I hope this doesnt sound too noobish, but for AGES, ive been using non-force feedback wheels.

am i missing out?

i love my old momo, it was the red FF version, but through sheer usage its now a non FF with a homemade mod added to it.

it seems that if it came to a vote the DFP would beat the newer black momo wheel, but is it really worth the money just for force feedback.

cheers for your time and comments

IMO, you're missing out the best part of LFS. For me, the FF provides so much immersion and information about what the car is doing - if there was for some reason no FF, I'd not be playing LFS anymore.

wuuh... the FF is one of the most important things about LFS

get another wheel


now







please

Is there someone in LFS who lives near you? Maybe you can borrow their wheel or (more likely) pop over and give it a try.

I can assure you FFB is 'better', though it'll take you a few weeks to get used to it after driving without. I used to think the FFB lied, but it doesn't. If you set it up right that is (turn off spring and damper effects in control panel when you get it).

appreciate the replys.

i know the new logitech wheel looks awesome, but its a heck of a lot of money, and the lack of buttons on the wheel is a minus for me..........so its a DFP.

Technically FF is really NOT capable of providing realistic forces, wheel 'friction' and wheel turning speeds. For fact, real car wheels turn a lot faster and sometimes provide a much stronger force. This means that more often than not, an FF wheel (current generation logitech) WILL NOT give you the feedback that the sim wants to give.

My conclusion is then, since it can't do anywhere remotely realistic ff, that you deliberatly handicap yourself if you choose to use an FF wheel. The G25 looks to be better and might actually get close to 'acceptable', the point where it actually makes sense to use FF, even though it still won't deliver the force and speed of most real cars.

Quote :

am i missing out?

If my FF wheel died on me tomorrow I would stop racing until I could replace it with anout FF wheel. I tried numeroud non-FF wheels for years before FF was invented, and I always went back to keyboard.

The reason I advocate against the use of FF is that it becomes a really subjective thing instead of just simple objective force.

Another problem is that there is 'clipping' going on pretty soon. I recall that setting FF to '100%' in the drivers and then also 100% in a sim does NOT mean that the max force possible in the sim will be 100%.. It can be that when the sim says '50%' the actual force feedback sent to the wheel is 100%. This means that every force higher than 50 simulation % will not feel different.

People use different damping / force numbers for their logitech wheels, plus different rotation angles. Then there are a few wheel brands and generations.

So where FF should be just one type and 'feel', there are hundreds of actually experienced different force feedback experiences going on.

I still believe that using FF and 'realistic' wheel rotation (dfp) make for a truly unrealistic experience.. I am however a realism freak. I am quite annoyed with simulations not really 'revoluting' to a new level since 1998, and also that the controls people use are not realistic in many ways. At this rate we'll never have a realistic sim experience

and looking at how great todays limited realism experiences can be.. I want more! better! etc

Yeah I sold those force sensor brake kits.. Well the g25 pedals look quite strong but there are two possible issues:

1) space
The loadcells are 13x3x3cm ish, and I doubt thats easily made to fit.

2) force
I doubt you can mount the loadcell on the logitech 'base' directly with it having enough strength.

Plus you'd really need a race frame. For loadcell pedals to 'work' realistically you'd really want to be pushing at least 20kg which is mostly impossible or at least very uncomfortable from an office chair..