Quote from Matrixi :

Cops and robbers is NOT racing. PERIOD.

Pointless thread.

Did I just say something?

It isn't about cops and robbers isn't racing... But it's how S2 licensed people behave, and I must say, there are some real annoying people out there that really don't know how to behave. Even in racing you come across these people, just the other day, I was clearly faster than the guy in front of me, I kept pulling up to him at every corner, and when there was a long straight I wanted to pass him, I was already next to him, on the straight, and he just pushes me off the track... I don't know how it was before S2, but it does seem people need to rethink about what they're doing.

And btw, Matrixi, drifting isn't racing either, I'm not going for a discussion of is it pointless or not, but it's a fact that it isn't racing (racing being something where you try to be as fast as possible). So when you're drifting, wich I think you do on LFS, do you like it if somebody comes in and destroys what you're doing? No matter what you are doing, nobody would like to be bothered in this kind of way.

God I love pointless polls.

You meet idiots and d!ckheads everywhere IRL, so it's no surprise you find them in LFS servers.
Online there are basically no consequences for ruining someone else's fun (like wrecking your own car, getting arrested, dying in a crash or getting your stupid head smashed in by an irate driver, for example), so for some halfwits it's paradise. Best thing to do is go and race somewhere else.

Come on - as if you have any right to expect decent driving or mature behaviour on a Cops & Robbers server - the very name suggests 10-year olds racing around a cul-de-sac on their bicycles shouting "bang! I got you!" until their mums yell at them to shut up and come inside for some cocoa

[SadOldGitMode] I didn't even know there were such servers! [/SadOldGitMode]

Quote from S14 DRIFT :

When I left to help water the garden ( ), I returned to find my FZ50, which I had purpefully parked in the top corner of the map

Well if we're discussing attitudes of S2 licensed racers, one would have thought that common courtesy to others on the server means you do not leave your car idling somewhere when you're away for half an hour. There is a spectate mode for a reason.

Quote from S14 DRIFT :

EDIT : Rethinking, I think that like in GT4 and the like, you have licence tests. You should me forced to complete sections of the training before you can use that paticualar car. I have done all but 2 tests an that took me about 2 - 2 1/2 hours, so not forever. I do believ this has made me a better driver in LFS, and more aware as a cause. If people are made to do this, it will teach them the ropes, and how to be a more observant and thoughtfull.

It depends on the sort of tests.

The current ones involve passing AIs, which is not an indication of real ability.

The tests only gauge a driver's speed, which doesn't matter. What does matter is

• Not wrecking
• Obeying blue flags i.e. Letting through next corner possible
• Being civilised generally
• etc. etc.
  
  
  
  
  

Now, when can the licence tests do that

Quote from sgt.flippy :

It isn't about cops and robbers isn't racing... But it's how S2 licensed people behave, and I must say, there are some real annoying people out there that really don't know how to behave.

There will always be idiots hanging around no matter what game you are playing online. The thing you are forgetting is that the people who are the ones wrecking and crashing don't most likely read these forums, so whining here about it rarely makes a big difference. If you have encountered a wrecker, let the admin of the server know about him. A replay of the wrecker never hurts.

Quote from sgt.flippy :

I don't know how it was before S2, but it does seem people need to rethink about what they're doing.

There has always been wreckers as I said in the upper section of the post, the fact is LFS is getting more popular and more idiots join along to mess up everything for the honest racers.

Quote from sgt.flippy :

And btw, Matrixi, drifting isn't racing either

Where did I claim it to be racing? Or where did I talk about drifting in this thread in the first place?

Quote from sgt.flippy :

I'm not going for a discussion of is it pointless or not, but it's a fact that it isn't racing (racing being something where you try to be as fast as possible). So when you're drifting, wich I think you do on LFS, do you like it if somebody comes in and destroys what you're doing? No matter what you are doing, nobody would like to be bothered in this kind of way.

Well TBH, wreckers are pretty much non-existant in the proper drift servers. I think I have seen two or three dedicated wreckers around during the last 12 months. Sometimes there are however just irresponsible people who stop in the middle of the road just to spectate someone, and cause a bit of havoc. Those inviduals will however be warned and kicked out, if they will not learn their lesson, a ban will be put on them.

I understand where you are coming from and what your point is, I just don't consider CNR fooling around as racing of any sort and that is what my post was stating. As it seems S14 DRIFT had parked his car on the track and went AFK, which is wrong at any case. When you go AFK you're supposed to spectate or preferrably, leave the server to open a slot for other players. Can you honestly say that you are surprised to find your car wrecked when you park it in a CNR server and go AFK?

What LFS needs is a big cup of maturity.

Agreed - if you're not racing or spectating you shouldn't be in a server. Returning to find your car totalled could have easily been prevented by not leaving it there while you left to do something else. Even IRL there are signs in car parks which say "park here at your own risk", so you really shouldn't expect people on a non-race server to leave an unattended car alone

I've never been quoted this much in my entire life

About drifting not being racing, and you never claimed it to be... I don't want to re-read the thread, but when did someone say CNR was racing?

I do agree on most of your points, I just tried to claim that there are people who shouldn't be out there, and other than in the real world, here you can do something about it. I'm not whining at those people, I know it solves nothing talking about them here... If I really wanted to complain about someobody it would be a name & shame kinda thingy, wich nobody is doing here. It's just in general how people are... But if I look at how people younger than me (12-14 year olds) behave, I must say the whole world is rotting apart But I bet people that were my age a while ago thought the same thing about me

Quote from sgt.flippy :

... But if I look at how people younger than me (12-14 year olds) behave, I must say the whole world is rotting apart But I bet people that were my age a while ago thought the same thing about me

To be fair, I'd like to add a word of support for several members of that age group. Over the last few years I can admit that I have been pleasantly suprised to see some 12-14 year olds stick with the LFS community, growing and thriving, becoming good racers or good artists or even good mates. Ok, a certain level of immaturity (or to be fair - a lack of maturity) can be granted in this age group, but many have shown strong character and continue to contribute to our community on a daily basis. The seeds of the next generation of sim racers were planted with these kids, now they are young adults. I think that even though it is ok to generalise, we must be aware not to stereotype this age group lest we miss the gems amongst the rocks.

It is great to see young people participating in serious and competitive online gaming like sim racing rather than some mindless shooting game. Some young people really do set a shining example for their peers in their behaviour and attitude online and we should recognise that.

Quote from sgt.flippy :

when did someone say CNR was racing?

Try carefully reading the topic of the thread and the first post after that.

To sum it up. Yes, there are wreckers and irresponsible drivers in the race servers, but they aren't too common (yet). The thread starter is angry because his car got wrecked in a CNR server, while being afk and he is saying that racers have a bad attitude these days. Most racers are responsible drivers and their attitude is fine.

uhm... I rest your case?

I think the fellow racers are great, there is no problem. I got a new wheel told them i would prob be shit and they said its ok. When i made misstakes like not getting out the way intime they understood. Most people help and send setups to help you.

Its not so much wreckers that get to me these days. I haven't seen one in months.

What pisses me off is complete ineptitude when it comes to driving. Hurtling into a corner at normal racing speed when you have a car beside you - basic logic says that you can't do that. I went on an Aston National GTR server earlier today (for lack of a better alternative) and people would crash in a straight line on the pit-straight. illepall

TBH, I think license prices should go up about 50-75%. That way inept people wouldn't buy the game.
Then again, this is a business and that would cause other problems...

Quote from Matrixi :

Try carefully reading the topic of the thread and the first post after that.

To sum it up. Yes, there are wreckers and irresponsible drivers in the race servers, but they aren't too common (yet). The thread starter is angry because his car got wrecked in a CNR server, while being afk and he is saying that racers have a bad attitude these days. Most racers are responsible drivers and their attitude is fine.

No. That is not true. Learn to read the entirity of my post. I was angered at that, but that was NOT the main reason. So re-read it again, and read it properly

most S2 owners are very well behaved and friendly... but some dont seem to understand how to drive without crashing. There are ways to minimize the risk of crashing while still applying pressure to the car you are fighting off or trying to pass... it all comes with experience but there are a few drivers out there that dont care much for a good clean race....

all you can really do is try to kindly suggest things or report them to moderators

Quote from duke_toaster :

The tests only gauge a driver's speed, which doesn't matter. What does matter is

• Not wrecking
  
• Obeying blue flags i.e. Letting through next corner possible
  
• Being civilised generally
  
• etc. etc.

I totally agree.

Whatever anyone says I believe the general quality of drivers in regards to the points above have fallen. There are still friends/names that play the game who you can trust, but too often now you feel like a race is in the lap of the gods.

The only option available is to make a set of rules appear before each race with a time lag, making sure they read them. Then server admins must start to get tough and ban, instead of trying to be politically correct. Warn, Remind, Ban.

The only people I've had real problems with are people who are fast, often WR pace with a huge number of miles in LFSW, don't normally post on the forum. These drivers seem completely unaware of the rules of racing, they weave and actually don't deny it and will explain at length how weaving is a legitimate tactic in racing. They also seem attracted to other cars, I've been fairly certain I've been deliberatley, but subtley elbowed off the track by them and they even seem to be able to take out backmarkers. The worst thing they do is to then accuse the inoccent party of hitting them, they also (pre-patch) used to love using the horn to state their right of way in the FOX and usually managed to get the other party kicked or banned because they were more experienced/fastest.

Quote from ajp71 :

The only people I've had real problems with are people who are fast, often WR pace with a huge number of miles in LFSW, don't normally post on the forum. These drivers seem completely unaware of the rules of racing...

I understand where you're coming from. I was racing on a packed FOX server the other night, with all the usual carnage that entails. Grid pileups, newbies spinning everywhere, people interlocking their wheels. But that's all part of the learning process of racing - people going slow or making beginners mistakes is to be expected.

The only thing that annoyed me was when I was battling to defend my position against a quicker guy. He got down the inside into a hairpin, and got the power down sooner so the position was clearly his. But he still felt the need to run as wide as possible on the exit of the corner and force me to either hit the brakes or run onto the grass. This guy was no beginner, he was one of the fastest on the server. It was no big deal and not even worth mentioning in-game. It just struck me as being rude / having too much attitude. I find that much more irritating than newbie-type mistakes or ignorance attributed to being new to LFS.

its so strange... just now a very fast driver somehow drifted over (on a straightaway)to tap a car behind him and then that car drifted over and hit me... it looked like he did it on purpose because he made a smileyface as it happened.

Quote from S14 DRIFT :

No. That is not true. Learn to read the entirity of my post. I was angered at that, but that was NOT the main reason. So re-read it again, and read it properly

I've read your post several times while trying to figure out yet another useless poll.

And yes, I rest my case.

Quote from ajp71 :

The only people I've had real problems with are people who are fast, often WR pace with a huge number of miles in LFSW, don't normally post on the forum. These drivers seem completely unaware of the rules of racing, they weave and actually don't deny it and will explain at length how weaving is a legitimate tactic in racing. They also seem attracted to other cars, I've been fairly certain I've been deliberatley, but subtley elbowed off the track by them and they even seem to be able to take out backmarkers.

Obviously your just talking about the formula racers here, so i cant comment as i dont do them for simple reasons like, i cant drive them and attracts to many peolpe trying to race the fast cars without learning the track or racing lines (not "the" racing line)

I find your post pretty offensive tbh , most fast racers with high milage are usually the best might not be the cleanest, but this is racing we are talking about , some corners are all about guts, and main reason they dont have 1,129,144 posts in the forum is because they are to busy racing.

Racing last night on Southcity in XRG/XFG with racers like
MinusDriver, three_jump, SparkyDave, Modoff, Palich, Bawbag, ACLRacer, JeeP, al heeley, Bob Smith, nikimere, Thommm, sidi, teaz-R, Vince, Knick

To mention a few check out the stats most have done quite a fair few miles, most are fast (not to sure about Vince or dave both pretty much noobs tbh ) . sure a few accidents, and some very hard racing, one thing that i find with racing a more experinced feild is respect for each other, without that , there is no trust and with no trust , well.. you turn cynical.

Racing fox,fo8,bf1 is a different discipline to most of the other vehicles, this is the point i think your trying to make. Just dont paint everyone with the same brush.

Quote from ajp71 :

The worst thing they do is to then accuse the inoccent party of hitting them, they also (pre-patch) used to love using the horn to state their right of way in the FOX and usually managed to get the other party kicked or banned because they were more experienced/fastest.

Again same thing i see with over 1000 posts you should know better.

Racing attitudes , keep them on the track , off the track, is time for reflection not finger pointing. No one is a perfect drver

Quote from Gener_AL (UK) :

Racing last night on Southcity in XRG/XFG with racers like
MinusDriver, three_jump, SparkyDave, Modoff, Palich, Bawbag, ACLRacer, JeeP, al heeley, Bob Smith, nikimere, Thommm, sidi, teaz-R, Vince, Knick

I know a good number of those drivers and as far as I remember they're all clean racers and likeable people.

No clue what you're going on about I was not branding all drivers with high mileage to be dirty, in fact I could probably count them on one hand but the thing is at least one of them seems to manage to show up without fail in every decent FOX server (I don't know why but it always seems to be in FOX servers and most often at the AS Club servers).

As to what my forum post count has to do with this I have no idea, except that I've now moved to 8th in the sadness ratings, still waiting for number 1 to point this out to me.

Quote :

and main reason they dont have 1,129,144 posts in the forum is because they are to busy racing.

Now you're just trying to get insulting. The main reason I'm hardly racing atm is because it's frustrating trying to race with a wheel that's held together with parcel tape

Quote from ajp71 :

The main reason I'm hardly racing atm is because it's frustrating trying to race with a wheel that's held together with parcel tape

LOL I'm on that bus too, except I prefer gaffer tape

Quote from ajp71 :

Now you're just trying to get insulting. The main reason I'm hardly racing atm is because it's frustrating trying to race with a wheel that's held together with parcel tape

Wasnt trying Anyhow i do know what you mean,sorry for biting but (couldnt help it). i think LFS has gone full cirlce a few times , influx of new + old etc. I still think even with the problems LFS encounters as it grows in popularity, the general feeling i get is that majority are clean and fair and are always improving, i think its always the case that it can take just 1 driver to ruin a race , no matter of his/her ability or experience.

Like most things in life, its what you make it. And im proud to say after more then 3 years playing LFS im still completely hooked, and this is mainly down to the attitude of gaming/racing i find in LFS :grouphug: . great place to be, even if sometimes its the wall/sand/dirt (bah)

I'll add my 2 cents in. My LFS playing time has gone WAY down from what it was a year ago. My main problem is that I cannot find any decent servers online. The top 5 or 10 hits EVERY TIME are all drift servers- usually mixed in with "jump" or "stunt" servers, and the other 10 or so in the top 20 are almost always FO8/F1 Ovals. So that leaves me with like 5 servers with a ping less than 350- already off to a bad start. Then I usually bounce between these 5 servers, (most of which dont have anybody there) and either get frustrated by other players or get bored and quit. The other day I got bitched out by someone using the BF1 on Blackwood Rally because I bumped into him slightly in the dirt section (since he was going thirty-five miles per hour and I was humming along at 80)- what the hell? Last I heard, slicks dont work too well on gravel! Then on another rally server at FB, I started winning a lot of races with the FZ, so of course some asshat starts using the FXR and rams me off the track in the first turn. So I make some comment like "nice driving ****" and what does he do? Votes to kick me off the server, and EVERYONE COMPLETES THE VOTES!!!! I have not been back online since. I dont know, maybe I need to join a league or something so I can actually race online and maybe learn a few things instead of worrying about what some fool is going to do. I KNOW I didnt have nearly as many problems like this a year ago.

Brendan