Quote from Viper93 :

ohh yes I didn't mean to say that rollcages are the end all be all of safety gear. They do help but they don't protect 100% I was just refering to what you stated about factory seats in older vehicles and probably in some of the newer ones aswell not having enough bonding done to prevent the seat from moving and flexing =)

The newer cars should be ok though and shouldn't have too much of a problem. It's just that without a CG-lock under heavy Gforces like braking you can slide forward in the belt a bit decreasing your ability to drive the vehicle. I notice this in my car when I am under heavy brakes... I am using the deadpedal to keep myself in the seat and not concentrating on braking as much =)

Still I think for cars without a rollcage the best safety you could get restraint wise is the factory equiped 3 point belt. Once you get a rollcage you can properly mount a racing harness without posing much of a risk of falling out of the harness under stresses, IE like a crash =)

Oh yes, indeed, newer cars do have better welding because they have these seatbelt tensioners, seat airbags etc. Some even have seats that react before accident.
In older cars before new improvements to seat belts, seat mounts were just spot welded and was common that in harder accidents those welds did fail, also seat's structure was weaker and that did fail so one have to hope that accident was really just one hit.

Really had to google what the heck is that CG-Lock he keeps mentioning Never seen such used in here.

My lap times suffers greatly because of 3 things, 1st one is that I'm not staying on that bloody chair, even I use left foot to push myself hard cornering forces are still too much that I could stay on chair, on straights I try to get back to seat and pull seatbelt tight and same thing after every corner. Better seat would really help. Won't even think about what would happen in case of accident. Anyway that is keeping me away from getting good cornering performance.

Then there are brakes (fading after few hard braking) and inside rear lifting and thus not accelerating car, well 4.8 turns from lock to lock also, but that is not real issue when looking lap time.

I rammed a Merc 2 seater up the backside, while swerving to avoid a brick being thrown off a bridge by a collection of the Great British Youth. (I'd completely forgotten about this - oh the memories). The woman in the passenger seat hit her head on the windscreen. She was wearing a seatbelt, but both the car's long sleek sloped design and the fact that the woman was sitting so far forwards, meant that her head was just a few inches from the screen while sitting normally. If It'd been head-on, or faster... Just thought I'd share

Quote from 11SuLLy11 :

ouch illepall

...did you just nick Bytoro's avatar...?

Yep, it is really lot what you move even wearing normal seatbelt, just look this crash test and imagine if there would be no airbags.

Then if you would have good seat and proper racing harness bolted to floor you would not move forward from seat really, so I think that good racing harness with good seat is better than normal seat belts even without roll cage.
However Hans device would be quite nice to have then

With a rollcage you would defenately want to wear a helmet. Even the slightest bump can make your head to hit the rollcage and the rest is messy.

I'd guess that you would need a lot more side support to your seat, JTbo. For you legs and upper body

Quote from JTbo :

Yep, it is really lot what you move even wearing normal seatbelt, just look this crash test and imagine if there would be no airbags.

Then if you would have good seat and proper racing harness bolted to floor you would not move forward from seat really, so I think that good racing harness with good seat is better than normal seat belts even without roll cage.
However Hans device would be quite nice to have then

Yes if the seat was very securly fastened to the chassis then yeah it would be a good way to go but the only problem is finding good places to mount the racing harness =)

Here is a link to what I was talking about... the CG-lock

http://www.cg-lock.com/

Quote from Hyperactive :

I'd guess that you would need a lot more side support to your seat, JTbo. For you legs and upper body

No, I need new seats :weeping:
So damn wet weather before January and my car sits unused all winter so now need to clean / replace and find money for that from somewhere. Wouldn't mind popping bucket seats in really, current seats have no side support at all.

@Viper93, there is always drill and strong bolts, well needs bit more than just that, but don't know all words for those small metal sheets or something, lol.

Oh yes, did found that site with Google earlier, had no idea there is such things really, maybe it is good.

Ouch no those seats are horrible. Here are the seats I have in my car, thought I would add some more while I was at it =)

Yes you would need to put backing plates onto the other side to prevent them from coming through, but I guess you could do it that way I would prefer seats that are adjustable so you dont lose the practicality of it though.

Quote from Viper93 :

Ouch no those seats are horrible. Here are the seats I have in my car, thought I would add some more while I was at it =)

Yes you would need to put backing plates onto the other side to prevent them from coming through, but I guess you could do it that way I would prefer seats that are adjustable so you dont lose the practicality of it though.

Those Viper seats are nice indeed

Too much humidity and that stuff started to grow up in my interior, now has been too cold to do anything about it (-20C)

I will leave adjustment rails in if I get bucket seats in, even I need to keep adjustment as back as it goes already, I'm tall

Hmm, we certainly would need that real car section here, devs could pick lot of good stuff from there too

Oh yes, horror of rear seat, that is lot of work to fix all that

Quote from JTbo :

Those Viper seats are nice indeed

Too much humidity and that stuff started to grow up in my interior, now has been too cold to do anything about it (-20C)

I will leave adjustment rails in if I get bucket seats in, even I need to keep adjustment as back as it goes already, I'm tall

Hmm, we certainly would need that real car section here, devs could pick lot of good stuff from there too

Oh yes, horror of rear seat, that is lot of work to fix all that

Ouch yeah =) Did you put that car in a lake or something? =P

Hmm a real car section would be nice, I will ask the moderators =)

Just rip the backseats off

Quote from Hyperactive :

Just rip the backseats off

Quote from Viper93 :

Ouch yeah =) Did you put that car in a lake or something? =P

Hmm a real car section would be nice, I will ask the moderators =)

Weather just was worse possible for few months, so cold that nothing did dry up but so warm that nothing did froze, then at nights it was colder and days bit warmer, lot of condensation and humidity in air just did same as it would been on lake.

Thanks global warming :ouch:

Did actually drove without backseat and parcel self at summer, but would need ear plugs really then, it is ok with helmet on, but thing is not most quiet as back box is just straight pipe with some metal around it really does not make it sound much more quiet.

wowsers! big accident, the forces are incredible, he is thrown around like a rag doll even though tightly strapped in.

Heres my daily driver!

Quote from LFSn00b :

It hit the bank and went on 2 wheels, and then the car started to flip. You should listen!

It did go out from track, but what caused slide, he made some error there as if he would just let it go wide and slowly slowed down it would not started to slide in first place.

Can't really see what he's goign wide on, sounds like some gravel stuff and probarly a little bump, when he is coming back towards the track he is still turning to the right and probarly when he hit a bump or whatever it just threw way over to the other side.

Watching the car before hand though it seemed quite loose so I doubt it would be an easy thing to recover what this pour sod had.

Nice crash though, I think he was planning to drive back to the pits and pretend nothing happend, maybe they wouldn't notice the dents?

huhhh...

Don't be sad, mr. Drifter from the Great Snowy Nation of Peace And Justice formerly known as Finland. Buy S2 and replace that with a .


Or gettehelluva off my intertubes. :mad:

Say... anyone fancy some hot coco?

I think his tyres got too hot, looked like most of the preceeding corners he was getting a lot of push at turn in.

Anywho, the 4-belt harnesses work better than regular ones as long as they're properly fitted and adjusted, and if you get an old enough car the seats are mounted plenty good enough

Now my problem is that with a helmet on there's very little room above my head to the roof - when I duck below 15 second ETs I'll want to get a bucket so I can get closer to the floor ... that'll be a couple of years at least though, lol.

Quote from JamesK :

Now my problem is that with a helmet on there's very little room above my head to the roof - when I duck below 15 second ETs I'll want to get a bucket so I can get closer to the floor ... that'll be a couple of years at least though, lol.

I have to adjust seat so that I lean bit backwards to fit in there with helmet, still helmet touching roof, very bad as once got 2 weeks back pains because of taking chicane fast and having my head against roof, when car bottomed out something felt not ok in back and it was 2 weeks until pain gave up. Should really get that bucket seat, I think

Quote from spankmeyer :

Don't be sad, mr. Drifter from the Great Snowy Nation of Peace And Justice formerly known as Finland. Buy S2 and replace that with a .


Or gettehelluva off my intertubes. :mad:

Say... anyone fancy some hot coco?

i buy when my lovely mom buy it x) becose i just bought logitech g25..

JTbo - Yeah, my project car is getting ally seats, no good for a street car unfortunately ...

Quote from JTbo :

In newer cars sure, but in older cars it is insane amount they have loose even you have pulled it tight. with good racing harness and remounted stronger seat you will get better safety as body won't gain too much movement energy, but really seat must be mounted again, those stock welds and seats are ridiculous really, it is no fun when seat fails even belt would work.

No doubt about it there's no point in having a roll cage unless you're going to buckle in properly to a full harness and wear a lid, the dangers of hitting your head are just too great with a 3 point even in racing cars people still die from hitting their heads on rollcages, particularly causes issues with different height drivers in endurance racing

Quote :

6 or 8 point harness is requirement now for racing here, can't remember if 8 point is already what they are requiring. It is almost every season you have to get everything new as they change rules a bit, bit overkill.

Requirement for the UK is 4 point harnesses recently the required width has gone up to a massive four inches. 6 point is the most I've ever seen no idea how 8 could work?

As for the comments about getting away with it without a cage or harness all I can say is I've seen injuries from a lot less visual damage in racing cars the fact that it deformed the car so badly does make it seem like it was much faster and harder than it looked like from the onboard to try and start a rolled car though is unwise to say the least.

Quote from ajp71 :

No doubt about it there's no point in having a roll cage unless you're going to buckle in properly to a full harness and wear a lid, the dangers of hitting your head are just too great with a 3 point even in racing cars people still die from hitting their heads on rollcages, particularly causes issues with different height drivers in endurance racing

Requirement for the UK is 4 point harnesses recently the required width has gone up to a massive four inches. 6 point is the most I've ever seen no idea how 8 could work?

As for the comments about getting away with it without a cage or harness all I can say is I've seen injuries from a lot less visual damage in racing cars the fact that it deformed the car so badly does make it seem like it was much faster and harder than it looked like from the onboard to try and start a rolled car though is unwise to say the least.

Don't see why anyone would put cage and not wear racing harness, that would be really stupid!

I have again mixed up things, 6 point it is that is required here now, 5 point harness it was before. Depends bit from class to class, I think some very low class series are still allowed to use 4 point harness but it had limitations, too long when I read from those.
Luckily I don't need to play with those things.

Accidents are funny, sometimes even small crash is fatal, but sometimes car is put to half and drivers walks away. Chaos theory or something

Quote from JTbo :

Accidents are funny, sometimes even small crash is fatal, but sometimes car is put to half and drivers walks away. Chaos theory or something

It's all about where the energy goes parts flying off and rolling is usually much better than one hard hit.