The trick on that turn is to start turning very slowly off the tarmack (le cote vert a gauche), so that the wheels don't lose traction.

Then you start turning a bit more when you get on the asphalt.

Oh, and you have to start turning BEFORE the turn, so it just takes practice I guess.

Well I've been using Tom's setup for a few weeks now, and I've busted a gut to get to 1:08:67 (which I've done 3 times - consistant at least). 33:39 is my best on the 1st split - needs to be quicker I think as the rest is Ok, just need a bit more practice on the penultimate turn.

Killboy - can you describe how you go through T1? I've watched your WR replay several times: you seem to brake and drop 2 gears at the 75 mark, then drop to 3rd at 25 and gently turn off the curb as you release the brake. Then you seem to get the power down before the apex - goodness know how - I loose it if I try that. Is that about right? Any tips appreciated!

Anyway it's good to know this setup can get down below 1:08, I won't give up till I get there (but I may be very old by then...)

That 25mph reading is just the wheels locking up in braking he is actually in the 60-70 range I believe. I cannot enter that turn for the life of me, I can exit the turn at full throttle and be in 4th before I get to the chicane but I always screw up T1 turn in. The lowest first split I have ever achieved is a 23:74. I wish someone could give me a detailed explanation of that turn because I just can't do it. It's getting really frustrating doing 24x 1st splits and still pulling off 49:80 2nd splits. I know I could drop massive time off of my PB if I could get T1 down.

Well I ran hotlaps all day yesterday and after watching diK's hotlap replay on T1 several times(I have his setup so I figured if I could follow his lines I'd be on the right track) it totally clicked. Whatever I had been missing before appeared and I got myself a 23:4x 1st split and finished it with 1:08:72 new PB. Now I just need to learn the last turn!

I've found that I can easily match my PB with Killboy's setup on Test Drive. That setup is absolutely perfect as far as I'm concerned. It's like driving Barlin's setup but dropping 1s on my lap times. diK has a different way of taking T1 that seems to be a little more reliant on finesse but I have been trying to get it down. I think he just has way more driving skill than I can muster. I've been trying to learn about making my own setups so that I can recreate the type of setup Killboy used for his WR run because it seems to be my favorite.

im probably going to get ripped to bitts here but this is my advice...

1. no driver drives the same EVER, your driving style is like a fingerprint, you may drive similar to someone else and if you watched a replay you may be hard pushed to find a difference but the car will handle differently...

2. a setup only ENHANCES your driving or lap times, if i see another new driver ask the fastest guy on the server for his setup again im going to cry, if you think that your going to go from a 1.10 to 1.8 or even a low 1.9 because of a setup think again if this was the case we would all be driving along fernando alonso earning 5 million a year..

3.the setup of a car is very touchy what i mean is you change 1 thing it effects another, so putting together several sets its just gona send you backwards...

now ill admit i havent read all the posts here so i may be cover stuff already said and so on...

You carnt be fast if you dont know how to use/drive the car no setup can take away the need for driving experience, some people have posted here saying they have tried your set and said it was better than theirs or have done half decent times with it in just a few laps, this is because they know how to drive the car, if we take BL1 with FOX a good driver can do a 1.10 or even a mid 1.9 with ANY set simply because they 1. know the track inside out and 2. have the experience to adapt..

ok so here is my advice

grab a set that is STABLE! hence it doest kill you if you put a foot wrong or miss an apex, (the easy drive setup pack is great for this) dont go ask drivers that are doing silly times or even mildly quick times it wont work.... once you have your set FORGET ABOUT SETUPS, either online or offline (they both have there advantages) just keep lapping and lapping as you have already found you will hit the bar where you can find no more time to shave off Everyone has this its just what we do abou it that counts....

watch other drivers in replays or online that are slightly faster than you 1 sec MAX! if you start watching guys doing 1.7's you will learn nothing, so if your PB is 1.9.50 find a replay or a online driver doing 1.8's watch him over and over notice the lines hes taking and were he puts the power down also where he breaks, although there are so many variables in the breaking department its less of a issue when watching someone, due to setup and driver style, the main things your looking for are the race line, where they/if they hit a given apex and finaly where they apply the power, but without doupt race line is the main thing, it may only be a small difference but that can gain you valuable 10th's...

2nd thing is wich if you want to be fast (competative is a better word IMO) you NEED to know how and why the car does what it does, hence lean the basics of a car setup, as i say above this come after you have learned how to drive, once you have done that while lapping you will start ......err making friends with the car I.E you will notice that the car doesnt want to do that, basicly you will learn how to recive feedback from the car, you will take a turn and say to yourself "its understearing badly when i turn in badly" so then once you know what makes the car understear/oversteer on turning in you can simply pitt adjust and try again, once you have fixed that you may notice that on that same turn your overstearing on exit and loosing time, so once again you adjust and
test, before you know it your knocking 10ths of all over the shop, once you hitt the bar again you start the proccess again... its just the way it works, you canot go from 1.9 to 1.7 in 1 sesion or a twidle of the setup thats the fun of this game IMO....

as a E.G a guy was asking for help on a server the other day, so i spent the night with him helping him, his first BIG mistake was he was using a set capable of silly times and he was using a game pad! hence he was spining out in EVERY TURN, i watched him lap and together we came up with a banchmark setup then we went through racing lines power on points and so on, when we first met he was doing 1.10's "BL1 FOX" after a night of a setup revamp and HIM LEARNING HOW TO DRIVE the next day he comes on doing low 1.9s every lap, in 24 hours i think thats pretty good and so hear his times have tumbled again...

so please dont be one of these people that race on super fast sets who carnt handle them taking out half the cars in the race, and expect to be competative with the guy you had the set off i will put my full years wages on it that its impossible, being fast comes in stages some people progress faster than others but its still the same for who ever you are...

good luck and enjoy learning this awsome game, hope i havent bored you to death and hope it helps

regards Gizzmo

While I accept your advice I disagree on some points. Some racers(like me) don't know all the variables when diagnosing understeer, oversteer and how to adjust accordingly. I am slowly teaching myself what I like in my setups and how to achieve the feel that lets me acheive good(good for me) times reliably. I find that I have made some great improvements on my PB using some of the faster hotlap sets but I don't drive the way the maker of the setup does and thus I can't reproduce those lap times consistently and set out modifying the setup to hopefully make it more compatible with my driving style(crappy.) When I talked about Killboy's WR setup I am not saying that his setup makes me run good times but that I would like to reproduce the way his setup drives because I think it is greatly balanced and stable. Problem is, I don't have the knowledge yet to create a setup without input from the people around me. I'm not the type to ask for setups ingame just because one person is running low lap times. The times I ask for them I really need an idea of what settings influence the attributes that are desirable on that course in that car. I've recently been racing AS Club on Redline 3 and have learned alot about how to setup the FOX and how to determine what I don't like about my car's setup. But the fact is I am still pretty lost when I look at the setup menu in the garage and I see things like Toe IN and OUT and can't really tell what they affect when I drive the car.

BHS after reading my previouse post i come over as all anti ask for a setup or dont play untill you know what this means, for this im sorry maybe i should have read the thread a little more before opening the old pie hole

ive only just recently started racing the FOX and the first thing i did was ask for a set so i could use it as a benchmark, then after a few laps i start molding the set into somthing that works with my style (if you can call it that )

if its learing how to setup your own car (wich i HIGHLY recomend) then if you havent already got them go get the setup analizer and read the the setup tutorial from the floating widget, a must have for anyone doing there own setups, as im racing the FOX for a few weeks PM me if you like and ill try to help you on the track and on the setup side...

regards gizz

Hi Gizz - some good advice there I think (I have learnt some of it the hard way!!)

I found the floating widget (for anyone else it's lfs.thefloatingwidget.net and there is a link in the setup guide to the steup analyser) - thanks for that, sounds like just what I've been looking for. I've read the basic guide on the wiki which was fine as a background to what each feature does but doesn't give much info on the interactions between variables. Consequently I've been concentrating on improving my driving up till now, nad leaving the setup alone.

What's your racer name by the way? Maybe see you on Redline sometime...

glad you found some of it usefull...

i always race under Gizz, fir the past 2 wks ive been on R-R BL1 FOX i think i saw you last night but i knocked off early

hope to see you on there tonight m8

as for the tutorial it gives you the basic ideas of the car setup but you realy need to get to grips with the setup analizer and get ya hands dirty just enjoy it if we were all doing WR laps in the first day with a given combo car/track we wouldnt be here...

regards Gizz

Saw you on there briefly last night Gizz, but you left shortly after I joined. Got my time down to 1:08:55 now, but I know I can do better as I can do faster sectors, I just can't roll them into one lap. I'm a bit inconsistent on T1 too.

hehehe tell me about it, last night was a bit insane, best i managed last night was low nines the trafic was like london in rush hour .... lots of new drivers quietly doing 1.11's and some dangerouse apex speeds so it was near impossible to lap consistently....

although i have scraped my old set and stated another because i wanted to try and cut off as mutch downforce as possible, still problems with it but its been a good learning proccess squeezing as mutch mechanical grip out of the chasis as possible, its so easy just to add a bit of front or rear downforce but made myself not touch the downforce, best so far is a 1.8.77 but thats hotlaping offline i just about got into the 8's lastnight but its understearing in the chicane after t2, tire are a little warm to but running the low downforce i kind of expected that, im not after WR speeds anyway its basicly just experimenting and what not...

hope the track is a bitt clearer tonight and hope to see you on there

I recently bit the bullet and decided to try and make my own setup. I started with Tom's but I've changed almost everything now. It's worked really well and I've brought my best time down to 1:08:29

I think that I am missing something on braking into T1 though. I've watched Maurizio (?) racing and he can get away with braking later, not sure how he's done it. I was trying to work out what i could do with the diff to improve braking into T1 but I only vaguely understand how diffs work. Any ideas?

Spectating people online makes braking seem later then it really is. I had the same problem a while back. I thought I was braking way to early, and started braking late, and ended up being slower becasue I was braking to hard..and to late like I saw online. Try braking at about 65, keep left wheels on the gator while braking. Entering T1, stay real tight (in different color pavement). It will feel slower, but isn't! Trust me. DON'T TRY TO OVERTHINK T1!!!

Good luck.

Hey Mumble! Thanks, I have noticed too that the harder I try, the later I brake into T1. If I actually brake a bit earlier I tend to be faster through the first split. Also found as you did that tight on the apex is best.

As for thinking, I go to bed thinking about how to improve on T1, I can't help it (I know, I need to get out more) Interesting point about watching people online, I hadn't noticed that.

Maybe see you on Redline sometime.

im not the fastest on BL but my advice is set your dampers to have a good amount of OVERSTEER under breaking....

2nd thing getting the car stable at the apex (or before) is the main thing, more so than actual apex speed because if the car isnt stable at the apex its a animal to try and get the power down,

break around 70-65 (depending on set/breakpower) while slowly reducing the break turn into the apex, as the car will oversteer here you should find the car is pointing right into the mouth of the turn slowly bring power in, once you know the car is stable under power nail it to the chicane..

im still having problems over that little bump just after the apex still loosing traction there so im still tinkering ...

PB is 1.8.52 but thats hotlapping online im lucky to get 1.8.90

Just want to thank the thread starter and the people who posted their setups, as I was having a similar problem yesterday, when driving the FOX on BLGP. With the standard RACE_S setup I was able to drive pretty stable but quite slow, tried some different setups which were definately faster but as a gamepad user it was really hard to keep that up for more than 2 laps.

Here I have Maurizio Naselli's setup, when he drives his best splits he drives 23.05 48.27 1:07.18 It is a very nice oversteering set with low wings.

The Fox_Maurizio-Kb is mine, a mod of Maurizios set It has less braking power (742 > 717) and that way T1 SHOULD go faster, I can do 1st split 23.02 with it! Unfortunately I don't have that spr anymore, I do have an spr doing 23.04 that set When I drive my best splits with my set I drive 23.02 48.24 1:07.17

But driving your best splits is not that easy. Maurizio Naselli is a very good driver, he drives very consistently and gets really close to his best splits all the time. That's why I think he is one of the best drivers!

I think what would help improving your time is not just talking about how to take T1, but just try it! Trying and practising is the best way to learn I think, and once you've got an awsumn split you save that replay and start analyzing it

23.04 is Maurizio - kb set, 23.06 is Maurizio Yeehaa

Thanks! Does Maurizio know you've posted his set here though? I have raced against him (er, well raced behind him then ) and yes he is not only fast but really consistent. Sounds like his set is similar to mine is now, I've got a bit of oversteer and low wing settings too (but my pb is only 1:08:23 at the moment ).

As you say you can't practice T1 enough. I must have driven a few thousand laps now and I'm still slowly improving on T1. I've analysed a bit with the new LRA tool but I've really only improved through practice. It's an amazingly difficult corner, and almost impossible to fluke.

Ok, my English is not perfect but I'll try explaining how do I do T1.

Getting through T1 as fast as possible requires:

• Late braking
  
• Step on gas as quick as possible
  
  
• Yes you start braking on left side of road

So I brake just after the blue-white-blue-white thing (?), and just before the 50-sign. Let's say between begin of blue-white-blue-white-thing and 50-sign.



Then I brake 100%, still on the blue-white-thing. At about 25-sign I start turning in slowly and slowly release brakes. Turning in too fast (usually) causes the wheels to block and BOOM! And remember releasing brakes slowly important! This way you turn in corner faster, but releasing brakes TOO slow = you end up on grass.





So really, try turning in slowly, at 45° wheel you should stop braking. 200° (90-100° to the right) you stop turning in. Now I have 0% throttle and braking. Fly into the corner! Then I do about 25% throttle and then full throttle. Go go go!

Oh, and don't forget to flat out the chicane yes!

Ok I have not much time to explain at the moment but I will try later, good luck training T1! You can watch my 1:07.28 spr I use this technique in SPR.

Thanks for that! You're pretty consistent (not to mention quick!) in the 1st sector, despite really scrubbing the tyres on entry into turn 1, I'll give that a go. One thing I noticed is that you seem to be using R2 tyres is that right? Every set I have seen until now has used R1 for FOX/BL.

no its R1....

EDIT: holy shit yes you are right I see my set was set on R2.... lol

Quote from Jakg :

Its not mine, its from Redline's Barlin but it ROCKS!

OT - Where did you pull my name from?

I just starting using Barlin's set and I improved my PB from 1:09.1 to 1:08.5 after quite a few laps to get used to it. My 1:09.1 time was long standing and I've done 1600 laps on this combo.

btw - I often find when I return to a combo after a long time I smash the PB. It just goes to show you never stop learning in LFS.