Another quote (well, paraphrase) from Anthony Davidson at the Johnny Herbert Karting thingy:

"When you get back into a gokart you have to relearn so much stuff to be quick"

Doesn't much sound like they're the same to me. In what way is gokarting identical? Is it the braking? Nope. Is it the gear changing? Nope. Is the g-forces? Nope. Is it the precision? Maybe. Is it the acceleration? Nope. Is is the ability to adjust the vehicle whilst driving? Nope?

Not very similar are they...

Quote from Intrepid :

saying karting is as hard, and very similar to F1

There are a lot of car racing series out there that are just as hard. As a rule, motor sport isn't exactly a walk in the park no matter what you drive, you don't seem to understand that, which isn't suprising considering you have no car racing experience to compare with your kartoring experience.

Quote from Intrepid :

OPinions aren't fact but they can add significant weight to ones arguement... and that weight has just swung my way quite significantly.

You have one opinion from a person whos background is likely to have influenced his views, and you seem to think that proves you to be 100% correct?

D- Not good enough, see me please

Schumi is back.

Quote from tristancliffe :

Remember guys - playing in a gokart is the best way of telling who the next world champion is. That is why Alan is repeatedly put forward as the favourite, as he knows more about teaching 6 year olds about gokarting than anyone in the world.

Who cares if Schumi did or didn't beat regular karters? The disiplines are SO different its unreal. If you think they aren't, why aren't 7 year olds plucked from karting to F1? That's right, because they have to learn how to drive in the intermediate formulae.

Tristan, you've taken it out of context... If I can't win a 30meter running race against amateurs do you think i'd be able to win a 3mile marathon against athletes? No, I didn't think so.

Quote from count.bazley :

Wasn't it Brabham in '91 and Ligier in '93? I think James Allen worked at Brabham at the same time as them as well, might as well have just called it ITV F1 there and then!

I can hardly wait for 2010, let's just hope no-one has developed a dominant car next season and we can have an interesting battle.

Looked on WIKI and you're right, I was just sure they were teammates in McLaren but, I've been wrong before :P and I'm clearly wrong again.

Quote from tristancliffe :

Another quote (well, paraphrase) from Anthony Davidson at the Johnny Herbert Karting thingy:

"When you get back into a gokart you have to relearn so much stuff to be quick"

Doesn't much sound like they're the same to me. In what way is gokarting identical? Is it the braking? Nope. Is it the gear changing? Nope. Is the g-forces? Nope. Is it the precision? Maybe. Is it the acceleration? Nope. Is is the ability to adjust the vehicle whilst driving? Nope?

Of course things are 'different'. Karts are much more connected to the road, hence why some many of the best drivers in the world are still obsessed with them despite being in F1 and other similar formula. Even Loeb who never karted as a youngen spends quite a lot of time nowadays driving KZs.

Can't adjust while driving you say? I must have been imagining people adjusting engine timing, fuel/air mixture, engine temp via rads, and brake bias then on karts? DO you actually know anything about karting Tristan?

G forces - 3g isn't out of the question in modern KZ2 karts. Physically a kart is harder on the body overall apart fom the neck of course.

I think you need to drive a modern KZ kart Tristan. might be an eye opener adn you may understand while 80% of the F1 grid over the last year or two can be spotted training in them.

My opinions comes from the guys that have raced both karts and F1. I don';t just imagine them from my own pre-conceptions.

As much as I know Alan goes on about Karting alot, he has a bloody good point, so Tristan maybe you should stop being a troll

What sort of nonsense is "much more connected to the road"... They are equally connected to the road - by gravity. Less so, because gokarts don't have downforce...

If you are going to say stuff, don't pull it out of your arse.

Quote from BlueFlame :

Looked on WIKI and you're right, I was just sure they were teammates in McLaren but, I've been wrong before :P and I'm clearly wrong again.

They both drove for Ligier in 1993, which was quite a good year for the team, with 3 podiums and quite a few top 10 finishes between them.

Its a travesty that Brundle was kicked from Benetton after 1992, at most races he was right with team mate Schumi on pace and at some races he was faster, and he didn't finish outside the top 10 all year. And who did they replace him with? Patrese who was at the end of his career, simply because he was Italian most likely.

Quote from tristancliffe :

What sort of nonsense is "much more connected to the road"... They are equally connected to the road - by gravity. Less so, because gokarts don't have downforce...

If you are going to say stuff, don't pull it out of your arse.

You know exactly what I mean! I am not talking about the physics of grip between tarmac and a tyre.

The closer connection for a driver comes from the lack of interuption from mechanical devices in between you and the tarmac. Like suspension for example. In a kart you ARE the suspension!

Quote from tristancliffe :

What sort of nonsense is "much more connected to the road"... They are equally connected to the road - by gravity. Less so, because gokarts don't have downforce...

If you are going to say stuff, don't pull it out of your arse.

FFS Tristan he's not being LITERAL he just means raw feel and pace is more connected to the road. He's saying you can feel each bump more directly because it's connected to the road. Are you that retarded that this theory is too hard to comprehend for you?

It's clearly a case of passion, Tristan will obviously say his F3 is closer to F1 and Alan will obviously say karts are closer to F1. But lets face is Tristan, pretty much ALL F1 drivers have driven karts, but not nearly as many have driven F3. Case closed. Go home.

Quote from Intrepid :

Anthony Davidson - "Top-Level Karting is the closest motorsport formula to F1" (off record he said that his karting days made F1 driving feel like a "walk in the park")

So you agree he's trying to tell us that karting is closer to F1 than, say, F3, F2 or GP2 is? And that he found F1 driving easy because he spent a bit of time in karts? Not because he spent a good few years in other single seaters - Formula Ford, Formula Renault and F3?

I'm not saying he's talking complete cowpat, but it just makes no sense. How can driving something that does less than half the speed of an F1 car, with no downforce, no pitstops and less G-forces be closer to F1 than a GP2 car?

You hit the nail on the head there Minimaxman. And as 5haz said, everybody has hidden agendas - Which is evident in this thread ... no names :P

Being able to win in F1 does not nesscary mean you should dominate karting, both are very competitive and demanding, but in the end there are minute differences. I think it's logical that Schumi can be beaten by regular karters, simply because he isn't racing karts as intensively as the rest do; but it doesn't mean he is a lesser driver than those lot.

But I don't doubt his ability to win in a formula 1 car, he's spent so much time racing in F1 it's his second nature, and anyone remember in the pre-season testing of 2008, he was right on pace after just 3 laps?

It's all about your senses. When you sit in a kart you know almost every great F1 driver has done exactly the same thing.

What on earth are you on about Blueflame? Feeling bumps and the chassis being the suspension (or, as Alan claims, the driver being the suspension) doesn't make it "more connected to the road".

Name an F1 driver that hasn't driven a slicks and wings car before F1. I'm not saying my old, underpowered, gripless excuse for a racing car is close to F1. I'm saying that karts are not actually that similar at all. Different driving style. Different braking style. Different mechanical needs... As a four wheeled thing it might require similar control skills, and due to the lack of weight and the lack of suspension it might be harder on your ribs, but that doesn't really make them that similar.

Case closed. Go home. <-- see how stupid that looks. Anyone can say it...

Suddenly F1 got watchable again.

I hope it's not like 2000-2004 though with Schuey dominating everything though.

Then again I'd take Schuey and Button in a team any day

Quote from tristancliffe :

What on earth are you on about Blueflame? Feeling bumps and the chassis being the suspension (or, as Alan claims, the driver being the suspension) doesn't make it "more connected to the road".

Name an F1 driver that hasn't driven a slicks and wings car before F1. I'm not saying my old, underpowered, gripless excuse for a racing car is close to F1. I'm saying that karts are not actually that similar at all. Different driving style. Different braking style. Different mechanical needs... As a four wheeled thing it might require similar control skills, and due to the lack of weight and the lack of suspension it might be harder on your ribs, but that doesn't really make them that similar.

Case closed. Go home. <-- see how stupid that looks. Anyone can say it...

All you are doing is flaming Alan because that's what you always do, and it's old. We all know you don't like him but you can't just leave it at that can you? You have to prove you are right every time. Emotions can be used a logic too, but then, if you're not as passionate about racing as think you are, logic is all you can use.

Theres lots of people making comparisons between karts and F1 cars, how do any of us know that a kart is more 'connected to the road' than an F1 car? Unless any of you happen to have driven one.

Or did someone just take it direct from an 'expert' quote somewhere, and decided to use it as the absolute shining truth to prove everything?

Quote from BlueFlame :

You have to prove you are right every time.

Who dosen't? So does Intrepid, so does everyone.

Infact, the only person I can see flaming anyone without actually adding anything close to relevant is you. Don't be one of those people that confuse 'disagreeing' with 'flaming'.

Quote from 5haz :

Theres lots of people making comparisons between karts and F1 cars, how do any of us know that a kart is more 'connected to the road' than an F1 car? Unless any of you happen to have driven one.

As a unit, you and a kart are more connected to the road, you feel all the bumps in your spine, you are closer to the ground, more open to the elements. Saying you're more connected in a kart than any other car just makes sense to be honest.

Quote from BlueFlame :

All you are doing is flaming Alan because that's what you always do, and it's old. We all know you don't like him but you can't just leave it at that can you? You have to prove you are right every time.

All I am doing is disagreeing with Alan because, as usual, he is wrong or misinformed. Or delusional. No, I don't like him, but that's not the point.

Quote :

Emotions can be used a logic too, but then, if you're not as passionate about racing as think you are, logic is all you can use.

Sorry, I don't speak gibberish. Can you translate?

Quote from tristancliffe :

Sorry, I don't speak gibberish. Can you translate?

It's not hard, just think outside your stupid box, infidel.

Oh great. Came in here to read about Schuey and Mercedes and what a surprise, it's the same moronic banter found everywhere in this forum.

Nobody cares about your smug playground argument. If either of you think either you are impressing the readership then think again. You're only illustrating that you're as insecure as each other so move on and stop littering the forum with your pointless pissing contest.

Ta.

Quote from durbster :

Nobody cares about your smug playground argument. If either of you think either you are impressing the readership then think again. You're only illustrating that you're as insecure as each other so move on and stop littering the forum with your pointless pissing contest.

Ta.

I agree lol

Blueflame is just bitter. He'll get bored soon and go and harass another thread. And yet he won't actually contribute to it in anyway, because he doesn't seem to know anything.