Hi,
i couldnt find anything about this so hopefully this isnt a repost, and im not 100% sure about this but here goes.
I noticed that while driving a real rwd car with an open diff that when the inside wheel is spinning it makes quite a bit of tyre screeching noise - much more than the outside wheel, and when i recreated this in lfs with the xrt, i can have the inside while spinning to the point where it makes smoke and it is still making hardly any noise at all, if any, whereas the inside wheel is making plenty of noise, but any other time either of the wheels have lost traction they seem to make the right sounds. This seems to happen at any speed as well. So is this a bug or is there another reason for this?

I think sound generation is still to be optimised fully. I think the Devs ethos with sound is to generate it at source rather than just play generic wav's to veover any eventuality.

The simulation side of LFS wants to giver the driver as much aural info as possible as you would get in RL, but I think it's actually quite difficult to code in all the sound q's and continous sound updates. Give the devs a bit longer and you might get more of an accurate sound coming from your situation.

nope i have actually investigated this, its to do with weighting of the car.

i always wondered why in an rb4 it will screech upon accelerating quickly forwards, however when reversing quickly it doesnt?

its because the power is usually split more to the rear wheels.. and they have less weight when the car fires into reverse motion. so i split the power so the front wheels had more, and surprise surprise, they screeched when i dropped the clutch in reverse. cuz they're weighted!

accelerating in a front wheel car still shifts weight to the back.. thats why the fronts dont screech. its not realistic but thats the reasoning i could find behind lfs doing that.

so in an open diff car, the inside wheel is unweighted quite alot in the turn.. so hence when it spins up, lfs doesnt add the screech.. but it should!!!

Great point Takumi.. And that thing is even more annoying in fwd cars.

Well done research. This also happens when you lock up an inside wheel while braking into a turn. The wheel isn't loaded much and thus gives no sound. That's why I always have to look in my mirror to see wether I'm locking up a tyre. Quite strange.
I'm partially posting this message so the thread stays on top and the devs notice that this is important.

Vain

You see your wheels in the rear view mirror? I don't, how come?

Quote from sgt.flippy :

You see your wheels in the rear view mirror? I don't, how come?

i think he means he can see the smoke

It also vastly depends on the type of surface you're driving on IRL. In the situations described, it's not that there is no sound at all - there is some slight chirps and the scrubbing sound generated in LFS.

That's not always "unrealistic" TBH. It could be tweaked, it totally depends on the amount of slip and the weight in real life too. I can light up my inside front going around a corner and all I get sometimes is major "scrubbing" (although even that sounds "stickier" and more violent than in LFS ATM).

If the pavement is rough IRL you don't seem to get nearly as much screeching. The smoother the pavement the more screeching seems to occur. Yesterday I was a bit surprized when lighting up the PT's front tires I got screech all the way through first gear, which isn't that common. Honestly, I usually get more scrubbing sound with quite a lot of chirps all the way through first.

An unweighted wheel should ALWAYS be LESS dire sounding under conditions where traction is broken. Maybe it's more exaggerated than it should be in LFS, but I think the surface makes a huge difference as to what is "correct" under those conditions.

EDIT: Infact, come to think of it, I've witnessed MANY times rapidly spinning tires on both FWD and RWD cars where there wasn't a lot of "screech" but more of a scraping / rubbing / (hey - are those words where "scrubbing" comes from? ) sound. I'm sure there's a plethora of videos one could dig up.

Quote from Ball Bearing Turbo :

It also vastly depends on the type of surface you're driving on IRL.

Agreed absolutely. Anyone who has ever driven around a smooth-concrete-surfaced multi-storey car park will understand this.

Quote from Ball Bearing Turbo :

An unweighted wheel should ALWAYS be LESS dire sounding under conditions where traction is broken. Maybe it's more exaggerated than it should be in LFS, but I think the surface makes a huge difference as to what is "correct" under those conditions.

yeah this is what i think its like also. however i think it is exaggerated quite alot. if i take the UF1 out into autocross and start turning in circles fairly sharp, i can wind her upto 4th gear while technically only doing about 30kph, but the inside front is spinning at some 150kph. under that circumstance i would imagine quite alot of screeching would be present, even if the tyre had no weighting on it and was merely touching the road surface, i would think there would be an actual screech as opposed to just scrubbing sounds

Well...

Hard to say, if there is so little weight on the tire that a car with as much power as the UF1000 can spin a tire 120KM/H faster than the vechicle speed, then who knows. It's obviously barely touching the ground...

"Screeching", surface aside, would likely only occur if there is enough friction to cause it, (edit: possibly even never on some pavement?) and under the conditions you describe (esp top gear where there is NO torque at the wheels hehe) it just might not happen IRL either.... Unless as pointed out, you're in a smooth as glass parkade...

Not sure, maybe Todd has some ideas. He's the tiremaster

Are you really proposing that a tyre that leaves a big black skidmark won't make a sound at all? There's enough friction to rip a noticable flatspot into the tyre surface (which is quite extrem in LFS, more than in real life) and you argue that there isn't enough friction to produce any sound louder than the roling-sound of the tyre?
Sorry to make my point that clear, but LFS's behaviour is obviously exagerated.

Vain

Quote :

Are you really proposing that a tyre that leaves a big black skidmark won't make a sound at all?

...?
No, I never said that at all, actually, and I was just as clear as you

I said the sound generated is not always a "screeching" sound IRL; sometimes it has other characteristics, which is true.

I think that the scrubbing sound in LFS needs to be able to be kicked up a few more notches in severity and in character in the right situations... Like the ones described in this thread.

Why on earth would I state that an overexerted tire makes no sound at all IRL? :nut:

In fact the sound IS there in LFS, and likely the "correct" sound for most pavement under those conditions. That "correct" sound could probably just be enhanced a bit, but making it sound like the loaded tires ("screeching") is not necessarily the answer.

I'm not sure a "correct" sound is a good idea, either. As was mentioned, depending on the situation, the lighter/driven/spinning tire is liable to make any number of noises. In our sim, it would be more handy to use a seperate sound for each different type of action and simply change the intensity (level) for how far away from optimum grip the tire is. The reason for using fixed sounds is because it will help us localize exactly which wheel is doing what. So something like:

• Scrub sound - Generally a tire that's on it's way up to, or down from, the limit.
  
• Screach sound - A tire that's over the limit.
  
• Chirp sound - A tire that's spinning at a different speed than the rest. (Positive or negative.)
  
• Lower frequency - Rear tires.
  
• Higher frequency - Front tires.

Sure, it may not be an exact audio simulation. But neither is LFS an exact driving simulation, in that, we can't feel anything through our asses. I'm thinking that the illusion our brains create for us (I really can "feel" my car in LFS.) would be easier to achieve with a simple set of cues. Something our brain latches onto quickly and consistently translates to important viscera. Too real and we lose track of what's going on with the car.

I will invariably feel that more "correct" is the better route for LFS to take, in terms of world recreation (physics, audio, graphics).