The more the merrier I suppose :up: I'm sure netKar would love to have that problem

I've made quite a few friends online too, almost all through sim racing. None of them ever look remotely like their avatars though.^
Bastards.

Quote from Hankstar :

I'm sure netKar would love to have that problem

Im sure the NetKar Dev's would love to have that problem.....But personally i love the fact that nearly all the nKPro pilots know each other and it really does feel like our own 'exclusive' club.
Coming from nKPro, LFS seems about as far from exclusivity as you can get, but at least you can do some racing more often than once a fortnight with LFS

Quote from Bob Smith :

I would say the general strength of the community seems a bit weaker than it used to be, when it's small you become a big bunch of mates, sadly that feeling can only go when there's thousands of members chatting away.

Well I'd like to add it's nice as a johnny-come-lately to have support from you old-schoolers whether it's Biggie providing hotlap advice, or yourself providing tools like the GRC, or people like Tristan or SparkyDave or Sinbad or Exodus or *insert dozens of friendly racers* sending me setups or helping me to figure out why my lap was a load of toss.

It's also a big incentive to put in loads of effort to improve whenever I race against any of those people.

Quote from The Moose :

Coming from nKPro, LFS seems about as far from exclusivity as you can get

I can imagine that, definitely. The LFS community is almost entirely made up of online people. I hesitate to say online racers because there's definitely a degree or two of separation between the forum users and the online racers, these days. A lot of people do a lot of one and not much of the other. Involvement in the LFS community can happen at any level you want. Start a team, skin a car, make a mod, run a server.. or just get in there and get known for being good to race with. Of all the things I'm involved in with LFS, when someone said "ahh yeah, SamH.. he's good to battle wheel to wheel with, and rarely screws up", I felt the best by far.

Quote from The Moose :

at least you can do some racing more often than once a fortnight with LFS

hehe! A LOT more often than..!!

For me the community actually got smaller since I left UK shores and moved to NZ.

There are only a few servers up and active and a smallish pool of regular players. Its a good group and noobs/wreckers are handled well most of the time.

I know what you're saying Woz. If I go online on weekday evenings there are usually only a couple of servers with a decent race going, and you get to know the guys pretty well as it's usually the same old bunch! Having said that, it's been a while since I've raced!

Out here in western Canada, there are usually only a relatively small number of people online when I'm available. Whereas during peak playing times in Europe there may be 600+ licensed users online, in my timezone there are usually only around 40+.

So, the more the merrier as far as I'm concerned.

I wish I knew why LFS has a much higher percentage of users from Europe than from North America (and Asia, Australia, South America etc for that matter). Does anyone know if the relative numbers of users for other online racing sims is similar (i.e. mostly European players with a relatively small proportion from other regions) or is it peculiar to LFS?

I want it to become huge! On other games there are thousands of servers with people playing. Want to race the LX6 at Westhill? choose one of the 20 nearly full servers running it that day. Doesn't that sound better than hotlapping alone because you're part of an 'exclusive' community?

I voted that I'm not fussed.

It's nice that the forum community is pretty close-knit, but the majority of racers don't browse the forums anyway, so it's reasonable to assume that this won't change if new people start playing too.

Also, I'd like to see more populated servers with more combos, and for that we definitely need more people.

Quote from BuddhaBing :

Out here in western Canada, there are usually only a relatively small number of people online when I'm available. Whereas during peak playing times in Europe there may be 600+ licensed users online, in my timezone there are usually only around 40+.

So, the more the merrier as far as I'm concerned.

Not only that, but 70% of them are either in a drift server or a city server, thus we only have a handful of servers that may have 6 or so racers in each. Not that it's tough to get good racing somewhere in these few servers with low number of racers, it's that three of them are gauranteed to be AS3/GTR, BL1/FOX, AS2/FOX, and an oval. That leaves the STCC (which is up and down with quantity of racers) and DSR (?) which is usually 3 or 4 racers.

Quote :

I wish I knew why LFS has a much higher percentage of users from Europe than from North America (and Asia, Australia, South America etc for that matter). Does anyone know if the relative numbers of users for other online racing sims is similar (i.e. mostly European players with a relatively small proportion from other regions) or is it peculiar to LFS?

I have been wondering this for quite some time. I've never done any other sim online. The new ones I can't run due to graphics, and I haven't loaded up NR2003 since I found LFS. Is it that there are not many sim racers in the US? Or is it that they are all racing another sim? NR2003 I do know is still big in the US. You can tell that from the prices on e-bay.

I like the community to be exclusive, exclusive for race and cars lovers.
That's the way to be. As we will never get enaugh to say:" This is a simulator", so it's so well realized that can really improve your driving, and i can say with motivation, that it will be definitely a step ahead other sims, always.
I'm just sorry that i think the devs team is actually made by too few people, but time will surely bring us better results, aiming to perfection.
So, considering those points, it's good the community to be exclusive, and i hope it will rest, not ike a Call of duty community or Unreal, where everyone can play, u have to drive fast if u wanna be part of this community, and have the right hardware, so if u got balls, u reach results, and get better training and training again, and triyng setups, if not, go to play need for speed or... miromachines

LFS IN MY HEART FOR EVER

Hey, Micromachines 2 rules! Still the best 4-player Megadrive game ever

Lol, i loved it, i played it on my amiga 500 16 years ago

I believe that anyone entitled to fully use LFS can do whatever they like, provided they respect both the license agreement and the specific rules of the servers they join, so this exclusivity concept sounds a bit odd to me. I don't feel I'm part of a club or that I'm special just for using a piece of software. I don't believe in religious wars. I just consider software as a medium, and LFS happened to be the right medium for my needs and likings. Anything else, including how some people use LFS, isn't important to me, as long as I am able to do what I want without too many hassles.

Yes yes, i agree, i didn't mean to say that who can drive have to use lfs, and who dont, have not.
I think it's just a natural selection: who can drive, starts using lfs, and then feels that can improve, and passion for motorsports bring him to go on and try; a simple gamer instead, try to drive, feels he can't do that well and cannot improve -> play miromachines
In a different way, but i think we are speaking the same, so: everyone who gets what he needs from lfs, use it -> lfs can give what a person wants, only if that person loves racing (i think) don't u think?
I don't feel special cos i use lfs, i just love it cos it's the purge valve for my racing needs, as i can't race really for obvious money missing

Quote from Albieg :

I believe that anyone entitled to fully use LFS can do whatever they like, provided they respect both the license agreement and the specific rules of the servers they join, so this exclusivity concept sounds a bit odd to me. I don't feel I'm part of a club or that I'm special just for using a piece of software. I don't believe in religious wars. I just consider software as a medium, and LFS happened to be the right medium for my needs and likings. Anything else, including how some people use LFS, isn't important to me, as long as I am able to do what I want without too many hassles.

Many people's involvement with Live For Speed goes way beyond just using the software. So LFS is useful or important or engaging to many people thanks to all of the aspects that make up the community itself. Some people get a special feeling for being involved with the LFS community (and its projects) that doesn't come from actually using the software.

Quote from Bob Smith :

LFS isn't exclusive, it's just not that well known (compared to racing sims sold in shops and promoted).

I would say the general strength of the community seems a bit weaker than it used to be, when it's small you become a big bunch of mates, sadly that feeling can only go when there's thousands of members chatting away. Us regular old timers will still remember one another though. Just keep coming to the regional meets, or if they don't exist in your country, make them happen.

I agree completely.

LFS is inclusive not exclusive.

If it cost £5000.00...
or required a motion simulator seat...
or you needed at least one world record before you could play online...
or a supercomputer was required as minimum spec to run it...
or you had to be at least 15th in line to the throne...

That would make it exclusive...

As it is, all you need is a basic PC and a basic internet connection...
The community is somewhat exclusive (you need to shell out £24 for an S2 licence... WOW)... so its about as exclusive as any downloadable game ?

I like that level of exclusivity

I perfectly understand that Gunn. What you say isn't in opposition to what I've said. I simply disagree with some of the people who think that LFS should be just for this or for that. In this, I treat software as software, and people as people.

Yes albieg, it's normal to do that, maybe i have some troubles with english, but i don't make any discrimination abou software and people.
When i talk about hardware, i meant that u have to own at least a good FF wheel to really enjoy and perform in LFS, and i absolutely don't think that who use LFS is better than who don't.
LFS is for everybody, and it's a good thing, but performing cos u love racing and being active part of a community, discussing about setups and sharing it etc. is another thing, that's what i consider exclusivity.
I think that there's a difference between a person who spend 240 € to buy a G25 and tries to get a stcc licence seriously or to sign on european championships, and someone who drives with mouse and have fun racing occasionally.
About myself,i'm proud to be part of this community, and i feel lucky about this it's just the most exciting thing i've ever found on the web . And as i think about what it will become in the next year, i get more and more excited.

You know, the only real advantage I can see of the "good ol days" over now
is that there seemed to be more racing going on during the N. American timeslots. And it seemed when you played, everyone sorta knew everyone else. Wreckers were a non-issue. LOL yeah, it was good as long as you liked MRTs on S.City Classic.

I only play on the weekends mostly anymore and I'll say this, There's alot more people, A LOT more people and actually more variation now on the weekends than the "good ol days". AS for more wreckers, there are a few more than what I'd care for, but still not all that many. I only really see one like once or twice a month.

I really don't think Exclusivity (is that a REAL word?) is the right way to describe the "good ol days" There was no sort of snobbiness or elitism what soever back then. If fact, it was more of a cult. If a newbie showed up - we all sank our hooks in them and tried to keep them from leaving

I see more arrogant attitudes now to tell the truth, but again not enough to really be bothered with.

Exclusivity? Maybe the word "Isolationist" instead? No wait: Isolateded. yeah, that.

i just wish more people in the sim community respected it, i dont think its very well understood judging by peoples reaction to it outside of the lfs community

Quote from DodgeRacer :

i just wish more people in the sim community respected it, i dont think its very well understood judging by peoples reaction to it outside of the lfs community

Thats a good point...and as a sim it's so much better than GTR,GTR2 and R-factor, yet they, for some reason, get all the plaudits. It's a funny old world

You're right. But remember, the more is a simulator real, the more is difficult to master it... i think this explain everything

Quote from ScorpioGT :

You're right. But remember, the more is a simulator real, the more is difficult to master it... i think this explain everything

I don´t think it explains everything... We can´t forget that it isn´t sold in stores, isn´t published by a company with all the marketing envolved, or endorsed by a real world racing organization. Anyway I don´t think that the correct term for LFS is exclusivity. Anybody can buy the game and it isn´t more expensive than other racing games... I´d prefer the word independent, and for me that´s a great thing, since that way, the development of the game is the sole responsability of the devs and the LFS community, and not dictated by outside pressures in terms of sales or benefits to others involved.

I think the term exclusivity is very bad wording if you take a look at all those people who actually critizise LfS with exactly the same word, only with a negative meaning to it...

And no, I never felt LfS was "exclusive" because it just isn't... Only in very few other games I got such a warm welcome and there always is someone who helps starters to get to grips with LfS... The only thing why LfS isn't much known is because neither you can find it on the shelves of a store nor can you find any advertisement (other than word-of-mouth and some members taking action)...