I just thought it would be nice to get a decent conversation going and get a small insight into your opinion about what is to come in the world of racing sims,
or just gaming in general.
What do you think will be the next great thing in the gaming world?
Just putting some ideas out there guys, imagination is key
Holographic projection, holodeck style projection
an advanced version of our latest 3d technology
Advanced simulations that take cad data from vehicle manufacturers and simulate every single part of the car with 100% accuracy, i think manufacturers currently do this for some test purposes.
I don't see sims feeling a lot different in the future to be honest.
The computer power is there, but the effort of recreating every aspect of car dynamics for a niche market may not be there. If anything the divide between sim and arcade is bridged by title like GT and forza, and the hardcore simmer can only rely on a few of the sims to push the envelope - which happens rather slowly.
sims can be more immersive and sophisiticated on the hardware front, but as soon as it become as expensive as the real thing, there's not much point to it.
I rather see a cross pollination between the hardcore sim and the mainstream games. for example the dynamic weather effects in upcoming F1 2010 will be a treat in a serious sim. And I certainly wouldn't mind if a version of Nurburgring has landscape as good looking as Red Dead Redemption.
I still don't see things being a lot different though, the sim racing market is as developed as it is, maybe 40 years later it will be a nostalgic experience when all internal combustion engine will be banned?
I hope iRacing does set a trend. The profit margins are so tiny in sim development that it's no wonder so many suffer from gross under-development. I am not one to criticise how LFS runs itself but it's pricing model is seriously out-dated in the current market. Fixing a set future price without taking into consideration inflation isn't wholly smart business.
If you want sims to develop and improve then prices will go up. It's selfish to call iRacing and alike rip-off merchants (whereas £1.20 a litre of fuel really IS a rip-off). They are not our slaves. They provide a stonkingly good product and it's up to them how much they profit. Without profit there are no businesses.
Having been lucky enough to delve in and understand behind the scenes of a sim in development I think prices are way too low currently and most new PC sims will have to adopt a similar model to the iRacing pricing strategy. They will have to change if we want to see continual sim development.
Don't forget that unlike you there are still a few people left in sim racing (or on this Earth) who are selfless and not completely motivated by profit. These people include the LFS devs.
And well I'll always hold a grudge against David Kaemmer and John W.Henry (even if Dave was also the man behind GPL) for the way they destroyed N2003's modding community through lawsuits against minor people who were producing mods for no profit at all for a sim that wasn't even on sale anymore, bastards.
iRacing is hardly more amazing than N2003 or even GPL anyway (making it not very good value for money), sims which are its ancestors. iracing is essentially a development of N2003 with some more toys, many of which could've been developed free to a high standard by N2003 modding teams, but that was all rather abruptly killed off, no doubt deliberately so, because thats bad business for the iRacing gang if they want to put lipstick on a pig and sell it off as a new very expensive sim. :rolleyes:
I think its more a case of publishers pushing developers to finish a sim before a deadline (usually something like the christmas period, after all its all about profit to the publishers) that results in sims often being underdeveloped.
And so its all lovely setting up a commercially available racing sim to make profit, but a good business model wont magically make a sim better, especially if most of those involved are interested in lining their pockets rather than racing. What is really needed developers with the knowledge and passion having total control, not businessmen making deadlines and maximising profit. This is why LFS with its 'out of date' business model is one of the most stable, polished and realistic sims available, and its a personal project, not one intended to fill someone's pockets, you seem to have trouble getting your head round this concept.
And on LFS's slow pace of development, this is the result of having a such a small team of developers and discouraging modding, GPL gives us an idea of what is possible if a sim can grow a modding community; it has been transformed and drastically improved and all for not a penny, the developer's of mods may have to spend some cash, but thats not the point, their minds are not full of personal gain and business models.
Would you care to divulge which sim in development you were behind the scenes one and which you base your opinion on? You always seem to very conveniantly have expertise or secret knowledge in whichever subject is being discussed. :rolleyes:
I actually was hunting for some news of that for a while, there's word of a Beta release in winter 2010, local kart track closed really made me starving for some action.
I think the next big thing will be getting some kind of motion simulation out to the mass market. That's really the biggest disconnect between sims and real life, so naturally it should be the largest place to innovate.
One of these days I'll get to try a big motion simulator. But for now all I can do is hope someone makes an affordable model at some point.
You don't have to be completely motivated by profit, I did not say this. However for a business to grow, evolve, and improve there has to be a decent on-going flow of revenue. I have never complained about LFS's rate of development. This sim can do what it wants but from a business and overall future of sims perspective (as this thread is about) it's out-of-date and it is getting caught by other simulation developments. If S3 comes in at £12 the devs are shooting themselves in the foot for example because £12 is worth a lot less now than it was when LFS started.
And if LFS isn't motivated by business/profit please explain the BMW F1 INtel thing, the Scirroco and the Rockingham track as well as other purely 'profit making' ventures that LFS has got involved in in recent years??? These 'nasty evil soulless profit making ventures' are probably what has kept LFS afloat!
LFS isn't some 'people's sim' that you try and make out. Behind the scenes there is a core business trying to make money, and don't forget there are mouths to feed.
In general the sales in simulations are so low that for there to be a continual flow of updates and improvements the price will be high. It's a highly niche and technical business after all. Subscription based payment is the only way to achieve this on a consistent and reliable basis. You can't expect people to be slaves to our hobby. You wouldn't walk into a 3* Michelin resturant and complain the prices are too high would you? I don't begrudge spending money on things that are outstanding. But of course you can't over-price something, but ffs don't try and under-price something because you think you're doing it 'for the people'. That's just business suicide.
5Haz you seem to get confused. You think someone passionate about something and good can't also be a businessman. It appears you think you're either one or the other. Just because someone is good at doing business doesn't mean they are a brain dead profit-driven entity? These things aren't mutually exclusive. You can be motivated by profit while maintaining insanely high standards.
Anyway, in general the next real big development for sim racing will be affordable motion platforms. Then from there I do not know
There will be one game. It will have every vehicle. Ever. It will model everything. All data will be correct. It will be available in every language. On every plaform. All will be online compatible. There will be one game world. It will have every track. That every has been, is, or will be. Every town, city, road, river, everything. All there. Drive from track to track. Take boats across the ocean. Run pedestrians over. Get out on foot and sit in the grandstands. Or walk to the hot dog stand, steal some food, get chased by the guards, take them out with your machette, then take out the TV helicopter with the rocket launcher you stole from the army barracks a day before, before stealing a rally car and completing the Paris-Dakar rally. Awesome sauce.
