I used the hairpin example in response to your comment "He was driving 60mph and got understeer! To get a 1.3 Astra to understeer at 60mph you need to stab the throttle through the floor, even if there was oil on ice"

You have absolutely no idea how sharp the corner is do you? So dont discard my point.

What I'm trying to point out (as you seem to agree judging by the rest of your comment) is that regardless of power, to understear he must have taken the corner too fast for the conditions and/or limits of the cars traction.

Tbh we dont know: How sharp the corner was, how much rain there was, how well the car performs in the wet etc etc so comparisons with your or my driving isnt really relevant.

I've taken corners at less than 60mph in the wet and understeared, as I'm sure many people here have, its hardly due to driver skill, the fact of the matter is if you go too fast into a corner you will intially get understear.

Quote from pb32000 :

I used the hairpin example in response to your comment "He was driving 60mph and got understeer! To get a 1.3 Astra to understeer at 60mph you need to stab the throttle through the floor, even if there was oil on ice"

You have absolutely no idea how sharp the corner is do you? So dont discard my point.

What I'm trying to point out (as you seem to agree judging by the rest of your comment) is that regardless of power, to understear he must have taken the corner too fast for the conditions and/or limits of the cars traction.

Tbh we dont know: How sharp the corner was, how much rain there was, how well the car performs in the wet etc etc so comparisons with your or my driving isnt really relevant.

If he was driving 60mph into a corner on public roads, he was obviously going too fast. If you drive your car as a racedriver on public streets you get understeer, oversteer, close calls and whatnot. If you drive according to the speed limits and use your head, the chances of getting into accidents is lowered significantly. Even if you drive in rain.

Quote from pb32000 :

I've taken corners at less than 60mph in the wet and understeared, as I'm sure many people here have, its hardly due to driver skill, the fact of the matter is if you go too fast into a corner you will intially get understear.

Well surely I'm doing something wrong, because I have never got understeer when going through corners in wet.

Do you have chicanes or hairpins on public roads in your country with 60mph speed limit?

ok, i have understeered at waaay less than 60 (probably less than 20), its not hard

Ok, it was a kart with slicks in a downpour, but thats not the point!

Quote from Jakg :

Ok, it was a kart with slicks in a downpour, but thats not the point!

That is kind of the point. When you go too fast in too bad conditions you will lose control of your car.

Quote from Hyperactive :

That is kind of the point. When you go too fast in too bad conditions you will lose control of your car.

i must admit i really wasnt expecting understeer, as i loosley turned the wheel (expecting less grip) and got nothing until i tapped the throttle (well a corner was coming up so i had to slow down, and using the throttle to turn wasn't the best ideas, although keeping it sideways was fun!), exits werent much problem, but bumps and turning at the same time posed a problem!

Quote from Hyperactive :

Do you have chicanes or hairpins on public roads in your country with 60mph speed limit?

Zigzag hill The twistiest road in the country I beleive.

I live right by it

I've a Mk1 1.2 Clio which is horrible in the wet. You'd think the nice thin tyres would just grip the road but by god is it understeer city. Tyres are probably down to about 2mm and hard as hell but it's a very easy car to catch. You'll always get understeer or oversteer in the wet, it's the nature of less grip. I think my days of karting have without a doubt kept me on the road and made me aware of how I should drive.

It's the very fact that I can be sitting in a friends car and I've said did you know your car was understeering a bit there, and they'll say whats understeer? This friend doesn't even drive over the speed limit nor does he thrash his car he just couldn't feel it.

Thats the biggest reason for crashes in the wet or even the dry because people don't know when the car loses grip. You should be taken to a kart track and taught how to drive in the wet, that would shake some people up.

Keiran

Quote from Hyperactive :

Do you have chicanes or hairpins on public roads in your country with 60mph speed limit?

Actually, yes we do. Unless posted otherwise, the speed limit in the UK is 60. This means that most of our thin, bumpy, twisty, poorly surfaced country roads use the national (60) limit.

I once had quite much understeer... As I found out, one front tire had lost 0.3 bar, causing the understeer... When I filled it up, the understeer was gone immediately...

Quote from Hyperactive :

If he was driving 60mph into a corner on public roads, he was obviously going too fast.

Correctomondo!

Indeed I was going too fast. Anyways, I'm saving up my money for Knockhill for driving in a Formula car, that will get rid of my feel for speed in a public car .

I had a free tyre check on all 4 tyres at Kwik-fit/ Two fronts are in need for replacement, the right is 2 x 2 x 1.6mm tread. The other is a 3 x 3 x 2mm tread, but has a cut on the side *which now explains my very slow puncture*
Unfortunately it would cost me 160 for all 4 michelin tyres and fit *gulp* and 90 quid for just the two fronts.

Also the 3 tyres *one spare* are dated back from 1990, but have grip, but are conisered to replace due to age, any recommendations? Keep the tyres, or save up, and replace them asap?

My Dad got tyres, slightly used, where it was near "brand spanking new" and the tyre trends are very high, and grip is very worthy. £20 quid per tyre, which includes installation.

The company is popular, with regular queues for new tyres, so its worth looking at. So I'll give them a go.

I thank for all your help, and experience, much appreciated .