....Be nice and expect mean-ness. You can't expect someone to be nice if they live half way around the world and go through things that you don't go through....So just stay calm and be nice. =D

DISCLAIMER: I am not talking about anyone in particular but what I saw while I was a demo-er.

the only and basic question is: are you familiar and do you follow the fia/crc racing rules?

if yes, you are celan racer, you are right, others who call you crasher are wrong.

note - but sometimes, if you are significantly slower than others, its not good to try to race against drivers in "different class", like 5s faster

[because its not race but taking care of racer who is braking 20m earlier for them]

Quote from Shirtkicker :

I get accused of crashing ALL THE TIME!

It's never on purpose, and I don't hesitate to say sorry as soon as I can. Even when I've been shunted into someone else. ...I KNOW!

I don't drive incredibly fast, but I am a defensive driver, and I will defend my line. And I have had incredible duels - fun races - with racers making laps faster than I.

But I get accused of crashing a lot more by people who don't know when it's THEM driving badly.

When I've overshot a corner, I know I've overshot the corner. I realise that there is a car in close proximity to me, and likely inside me, and I'll back off a bit and let them through. This might even leave me in a position to get right back on their tail, seeing as they've had to slow to avoid me. Then, because they're driving defensively, I can sometimes get a place back, or I can at least follow them and see where their braking happens and where they leave the kerbs - but i digress... There's the FUN! That's why I do this! BUT:

I don't suddenly swing back to the apex to cover a racing line that is NO LONGER MINE. OK?

Let me make this clear - hitting someone in the side or rear of their car means that you have done it wrong! Take one on the chin and admit your awareness fail. You can't just ram your way back onto the track because you're losing a place.

That is simply not good sportmanship, and if there is no good sportsmanship, then the sport is not good. Am I right?

It's a game - yes I know, and to all those who say 'why not?' you'll be playing something else next year, so I don't care.

Everyone I've ever had a good race against - thanks! It's a f**king great game isn't it?

It was actually a good night's racing... but there you go. Right, drunken rant over, off to the club!

I think most online racing are just like this... thats why i only go to public servers for drifting.

There will always be the fast ones at the front, and then the rest of the idiots in the middle of the pack and in the rear... i find it pointless to even attempt online "public" races in LFS... there is just to much mayhem, to much people who dont show respect.

Doesnt matter what server you are on, you always get pushed over by people in T1... and you will always have loads of people blocking more than they should. Eventually you get tired of spending 30-60min of being left behind with a few unlucky others or having to get DNF because of idiots who actually blame you for their idiocy.

The only racing i do is in racing series and events, sometimes practice in single or on private servers... in a series people have a tendency to show some sportsmanship because there they got something to loose... like a permaban from the series. Another "plus" demo drivers cant join because most combo´s are s2 material.

Quote from elliot1992 :

Right ok mate, glad to see you've brought ths back up at the time. What the replay dosen't show is me apologsing after the race had finished for turning in too early and cutting him off even though i never saw him in the first place, due to as someone pointed out, Lag. I conceeded it was partly my fault and partly his fault as well. But none the less i did apologise for what i did.

No you didn't, you proceeded to try and blame it on me, and only becuse you had your head up one of the admin's arses did I not get the chance to teach you a lesson. After you discovered that I had the admin powersto get rid of you was when you started trying to apologise.

And even if you did apologise, you were always going to do it again anyway, so why even bother?

Quote from elliot1992 :

The fact your bringing this back up makes me think you really have nothing better to do with your time, just grow up and move on, its hardly like it was anything important...

Normally I do move on pretty quickly, I would not normally save a replay and make forum posts like this but I was so dumbfounded by your unprecedented ignorance and stupidity, and the complete lack of reason or logic on that server. I was well and truly amazed. I even had to resort to using capitals in an attempt to get the message into your skull (something which I will never do, and which I am not proud of), but to no avail. I was just so amazed by the sheer ridiculousness of the whole thing that I just had to say something about it.

Learn the bloody rules of racing, at the moment your standard of driving would get you banned on a server where sanity prevails.

So if you PIT someone else, the other guy is a crasher?

Neat!

Quote from BlakjeKaas :

So if you PIT someone else, the other guy is a crasher?

Neat!

Use your eyes, I didn't move over on him, he moved over on me, what am I supposed to do, make my car dissapear?

Its stupid attitudes like yours that ruin online racing.

Quote from 5haz :

Use your eyes, I didn't move over on him, he moved over on me, what am I supposed to do, make my car dissapear?

Its stupid attitudes like yours that ruin online racing.

Mate your the one with the attitude in here. Its a game. Get over it. Its a 50/50 accident. If Enzo had left you room Tim would have taken you both out anyway.

In demo servers, when i used to play, there were a lot of crashers. Instinctively, people who play on them are more likely to accuse someone who commited a genuine accident of being a crasher as they are used to saying the same to the many, many crashers that exist.

People will automatically assume you crash on purpose because so many people do crash on purpose.

The viewing of the replay outweighs the word of the individual because so many people are prone to lying.

You may say you do not crash all the time but this post seems a bit pointless without any replays as you can still show a replay objectively without trying to pass blame.

Try and take the viewpoint of other people who say your a crasher and from this either let them complain or adjust your driving style so they don't complain.

Quote from sil3ntwar :

Mate your the one with the attitude in here. Its a game. Get over it. Its a 50/50 accident. If Enzo had left you room Tim would have taken you both out anyway.

You wouldn't be saying the same thing if it happened to you, shallow.

Quote from 5haz :

Use your eyes, I didn't move over on him, he moved over on me, what am I supposed to do, make my car dissapear?

Its stupid attitudes like yours that ruin online racing.

With ya on this 1


Watched the replay .. the guy had 80% overlap when he was turned in on .


What ya gotta ask yerself is , in RL would you turn in on that guy ? No you wouldn't 1, Because IRL you would have been aware that he was there ..would lead to .. 2, Self preservation , to turn in there IRL would mean a big off ..you know that i know that ... so why not leave the same room as you would in real life ? I do .. and I also expect it from others ...



What sim racing need is a 'USB hurt machine' .. when you crash ..IT HURTS! ...




Would make for realistic racing .... bet ya a tenner

Are you a crasher? Not at all.

Accidents have happened, and will happen, to everyone, period.

A few weeks ago, I took a corner a bit wide, and nailed a guy on the outside of me. I immediately apologized, because it was 100% my fault. No blaming/kicking/banning happened.

It's not the lack of driver intellegence that causes accidents like Enzo's, usually the driver is focused on the racing line, and just doesn't realize his surroundings. This is called Tunnel Vision.

Was it LFS that had/has a Car spotter add on? if so that would be good to have if you don't focus on cars around you.

What aggravates me the most in racing games, is the lack of selfless players.
If you crash into someone, or vise versa, an apology and maybe a few laughs about how awesome the crash was would be a mutual forgiving. Who cares if they fall out of a race? Its just fun.

To sum this massive post up. I love to play Live For Speed, I enjoy racing online to the fullest. I'm usually avoiding serious competitions because some racers can be very tense and content on winning, not having fun. FYI, I like to win races, but its the actual racing that fills my requirements.

Quote from Hawk233 :

It's not the lack of driver intellegence that causes accidents like Enzo's, usually the driver is focused on the racing line, and just doesn't realize his surroundings. This is called Tunnel Visio

Nope ... thats whats known as a HOTLAPPER ....... Im gonna like go fast 'n' that ... **** everyone else ..."GET OFF MY LINE"

Well here I'll give a hypothetical example.

You're in first place. The last corner is coming up, and you have raced perfectly clean. You start focusing on not messing up. You take the corner, but while moving to the inside, another very focused driver is right there. both drivers unknowingly collide, leaving both out of the race. Yeah, the driver moving inside "Should" have known there was a car, but same goes for the other driver, he should have been Defensive and seen this coming.