Something to read and watch (might translate it later, now I have killer headache)
http://vremia.ua/rubrics/problemy/5124.php

http://gifakt.ru/archives/inde ... yj-proisxodil-na-majdane/
As for now its hard to tell whether the story is true but vids dont lie.

What's with these fake new accounts, ashamed to post from your own account?

Quote from Anonymous(almost) :

Something to read and watch (might translate it later, now I have killer headache)
http://vremia.ua/rubrics/problemy/5124.php

http://gifakt.ru/archives/inde ... yj-proisxodil-na-majdane/
As for now its hard to tell whether the story is true but vids dont lie.

And yet there are lots of vids when unarmed protesters are being hit very hard and even shot to death. Videos of beheaded bodies.

You can find videos and articles for both sides of view and state that they are true and the opposite is false.

Trying to find true information on the internet at the time of information war is pretty pointless.

There are always radical groups of people doing stupid things on both sides, but its not right to make an opinion about whole group of people they are part of.

The only true thing that should be done is stop escalating conflict, both social and international.

Thanks for taking the time to post Anon. People of the world are aware of whats going on despite the mass media biasness. I dare to say so because of the comment sections on the articles of western news sites, The Guardian (British) for one. Those ones that share your sentiments get most positive feedbacks. And that means a lot.

@ACCAkut
Couldn't find Radionov, either via google or http://rt.com/about-us/management/.

By the looks of things what follows next is drop of tensions, followed by elections and other political stuff, guarantee of safety for the civs by the new government and then russian soldiers returning home. Any deviations will result in same thing happening but taking longer time.

Quote from Boris Lozac :

What's with these fake new accounts, ashamed to post from your own account?

Try reading the second line on 08:18.

Quote from Anonymous(almost) :

You go with EU, its more perspectivistic but at the beginning, regular people are going into poverty.
You go with Russia, its more profitable at the start tho it pulls us away from EU and in long therm will not solve our problems.

What wonders me, is it necessary to be involved in some union to solve problems.

What if it make problems bigger and the people are not realizing it (I think thats the case with the EU crap)

Quote from Nilex :

@ACCAkut
Couldn't find Radionov, either via google or http://rt.com/about-us/management/.

It was Ruptley TV, not RT.com

Quote from RussianLFSer :

All of you (Balts) know nothing about Russia except deceitful propaganda from your government who are puppets of the EU/USA. You've destroyed your economy. The bullying by Russia is your paranoia and source of income.

Our economy (although with its share of problems) is doing better than Russian economy so...

Russia Today is a russian propaganda site aimed to the west. You might as well be reading Onion News. I know this because their stories about the Baltics have been absolute tilted drivel.

Unfortunately, I think Crimea is lost. It's pretty much in russian hands and Ukraine doesn't have the military power to reclaim it. I'm 100% sure that no other country will take any military action and whatever economic or diplomatic sanctions are imposed by the west will not deter Putin. History has shown that these won't last anyway (remember 2008 Georgian conflict where the sanctions imposed were lifted in the next couple of years). The best case scenario is that it stops there and Russia doesn't move on to other parts of Eastern Ukraine.

This annexation of Crimea sets a potentially very dangerous precedent for all the other countries neighbouring Russia. If they get away with spitting on all the international treaties and occupying part of a sovereign state then what's stopping them from trying it elsewhere under the false pretext of defending their people. There are large numbers of ethnic russians all over the former soviet states brought in as workers and military personnel and their families (which by the way violates Geneva convention treaty - "The Occupying Power shall not deport or transfer parts of its own civilian population into the territory it occupies.").

more fakes and false news are collected here (site a little overrun atm)

As a historical note, it's important to remember the following.
On 19 February 1954, the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the Soviet Union issued a decree transferring the Crimean Oblast from the RSFSR to the Ukrainian SSR. The transfer of the Crimean Oblast to Ukraine has been described as a "symbolic gesture," marking the 300th anniversary of Ukraine becoming a part of the Russian Empire. Following a referendum on 20 January 1991, the Crimean Oblast was upgraded to that of an Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic on 12 February 1991 by the Supreme Soviet of the Ukrainian SSR.
And it is still an autonomous parliamentary republic within Ukraine.

Here are a couple of articles that may help give those not involved a bit of mainly propoganda free information, thank you the alternative media.
http://rinf.com/alt-news/break ... rance-wilful-malevolence/
http://www.wnd.com/2014/03/ukr ... ssia/#gRwEg8mJ4duRgYxG.99

And this is from Pepe Escobar from Asian Times.
http://www.sott.net/article/27 ... NATOs-wet-dream-in-Crimea

Related text by Paul Craig Roberts (http://www.globalresearch.ca/author/paul-craig-roberts; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Craig_Roberts) on http://www.globalresearch.ca/about (independent research and media organization):
http://www.globalresearch.ca/w ... the-stage-for-war/5371695
Taking into account guy's pedigree and nationality I'd say is pretty interesting read to say the least. It is usually very valuable insight when a person with such high credentials speaks "against" it's own government. Text is on the weak side arguments wise, but true nonetheless.

Short thought about the amusing fake reporting photos: not wanting to go into details but only a reminder about propaganda. There are propagandas of propagandas. Very easy to create in these cases, and easier to avoid responsibility. Not aiming at a particular one posted here, but more like a general idea. Something to be aware of.

You may have noticed some relation between the first two paragraphs by the time you read this. The monumental difference is only one comes with a name and background, and consecutively, accountability.

Thanks Nilex, I hadn't seen this yet but Paul Craig Roberts is a very good source for actual information. For those in both the East and West, this article should be a 'must read'
http://www.globalresearch.ca/w ... the-stage-for-war/5371695
He even point's out some of the information I provided in earlier posts.

And given the latest from Yulia Tymoshenko calling for America to invade it's important for actual facts to make it into the public arena rather than the propoganda that's currently ruling the standard media. As an interesting point, who bankrolled her into power ?

According to some sources Russia threatened to unleash attack if Ukraine does not lay down their weapons by morning... and not sure if its true, but according to this U.S. nuclear aircraft carrier is moving into region:
http://gordonua.com/news/world ... -Egeyskoe-more-12543.html

It's not true.

I include a mass medium otherwise it all of a sudden is 'not trusted';
http://www.cnbc.com/id/101449481

Screw that, those ****s are now in my city.

http://ukrnovosti.net/?p=2377

Crimea is happy to go with Russia and I am hoping Odessa manage to do that as well.

Govt in Odessa is sellout and cowards, militia doesn't protect citizens anymore, military do nothing with this shit and now those ****s are marching the streets.
I dont think there was a time when Russian invasion was so welcome.

Ukraine is essentially divided (equally, unlike what Western media has tried to depict) between Russians and Ukrainian nationalists, who now rule key points of the country with support from a convict (Tymoshenko) and a fascist (Tyahnybok).

In western Ukraine, national extremists - whose real intentions are channelled through "Svoboda", the former "Social-National Party of Ukraine", the bastard child of Stefan Bandera's Ukrainian Insurgent Army, which was only too happy to engage in a mutual assistance relationship with Hitler in WW2 - have already started campaigns against "jews and communists", vowing to expel or eliminate them from their territory.

Funnily enough, the Communist Party of Ukraine was the only political organization that proposed a nationwide plebiscite to gauge public opinion on solve the EU/Russia issues since the beginning of the Maidan protests, whereas the parties that have ascended to power through violence were vehemently against it - for it wouldn't give them the opportunity to coup the then-established gov't.

These are pictures the US/Banking (cough, cough) led media will never show.
http://www.globalresearch.ca/t ... -support-fascists/5370269

"There are No Neo-Nazis in Ukraine. And the Obama Administration does not support Fascists." US quote.......

McCain with the Nazi's


Nuland with the Nazi's


Welcome to US 'freedom'

On a positive note though,
03.51 It appears the so-called deadline for Ukranian forces to surrender in Crimea has passed without major incident.

Economic sanctions will be extremely difficult to impose on Russia and are, for all their symbolism, likely to be counterproductive. For one thing, as is clear to anyone who knows Russia’s commercial landscape, many large and powerful Western companies have invested heavily in this vast, resource-rich country and won’t want their interests harmed.

00.25 The Huffington Post reports that most Americans want the administration to stay out of the Ukraine crisis.
22.28 Responding to Mr Sergeyev's statement, Russian ambassador to the UN Vitaly Churkin said Moscow is permitted to deploy up to 25,000 soldiers in Crimea according to a bilateral treaty. He said the Russian troops were guarding Russian objects in Crimea and preventing "radical actions".
22.10 Ukraine's envoy to the UN, Yuriy Sergeyev, has also said that Russia has deployed around 16,000 troops to Crimea since 24 February.
Addressing Russia he said: "You call it a coup, in the democratic world we call it a revolution of dignity," referring to the unrest in Ukraine that led to President Viktor Yanukovych being forced from power.
21.25 Russian ambassador to the UN Vitaly Churkin said that Ukraine's ousted leader Viktor Yanukovich sent a letter to Russian President Vladimir Putin requesting that he use the Russian military to restore law and order in Ukraine.
"Under the influence of Western countries, there are open acts of terror and violence," Russian Ambassador Vitaly Churkin quoted the letter from Yanukovich to Putin in an emergency meeting of the U.N. Security Council.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/new ... 0672417/Ukraine-live.html

There are also reports that the US military has stated that there is no way to take action in the region, what I was hoping they'd say. I'll find a reliable source ASAP for this.

EDIT. Western propaganda, this is what's being said in the main NZ media ATM. Note, This was 5 hours after the above Telegraph article, clearly our 'journalists' find it hard to keep up with facts during working hours. Read the above Telegraph article for the real facts.......

"Russian troops said to be 16,000 strong have tightened their stranglehold on Ukraine's Crimean Peninsula, openly defying the US and the European Union and rattling world capitals and stock markets.Ukraine, meanwhile, accused Russia of piracy for blocking two of the besieged country's warships and ordering them to surrender or be seized.
The US originally estimated that 6,000 Russian troops were dispatched to Crimea, but Ukraine's mission to the United Nations said Monday that 16,000 had been deployed. That stoked fears that the Kremlin might carry out more land grabs in pro-Russian eastern Ukraine.
US Secretary of State John Kerry was headed to Kiev in an expression of support for Ukraine's sovereignty, and the EU threatened a raft of punitive measures as it called an emergency summit for Thursday.
But it was Russia that appeared to be driving the agenda."
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/worl ... d=2&objectid=11213803

Welcome to the suitable Western media opinion, Aren't we good little US drones..........

Ah the perfect nutter conspiracy. Nazi's, Americans and the great dear Leader dictator hero Putin.

Quote from CSF :

Ah the perfect nutter conspiracy. Nazi's, Americans and the great dear Leader dictator hero Putin.

In b4 BlueFlame.

Quote from Yuri Laszlo :

In western Ukraine, national extremists - whose real intentions are channelled through "Svoboda", the former "Social-National Party of Ukraine", the bastard child of Stefan Bandera's Ukrainian Insurgent Army, which was only too happy to engage in a mutual assistance relationship with Hitler in WW2 - have already started campaigns against "jews and communists", vowing to expel or eliminate them from their territory.

Swoboda had 8% of the current government. That's about the percentage they have in Ukraines population (according to sources from Ukraine). The biggest German national party NPD had up to almost 10% in some s ... ons in the last ten years. Didn't see any Russian soldiers protecting our jews, turks or other ethnic minorities here. How odd.

Regarding Russia Today: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZolXrjGIBJs

Quote from ACCAkut :

Regarding Russia Today: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZolXrjGIBJs

I think she might get fired . but yeah, didn't see that coming from RT.

Getting past the rumors and half-truths, it seems to me there are a few benefits that could come out of this for Ukrainians. If this power play works out in favor of the West, corporations are already working to develop energy infrastructure for Ukraine to be less reliant on Putin. Oil shale jobs are paying young men six figure salaries in the US as well as creating local economies full of well paying jobs where few or none existed. Added to the fact that frakking throughout Eastern Europe would be a serious blow to Russia's influence over its former vassals, it also provides employment when it is needed the most. Everyone from scientists and researchers to roughnecks and computer technicians can get in on energy production and increase the power and wealth of their whole country and themselves.

Russia is not offering energy infrastructure and frakking technology to Ukrainians because they don't have it to give, and wouldn't if they did.

It seems really really far fetched to assume that neo-nazis are going to form the next Ukrainian government when there are thousands upon thousands who do not agree with that philosophy...where are neo nazis in majority power anywhere? It sounds like a myth, or giving whole credit for the overthrow to one group that was involved among many.

Abby Martin makes a point of being a journalist, not a talking head. I think that she'll be fine and RT will support her independence. The point of true journalism is to report the story, not to vomit govt propoganda.

This is a video from Global research, it mainly uses US media as a source to explain the last 10 years of history. Again, it helps to understand what is actually happening in the region, without propoganda.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qCAQUs0yPeY#t=267

CSF, have you actually bothered to read any of the information in this thread ?
If not, why not ?.
The conversation here is trying to 'cut the crap, and take a look at the reality'.

This article is by Robert Parry, He's a well established journalist who broke most of the Iran Contra stories in the 1980's for the Associated Press and Newsweek.
http://www.opednews.com/articl ... ons_Putin-140302-200.html
It's another must read, again for all sides to understand the current US position.

Mike, the Crimea and Eastern Ukraine, both area's with strong ties to Russia, have the industry. That's the problem the US coup* faces, with only the West, no industry or ports, and already needing 35 Billion US as an IMF bailout leaves it as an economic basket case. Have a read of the earlier posts in the thread to get yourself up to speed on the geopolitical facts.

* This is admitted by the US, see my Global Research video to see this stated by Nuland.

Well I dunno it might be nice to have Ukraine on our friends list and off of Russia's. They have every right to profit from their own energy resources with help from whoever they want to do business with. If a stronger relationship with the West brings more jobs and personal freedom then great. If it doesn't then Russia probably won't have hard feelings taking them back.

I just don't get Russia sometimes. They have the biggest country with endless natural resources and a tiny population (per square mile) to divvy it between, if the entire rest of the world sunk into the ocean they'd be fine or better off. Kinda like us.. We have the technology and money to isolate ourselves from global affairs as well we just love sticking our cock everywhere it fits and some it doesn't. Oh well when this too comes to an end all we'll have is our bodies, our families, and our will to thrive. That's when we do our best work anyway.

Quote from flymike91 :

Well I dunno it might be nice to have Ukraine on our friends list and off of Russia's. They have every right to profit from their own energy resources with help from whoever they want to do business with. If a stronger relationship with the West brings more jobs and personal freedom then great. If it doesn't then Russia probably won't have hard feelings taking them back.

We have the technology and money to isolate ourselves from global affairs as well we just love sticking our cock everywhere it fits and some it doesn't.

Love that last sentence Mike, if I said it there'd be no end of screaming, from you it's just honest.

Why does Russia have to be a threat ?, That actually is a serious question. We had a govt minister signing off on a free trade agreement with Russia, that was also part of the deal offered to the Ukraine. The whole region wants to deal with the west. The problem isn't them, the issue is the games being played by interest groups.
The only solution for the Ukraine now is an IMF 'bailout'. Ask the people of Spain and Cyprus how that is going for the people.
And who is the IMF ? ( I'll let you answer that question )

And, without the resources that the IMF wants to 'sell' to their mates, owing to the fact they're in the Crimea and Eastern Ukraine, how well is that going to go ?

The people in the region are ethnic Russians, they speak Russian. They are an independant state within the Ukraine. If they choose in a referendum ( 30 March ) to go with Russia, they should be allowed to.

Do read the earlier posts in the thread, other people go into this in far more detail than I've done here.

Updates for today (5/3 1.30pm NZ time), it looks this fight is now going financial. I'll post a few links below, just remember that these contain propoganda elements. But you can learn a lot from reading between the lines. I suggest these are read with that knowledge.
http://voiceofrussia.com/news/ ... tion-out-of-Ukraine-0850/
http://www.theguardian.com/wor ... harm-city-london-document
http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2014_03_04/268000581/
And this is definitely a raised middle finger !
http://voiceofrussia.com/2014_ ... Bridge-in-the-works-2157/

And for this one, I'll use Voice of America, a propoganda source supreme, to provide this information. So I can't be accused of bias ! There are many other sources that make this point clearer.
"Chinese news media coverage has been more pointed. In an editorial this week China’s Global Times newspaper stated that “the Ukrainian situation shows us clearly that in the international political arena, principles are decided by power.” In a commentary China’s Xinhua news agency argued that the West’s “biased mediation has polarized Ukraine and only made things worse in the country.”"
http://www.voanews.com/content ... intervention/1863631.html

Whilst this source is Voice of Russia, it is an interview with the former German chancellor Gerhard Schroeder with the radio station Europe-1. Worth a read.
http://voiceofrussia.com/news/ ... sia-wrong-Schroeder-5853/