Quote from kimd41 :

But they can make a short public TO-DO list. That would show things that are left to be done and we could just send people asking to it....

No they can't as Scawen has explained.

The devs discovered years ago that if they release any details (like a list) of features in development, and then for whatever reason, cancel or change one or more items on the list, all hell breaks loose!
All the forum whiners start kicking off... kiddy idiots throw their toys out of their prams threatening to leave LFS... fools start claiming that they were promised xyz feature that has now been canceled and that the devs are amateurs and LFS will die as a result...

So the result is that intended features are not made public until they are released. If this rule is broken, it is usually for very good reasons e.g. the VWS (and look what ammount of crap that announcement has caused the devs - which just goes to prove them right in not releasing info).

So just wait for the release (or don't - like anyone cares).
And any time you get annoyed about not having info about upcoming LFS features, blame the damn whiners and the idiot complainers on the forum - it's them that caused the present low level of info.

cheers

Col

Stop whining, S3 is here and I got it.

Proof is in my attatched screenshot.


I did have to jump in the time travel machine to 2014.

Quote from rockclan :

Stop whining, S3 is here and I got it.

Proof is in my attatched screenshot.


I did have to jump in the time travel machine to 2014.

Just badly shopped

Quote from rockclan :

Stop whining, S3 is here and I got it.

Proof is in my attatched screenshot.

Can you post the download-link? Because for some reason, the developers do not want to post it.

Quote from Martin Deutschland :

Can you post the download-link? Because for some reason, the developers do not want to post it.

www.inmydream.com

Quote from kimd41 :

If I'm not mistaken they once said that they can't do these kind of blogs because theres really nothing to report so much, it's just physics.


But they can make a short public TO-DO list. That would show things that are left to be done and we could just send people asking to it. Example:

- AI driver improvements - Completed
- Limited setup system - Completed
- Finish the VW Scirocco - Completed
- Finish Rockingham - Completed
- Tyre heating and cooling - In progress
- Suspension updates - Not yet started
- VW stability control - Not yet started
- General bug fixes - Not yet started
- Release to private testing - Not yet started
- Public TEST release - Not yet started
- Public official release - Not yet started

THIS LIST IS AN EXAMPLE AND DOES NOT REPRESENT THE DEVELOPMENT ROAD OR STATUS IN ANY WAY.

That would only start new threads/moanings that the finished content has not been released yet and why scawen cannot quickly make a patch just for one feature and release it ^^

If you think about it, Scawen gives us progress reports
And just to make you happy here is the last official Scawen's progress report:
- AI driver improvements - Completed (3 week of work)
- Tyre physics - In progress (should be nearly done)
- VW stability control - Not yet started (should be easy)
- Suspension updates - Not yet started (should be easy, might be hard)
- Limited setup system - Not yet started (should be easy)

Where there is really laking news is about new content. But that's not Scawen's job it's Eric's job ^^
I think I can speak for league organizers qhen I say it would be very pratical to know which car(s?) is going to be added in LFS S3 so I know what to exept.

So when are we goint to get the ai update? We dont want to wait until tyres are finished to get better ai!

:something

Who cares about AI, do you think racing AI is going to make you a better driver or better in leagues?

Real drivers are unpredictable and make mistakes etc which can cause you to react in different ways, I don't think any AI can replicate that, now matter how complex the AI system may be.

Quote from AMB :

Who cares about AI, do you think racing AI is going to make you a better driver or better in leagues?

When I was very new to LFS I got alot of bans telling me I should practise offline with AI before going online, since I sucked that bad.

Yeah, but that may of been because you couldn't control the car properly or something, AI can't teach you that, only practice can and understanding the car, since most have different ways of driving them, the only way to learn real race craft is to race with people that are just clean drivers, I don't think it matters too much if your slower than them, just as long as you know how much room to leave people and where to pass and where not to pass, AI won't be able to tell things like this.

Also consistency can only be taught by doing constant laps over laps.

all AI does is ram you hard, not caring about you,and just stay on the frikkin green line,thats it.

Quote from zeugnimod :

Because the devs don't want to work that way!

bwahaha, i love the assumption that work is actually being done.

its racing legends aka west brothers all over again.
it was a great idea but its now pretty obvious they are in over there heads and can't or are not capable of taking this to the next level to keep up with other sims that are already far better.
two months away from this thread being a year old and still no scirocco.
my daughter wasnt even crawling when it was announced, now she has her own little car she speeds around the house in, i'm sure i'll be buying her a real one before we see a release.

Quote from col :

No they can't as Scawen has explained.

The devs discovered years ago that if they release any details (like a list) of features in development, and then for whatever reason, cancel or change one or more items on the list, all hell breaks loose!
All the forum whiners start kicking off... kiddy idiots throw their toys out of their prams threatening to leave LFS... fools start claiming that they were promised xyz feature that has now been canceled and that the devs are amateurs and LFS will die as a result...

Isn't that the case now? Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

The truth is that LFS is an indie experiment. It's an escape from the conventional big corporate development paradigm. The devs have no boss to answer to or deadlines to meet in a practical sense. But with independence comes the challenge of on going self-motivation, discipline and planning. Without physical and visible progress there's no sellable product, no revenue and no future for LFS.

Scawen has admitted motivation is an issue. Dismissing the community is a big mistake and counter productive to this motivation issue. Maintaining community enthusiasm is key to boosting motivation and getting praise for hard efforts is an obvious example.

The ball is firmly in the devs hands. They need to make a decision to embrace the ways that made LFS the success it was circa 2006, or take the risk that masses will wait and buy S3 when/if it reaches that milestone.

Wow, you guys are still talking about this ? Feels like we've
been going round for ages on this. Go outside, play sports,
meet girls, i dunno. This is pointless imo.

LFS will always have a special place for me no matter. If
we get more, the better. It is already good value and the
community is still alive after 8 years. If you wanna vent,
play the first Black and White, find Scawen and do what
you want to/with him.

Quote from Fonnybone :

Wow, you guys are still talking about this ? Feels like we've
been going round for ages on this. Go outside, play sports,
meet girls, i dunno. This is pointless imo.

LFS will always have a special place for me no matter. If
we get more, the better. It is already good value and the
community is still alive after 8 years. If you wanna vent,
play the first Black and White, find Scawen and do what
you want to/with him.

no matter what you talk because this thread is magnetism. I tried to quit this thread but I am also whining and shining on here.

Without any success... all whiners etc. could write completly new LFS with tons of words written about this. Just reorder some characters and compile it, lol.

Btw i would like to see complete stats about words used in this topic... "879846x Scirocco, 798463x S3, 765478x developers..."

Quote from Raito :

Without any success... all whiners etc. could write completly new LFS with tons of words written about this. Just reorder some characters and compile it, lol.

Btw i would like to see complete stats about words used in this topic... "879846x Scirocco, 798463x S3, 765478x developers..."

You forgot VWS and Rockingham and Tyre and Physics and other stuff

Quote from AMB :

Who cares about AI, do you think racing AI is going to make you a better driver or better in leagues?

Real drivers are unpredictable and make mistakes etc which can cause you to react in different ways, I don't think any AI can replicate that, now matter how complex the AI system may be.

I just wanted to "prove" my second-last post ;p

Quote from obzelite :

bwahaha, i love the assumption that work is actually being done.

Actually, it's very obvious that work is actually being done (just, slowly). The 'bwahaha' is on you here.

Quote from obzelite :

my daughter wasnt even crawling when it was announced, now she has her own little car she speeds around the house in, i'm sure i'll be buying her a real one before we see a release.

My daughter wasn't even born, and we've conceived a second child since the announcement (true!). All this means nought except that, it's taking a long time... Everyone already knew that, but thanks for reminding us again.

Is that Eddie Jordan in your avatar?

Sorry for off topic....

What's actually going on here isn't about the rate of progress or xyz feature, although that does add fuel to the fire. What this is really about is the fact that Scawen has become an unwilling celebrity. If you watch this thread it goes something like this;
Fans: Random murmurings for a while
Fans: "Scawen, what's going on?!?!?!??!!" (Or other offensive/rumour-mongering forcing Scawen to respond)
Scawen: "Still working away, nothing worth announcing, I don't want to have to update you guys all the time."
Fans: "Yay, thanks Scawen, it's good to hear from you."
And everybody is happy for a few weeks then the whole process starts all over again.

Seriously, people were anticipating Scawen's 4000th post. People start rumours about him not liking his work or abandoning LFS.

Scawen is an engineer who just wants to get his work done, and I can relate to that. He doesn't want to feel like he has to answer to or appease the community. Perhaps, if he looked at it from the perspective that he is a celebrity in the sim world and that his celebrity status adds value to the LFS brand, he might be more willing to promote a closer relationship between him and the community.

Or not, it's his call.

Quote from DevilDare :

Is that Eddie Jordan in your avatar? .

Close, it's Elliot Goblet.
Perhaps the bastard child of Eddie Jordan and Gordon Freeman?

OT - I agree with the above post. People saying development has stopped are really accusing Scawen of being a liar, and deceiving the community, presumably to make a buck for nothing.

This something I strongly believe is not true, and is no doubt pretty offensive.

Quote from farcar :

Actually, it's very obvious that work is actually being done (just, slowly).

The only thing obvious is the claim progress is being made. There's no substance to back that up, unless you are a beta tester or a secret dev, which we all highly doubt.

If they release video/ pictures, or heaven forbid a (test) release, then you've got something. Other than that, you're really just basing you judgement on a few rare words from Scawen and Vic. Eric is MIA on this forum.

Quote from farcar :

The 'bwahaha' is on you here.

Really?

Quote from Macfox :

The only thing obvious is the claim progress is being made. There's no substance to back that up

I think Scawen's character has substance, and I belive him when he says he's still developing the game. You're appear think he's deceiving the community by claiming to develop when he's actually sitting on his arse doing nothing. I don't believe this is the case.

Quote :

unless you are a beta tester or a secret dev, which we all highly doubt.

I'm not a tester or a secret anything. I've never claimed to be either, so I'm not sure what you (and everyone you claim to speak for) are dubious about.

Quote :

Eric is MIA on this forum.

He's not missing. He was never her in the first place, with one exception which someone will probably regurgitate shortly...

Quote :

Really?

Yep: bwahaha