Well, killing your enemies is perfectly reasonable. By no means of reason you can deny that when killing of your enemies gives you more resources, more space and their property or you can get ransom for them it is not reasonable.
None of these were any reasonable at all, and occurred because of the same things the religion basically boils down to: not accepting other people's opinions/personal options/skin colors and wanting to forcefully put yours on top of theirs.
Unfortunaltely you have to force on other people opinion that killing them, robbing them or taking ransom is not acceptable. Because otherwise it is perfectly reasonable for them especially when they cant be paid back.
I love how stuff get's totaly thrown out of context etc. I mean for example the word original word that got translated with "hate" means something like "love less". Also the bible doesn't teach anything about hell
Edit: With that I don't mean that killing etc, was good. It's just that most christian religions don't do at all what the bible actually says.
if you have a little more than usual knowledge about the bible it gets easy to argue with fundamentalist I still say that that book can teach you a bit about moral and life, if you look at it in historic context and not just word for word
Anyways anyone who says genocide is reasonable war tactic needs can not be taken seriously. Blaming your problems to certain minority and then killing and torturing the said minority ffs is never reasonable.
Bring one reason (not moral reason) when it cant be paid back. In terms of reason - why not? I often deal with people who are not doing something just because of fear they will be paid back (and they do feeling lucky to be unpunished). The same goes with genocide or other crimes, sorry to say.
btw. I am pretty certain that if you could get ransom for kidnapping someone being sure you wont get caught... you surely will.
It has nothing to do with avoiding punishment. It is extremely common way of thinking and a political tool. When you are faced with problems you blame someone else. If that escalates you may end with nasty results.
Morality is tightly bonded with concept of good and evil and its a pretty good motivator itself.
In fact it was a cog in a war, germans believed they were treated unfair after first world war and this is what Hitler used to unite germany and gain support (going against unfair treatment is considered good).
Also nazi ideology as screwed as it was, was in "good faith".
Usa, Russia fought against nazi the great oppressor, the rapist of womans and killer of the children (Just look at the propaganda posters)
Japan I dont know exactly how it was justified from their side but I know for sure they were convinced that muricans are so evil, mothers often chose to jump from a cliff with their children, fighting for the caesar was also considered a good thing.
Moral justification was with people since the beginning, even americans till this day saying nuking japan was morally justified (That goes for any air strike in which innocent died ever conceived).
The urge to be good even when you do bad is pretty strong so taking out morals out of it seems unfair, you wont make people fight for you if you say something like "Ok people lets go rape some woman and kill some children"
And I didnt even come close to concepts of good and evil but I believe there is another LFS forum could be wrote if someone would decide to take a deeper look into it.
You cant label everyone as a bunch of psychopaths.
Morality doesn't equals fear of punishment.
Beside more than once I stood up for tortured animal (Which was unreasonable thing to do if not for morality and compassion) i helped older people to carry heavy stuff and return more than 10 wallets (I wouldn't get punished if I keep them no one would knew)
But here we again returning to human nature, you see morality, compassion, good and evil does not exist as universal values.
Those are just mechanisms developed to help us live and function in society, (Like altruism is you subconsciously realise you are not very productive you cant make any progress on your own so you aiding the ones who can)
And those mechanisms are pretty well reasonable because they were developed to aid us to live as a society.
You cant say (not moral reason) hinting that morals are not reasonable justification of an act, because morals are mechanisms that were created out of cold calculation and reasoning.
Morals, concept of good and evil is a soulless mechanism locked away in our subconsciousness aiding and guiding you from the dark, it hidden so well you cant see it and sometimes because of it you might question its usefulness but its there and its there for a reason, for very cold and soulless reason i might add (which is funny to say because saying that something is soulless its like saying that something lack some integral piece like it ever existed, but concept of soul and what it means to be human are born from misunderstanding of our true nature)
Anyway the topic is to broad to cover, my knowledge is too shallow and my english is just shit to even try to explain myself so I hope what I wrote above doesnt sound like blabling and make some sense (If it doesnt remember my english is shit)
I wonder to whom your post is addressed, I dont see here any "turds ripping this thread to bits".
And while this thread just like any other once in a while hit small derailment I dont see it as a good reason to get all personal.
Teen angst fuelled rant doesnt make you seem smarter or wittier or cooler or what ever you think it does.