First corner incidents happen pretty often. Not a big deal. What anoys me more is the fact that drivers losing the first corner roulette call for immediate restarts. The 2nd start is usually as messy as the first.

What's the point in restarting a 5 lap race? illepall The next race is on within a few minutes.

Drivers that caused the accident usually don't get much out of it. So a restart won't punish them.

Wouldn't starts be taken a bit more seriously if restarts wouldn't be socially accepted?

I don't understand what's so bloody difficult about T1? Lights go green, accelerate, brake, turn in, done. Simple as that.

Respecting other drivers, anticipating the turn, being aware of your surroundings and the car's behaviour should all be clear as day so I left these out. You know, like... everybody knows these, right?

First you have to cure people of the "first to T1 wins" mind-set. Then you have to teach them that you need to brake earlier than normal when you're in a pack. It would help them to keep in mind that if you've just started a race your tyres are still cold and your car is heavier due to fuel. Then you have to remind them that there's more than one lap in a race and if you're a good driver you'll finish well. You must also remind them of the old saying "to finish first, first you must finish". It would help them to remember that LFS is a computer game and as such doesn't actually matter beyond the minutes that you're playing. Finally, if the fact that there are a bunch of other cars on the track being driven by actual people and not robots - actual people who might not appreciate being used as airbags - doesn't make people drive carefully, you are allowed to officially label them "stupid" which means you can go to their house and replace their 1337 PC with a Sinclair until they can learn to behave themselves.

I agree that people shouldn't restart so much on the shorter races. Probably a good compromise though is to get the other racers to agree before the race start that you'll limit restarts to 1 or 2 times. Just make that statement before the race and enough people will agree with you that the 3rd restart won't get enough votes.

I wish more servers would set a time limit on the shorter races - a limit before a restart can be instigated, that is.

Not that that would stop people for begging for restarts as the field is coming down the front straight on the last lap.

Can you set a limit to the number of restarts for a given race ?

And what about those who vote to restart as soon as they're logged in on the server? And those who vote to restart as soon as they crash anywhere in a race? I've seen a fair number of both!

On our servers, restarts aren't permitted for the first one minute of a race. That generally gets folks over the first corner hurdle within a race or two. Once they catch on that they can't get an immediate restart, and have to sit out for yet another race, or join with no chance of winning, they magically grow some common sense and caution into the first corner.

On the rare occasions where a restart really *should* happen, the majority of the field are still jumping up and down about a restart at 59 seconds, and a restart happens.

haha, i have the restart limit set at 3 minutes, and 5 minutes for longer races

Quote from Flycantbird :

Can you set a limit to the number of restarts for a given race ?

+1 from me, should be easy to do for Scawen (making promises on his behalf, of course, but the logic flow + options screen changes can surely only be trivial)

Alternatively you could also do an exponential back-off for restart time limits. So first restart enables after 30 secs, second restart after a minute, third after *two* minutes....

Cheers

Rakhsh

Quote from glyphon :

haha, i have the restart limit set at 3 minutes, and 5 minutes for longer races

Yeah, i think those are better limits.
Also i think that if you could set some ammount of time, say whe there's only 20% of the total laps left, as some ground where restart isn't allowed it would be pretty sweet.

Not that the later happens too often but it would be cool to be able to prevent it. I've seen it happens quite a lot of times, actually (but since i race a lot that number isn't so important...).

Wheel problem is that folks from the back are pushing to hard to take few spots on start but that usualy is not a good thing, so races are out in T1 and U must restart

Quote from N I K I :

Wheel problem is that folks from the back are pushing to hard to take few spots on start but that usualy is not a good thing, so races are out in T1 and U must restart

Very often it just some guy who has momentary brain fade and brakes 50-100 meteres too late. What I mean is that it's not about pushing too hard... More like forgetting to think.

Quote :

First corner incidents happen pretty often. Not a big deal. What anoys me more is the fact that drivers losing the first corner roulette call for immediate restarts. The 2nd start is usually as messy as the first.

I actually tried playing in a public server last night, went to Redline Racing's Fox server. Did 1 race, as soon as it was restarted after T1 I quit. Why am I so intollerent?

If a driver does a do or die and die's, then just restarts until he gets it right, then I do not want to be on the same server.

I'm also now learning to avoid which servers have admins that do restarts if they crash at the start - but that can be hard to avoid, there are so few active combo's some of the time that you just have to go where the action is.

Double edged sword this........

Short races, especially 5 lappers, are critical to getting ahead of the pack on T1, which leads to this type of mentality.

Longer races will cure this problem, as there wont be such a rush to get a good place at the first corner.

Dan,

Quote from Becky Rose :

If a driver does a do or die and die's, then just restarts until he gets it right, then I do not want to be on the same server.

Agreed, provided he dies and doesn't take anyone else with him , but there are occasions when the culprit wipes other people out and is still able to continue the race himself. I think a word or two from the server admin and a restart might be appropriate on such an occasion.

Quote from PLAYLIFE :

Very often it just some guy who has momentary brain fade and brakes 50-100 meteres too late. What I mean is that it's not about pushing too hard... More like forgetting to think.

often its a case of the cars in front see that there could be a problem and brake earlier and for longer than normal so they can all get around the corner and then the car at the back doesnt realise they've slowed so much and then hasnt enough time / space to adjust

Quote :

I think a word or two from the server admin and a restart might be appropriate on such an occasion.

I completely disagree with this. Some of us take a lot of care and caution on T1 to avoid being hit by other cars, like placing our cars where it cannot be hit - sometimes with a positional disadvantage - with the bonus of sometimes coming out at the front.

Sure I have been taken out at the start, in which case a wait 5 minutes and join the next race.

What really annoys me is when I have placed my car well and I come out in the top 3, then some admin who got wiped restarts, let alone do or die players with the restart mentality.

Quote from Meanie :

Yeah, i think those are better limits.
Also i think that if you could set some ammount of time, say whe there's only 20% of the total laps left, as some ground where restart isn't allowed it would be pretty sweet.

you can set a back-limit...its no restarts within n minutes of end of race. since i haven't had a problem with this one, i've left it at the default of 1 min.

this problem is well known and does happen day for day again lol.
like already said the only thing what prevents ppl from restarting all the time is to set the limit higher. even for a 5 lap race id say 5 mins (well not on the very short tracks of course) that would work for sure.
the 1 min thing doesnt really help much, i see alot of these crashes and then after the minute is gone they restart illepall

im pretty often involved in these crashs, but 90% of the time im guy who gets hit (not the guy whos causing the crash).
usually i brake a bit earlier BEFORE the cars in front of me start to brake and alot of time i get hit in the back when doing so.
easy things to prevent this stuff
- leave more room between the cars until u passed turn 1
- brake bit earlier
- theres on almost every track rough where u can drive in to avoid a crash
- and the easiest (i do that alot especially on not well known combos) right after the start drive on the side let all cars pass, watch them crashing pass them and enjoy the race

simple solution - brake a TINY bit, your brake lights come on, then the people behind you break, then you can go mental with the pedal!

thats what i usually do, tap the brake , and after a half second or so i start the real braking.
but not all ppl paying the attention what is needed to race

There are a very few people that can acctualy race. If i join a full house server there are ussualy 5 drivers that realy know how to race properly and maybe 1 or 2 of them are even fast.
I think that fact is keeping most of the top drivers away from racing on public servers...

Quote :

- and the easiest (i do that alot especially on not well known combos) right after the start drive on the side let all cars pass, watch them crashing pass them and enjoy the race

Since I'm relatively new to LFS this is what I've been doing quite a bit. I find I can pickup half a dozen spots after T1 by doing this. Instead of ending up upside down due to T1 madness!

Quote from [RCG]Boosted :

- and the easiest (i do that alot especially on not well known combos) right after the start drive on the side let all cars pass, watch them crashing pass them and enjoy the race

Nope, best is to spectate until you see the grid field set, then join the race. You will be put in the last spot, thus no one behind you to crash into you, nor do you have to worry about folks passing you by as you pull off to the side.

I do this often for several reasons. T1/Lap1 FPS, lag, shear enjoyment of moving up through the field, and the T1 crashes. Cruise up to T1 behind everyone, brake at 7894 meters, LOL, wiggle your way around everyone who crashes, and pull through running in the top 5.

Quote from Becky Rose :

What really annoys me is when I have placed my car well and I come out in the top 3, then some admin who got wiped restarts, let alone do or die players with the restart mentality.

yep that really annoys me also I left a server in disgust the last time I was on because of an admin restarting three times in a row because he didn't get the start he wanted illepall

Quote from [RCG :

Boosted]right after the start drive on the side let all cars pass, watch them crashing pass them and enjoy the race

Yeah I do that alot also even on combos I know fairly well, I generally don't try start properly until at least a few races and or I know the people I am racing with, just cant be bothered otherwise

Quote from SkyNet :

There are a very few people that can acctualy race. If i join a full house server there are ussualy 5 drivers that realy know how to race properly and maybe 1 or 2 of them are even fast.
I think that fact is keeping most of the top drivers away from racing on public servers...

would have to agree, too many people race like they are racing against AI or they would in NFS but hey I see this on the public roads every day too