Urgh. It shouldn't matter to YOU what YOU think makes SENSE! They are trying to tell people what they can't wear. WHAT you can't wear is arbitrary. This year it's burkas, next year it should be baseball caps, the year after it could be T-Shirts with anti-government slogans. The principle is much more important than the actuality, IMO. It may not be racism, but it certainly sounds like xenophobia.
Just because it's the majority doesn't make it right. Say you were living in a country where 99% of the people were Christians. Is it right to force people to put up Christmas trees in their houses at Christmas time just because 99% of the population is Christian?
I try to say that a baseball cap is not something you wear all the time, and is not the main part of your clothing, like a pair of pants, and a burka is, so there is a difference.
But there are some things that you don't got with a burka, like eye contact, this is nearly impossible, and one of the main things used in human contact. Talking, is like muffled with the burka's, which can make it quite hard to have a discussion. Also I think it's against woman rights, especially in these europian countries, most of them are forced to wear these things, sure there are some that wear them voluntary, but I don't see any reason why...
Isn't that everywhere around you? Not like you say it, like you are forced to have a christmas tree. But think about things like tax, I believe people once voted for this, and most of them agreed, and we are now forced to pay them, but we just grow up with this, and take it for granted, sure it's for a good purpose, paying tax, but I think it's the same thing, you are forced to do it, because the majority voted for it.
Also I'd like to see some others that voted No, like me, because I seem to be the only one, which is kinda weak, if you vote No.
What kind of a difference? It's a part of clothing, how often you wear it does make no damn difference.
Well, you certainly don't feel uncomfortable talking with us on the forum and I don't think we have much of a eye contact here. The speech may be a bit obscured, but is that really a reason to BAN burkas?
Muslim traditions have nothing to do with this, or do you think what fighting some law with another one is a good idea?
It's called democracy. Democracy is about adjusting the ways things are done in favor of the majority. What it is not about is suppressing the minorities. Taxes are a different thing because they make the state work, with no taxes the state treasury would run dry and we all know what happens when it does (Greek or Argentina anyone?)
Burkas on the other hand are a nice demonstation of dictatorship. Banning them won't help the citizens but solely the people who run the state.
Taxes are necessary for running a democratic, capitalist country though. How else would the state pay for hospitals, schools, police force etc? Are you saying there's no difference between forcing citizens to pay tax and forcing citizens to not wear certain items of clothing or to put up Christmas trees/
Yeah I know what taxes are for, it was a bad example. But I think you should adjust to the way WE live here. Here too is no eye contact, but that's different. In real life, you don't message someone when he/she is next to you, do you? I think it's old-fashion, not in the way like literary fashion, but this whole religion thing is just not from this time anymore IMO.
That's not really your place to decide, how others live their lives. I think all religions are pretty messed up in both their practices and beliefs, but I'm not about to go to war over it, especially since the propensity for religious fanatics to go to war over their beliefs is one of my biggest issues with religion.
That's a really terrible viewpoint you've got there, and sadly it's too common. It's indefensible to say it's OK to ban something because it makes you feel uncomfortable or because you don't like it. Additionally, my views on religion are pretty well known (I'm an atheist and very anti-religion), but I still think removing freedoms from a group because of religion (which is largely what the 'burka ban' is about) should not be allowed.
Who are you to say my viewpoint is terrible? (sure much agree with you) Who am I to say yours is? You can't say what viewpoint is right or wrong IMO, it's just a big difference in opinions. I try to explain mine, although I fail, and you tell yours.
For me it's clear that this law project is just part of the current governement's plan to artificially promote "safety" as nowadays' greatest concern. Medias and politics make such a big fuss about it for such a small issue: according to some studies, there are only a few thousands of women wearing burkas in France out of 63.000.000 inhabitants. The sad part is that people just jump in the wagon: there was only around 30/40% of the people for burka's ban 18 months ago, now there are between 60 and 70% according to most studies.
I don't want to trust that the ban would help women to get rid of their husband's domination. Most of the women made the choice on their own, as most of them aren't even native muslims. And the few that wear burka because their husband want so will most probably carry on wearing burka and pay the fine if they get caught... or just stay home if police is able to make a strong enough control to apply this law, but I don't think they are.
Personnally I just don't care much about this. People should rather care about nowadays' important concerns instead of creating new ones on their own.
I'm not bothered at all about people wearing these kind of things, but I think there need to be certain circumstances where they would need to take it off so there face can be revealed.
For example, Bikers can NOT enter a bank or a store/mall (Including many other places) with a helmet on. If they do, they are instantly asked to remove it before going any further. Obviously, this is so they can be identified in CCTV if they were to commit a robbery or other criminal activity. However, I have seen plenty of Woman (Or Men! Who knows. You cannot see any sort of shape under those things!) with these "burkas" on, and yet they are not told to remove it.
I can totally understand that it may be part of there Religion to never remove these things in Public, but frankly, when I see them kicking off at Airports and other places when being asked to remove them for Identity reasons, then they should either remove it or stop crying and bloody go home.
I don't think a full non-tolerance ban of the Burkas should be brought to the UK, but I would like to see some sort of Ban in certain areas, as mentioned above.
Random fact of the Day. Did you know a short while ago, a wanted man in the UK managed to get through Airport security and onto a plane (Subsequently fleeing the UK...) using just his Wifes Burka and Passport?
I intentionally omitted a "don't care" option because I'm not at all interested in people with no opinions. The only thing worse than a 'wrong' opinion is no opinion at all.
There was husband's domination mentioned. I would like to bring some light to reasons why muslim women cover their body and sometimes also the face. It's not so about an oppression nor domination:
After reading this Quranic verse I believe it should be acceptable for muslims living in the, we can say, Christian part of the world, to try for a compromise and leave the face clear. (wearing niqab instead of burka, for example)
I am asked to wear long pants or leave my shoes out when entering sacral places in many cultures, and I honestly never thought about demanding to change this rule. I understand that I am entering a different world and it was my self-determination to go there, so I am as ready to adjust as I am looking forward to taste foreign kitchen in foreign countries.
While western culture tries to know and understand muslim reasons, muslim could try to make some step forward too, instead of this die-hard "hell no"...
If I want to go down to the local shopping centre wearing bondage straps, a ski mask, and brandishing a chainsaw, I should have the right to do so. If I uncover the chainsaw, start it up, and begin hacking limbs off pensioners, then somebody should take action but not before.
Didn't know the NHS was capitalistic! That's new to me! lol You are right though. Being forced to pay tax and forcing citizens to dress in a certain way are not two very different things.
Beliefs or not, To anyone outside the religion its just as intimidating as having people walking down the street wearing full face sas balaclavas or people going into banks with crash helmets on...
The same women that would try and save the burkas would run to the police crying after getting slapped about by their husbands for not doing what they are told even tho their religion says thats ok to happen...
