HI,

As you might have heard, these 'Hybrid' tyres are taking over BLGP in XFG Gti cars..
It used to be good, we set the cars up on our own knowledge with normal tyres, then oneday someone tryed 'hybrids'.. It was ok at the start they weren't as fast, becuase no one knew how to drive them, now every one can't drive without them!!
You cannot win a race on road normal tyres, unless something happens to the leader.
Eg. The world record at BLGP is with 4 hybrid tyres, they will last 2 laps max. in a race.
You have to atleast run hybrids on the back to get anywhere in the hotlap charts, unless you're a freak like Fabio M.G or PartyboyU etc.
Fabio M.G is the only person ever to go under 1.32.00 with road normals... He will NOT drive untill somehow we fix this problem by not allowing these hybrid tyres on the normal road track... I don't like these hybrids either, they are faster, yes... but it's not real driving, you can stuff up a lap and only lose maybe 1 tenth or 2.. on road normals as most of you know, it's greater than that.
I do strongly agree that these tyres should be banned, I won't lie, yes i use these tyres, and have done fast times with them (1.32.00).. that is only becuase it's impossible to race people without them...

Kind regards, and thanks for your time,
[DUcK]

banned only for non rally-x tracks presumably?

speaking of hybrids, how about introducing some petrol/electric cars? considering how much fuel we seem to burn...

In real life, hybrids do grip better than normal road tyres, but do not last as long. So what you are basically saying is like saying that R2 and R3 tyres should be banned because they grip more than R4's and that of course is illegal, right? No - one should simply have different setups for different lenght races as with the GTR cars - Hybrid/Hybrid, Normal/Hybrid and Normal/Normal. For hotlapping and 1-2 lap races, Hybrid/Hybrid. For 3-5 lap races Normal/Hybrid and for more Normal/Normal. What's wrong with that? Have you seen where the tyre temperatures go on hotlaps in the GTR cars? 100+ degrees. Do you think you could use that setup in a race? No. But for qualifying? Yes. Same principle.

EDIT: If you don't want to use Hybrids, set up a 15 lap race server - problem solved. If you want to test skills on both types of tyres set it up with a 15min qualy + 15 lap race. To get infront on the qualifying people would use Hybrids and to last in the race they would have to use Normals. One has to do the same thing in races in the GTR cars and it makes it more interesting as you need to be able to drive on both types of tyres, meaning you need more skill. If you don't have it - tough.

Bluntly banning the rallytires on asphalt tracks wouldn't be fun to everybody who drives and makes rally autox tracks.... Much better fix would be that server owner could allow certain settings that you can change, but is it doable and sensible.....

I think the hybrids need to heat up and wear even more than they do at the moment on tarmac.. I can do 4-5 laps no problem with Hybrid/Hybrid setup at race pace (for me thats mid 132xx to low 133xx) and can easily do 12-15 maybe more with Normal/Hybrid setups... (this is with xf gti on blgp)

Quote :

In real life, hybrids do grip better than normal road tyres, but do not last as long.

I think thats a bit to much generalized. There are many differnt tyres which would fit the category "Hybrid" and most of them are available in different compounds and with different tread depths. Without having more specs of the LFS tyres its just speculation.

It comes down to whether the devs have any intention of simulating racing series' or just the cars and tracks. IRL there would probably be only one tyre to choose from in a surfaced-road championship running a car like the GTi, and it certainly would not be a rallyx hybrid tyre, it might or might not be a tyre of higher-performance than the road-normal, but that's a slightly different matter.
Even if it's good that people have the freedom to use whatever tyres on whatever track, I think it's necessary for a server to be able to simulate competition rules. Forcing a tyre type (or compound even) is probably one of the most obvious ones.

*I hope some future LFS cars come with only one tyre to choose from, along with other regulations/restrictions that will bring the car closer to a competition car of its type. Tyre choice isn't a part of every level/type of motorsport.

Quote from sinbad :

Even if it's good that people have the freedom to use whatever tyres on whatever track, I think it's necessary for a server to be able to simulate competition rules. Forcing a tyre type (or compound even) is probably one of the most obvious ones.

*I hope some future LFS cars come with only one tyre to choose from, along with other regulations/restrictions that will bring the car closer to a competition car of its type. Tyre choice isn't a part of every level/type of motorsport.

You're slightly contradicting yourself here. I would be very much in favour of servers being able to restrict tyre type, compound (and amount, and a whole lot else), but I would rather not see these restrictions institutionalised in a car. I say, leave all the options open, and allow servers/leagues to enforce whatever rules they want.

well, just drive "real" races which are longer. It's actually real, that hybrids produce more grip than roadtires. So why bother? Well, if you stay for hotlapping and short races, fine fine. But if you go to 10-20 laps on BL, then it will change. so why bother? In a league you can control it anyway, and there you have the competition enviroment anyway...

Nothing un-realistic with how LFS simulates hybrids being faster, just how many stock hatch series allow you to run hybrid tires?

Quote from bobvanvliet :

You're slightly contradicting yourself here. I would be very much in favour of servers being able to restrict tyre type, compound (and amount, and a whole lot else), but I would rather not see these restrictions institutionalised in a car. I say, leave all the options open, and allow servers/leagues to enforce whatever rules they want.

I don't think I'm contradicting myself. With the current crop of cars I'd like the option to force competition rules, but with future cars I'd like certain rules, restrictions and limitations to be built in permanently. This is what might happen if LFS were to ever actually get the license to a proper racing series. Maybe you'd look at that as a bad thing, I don't know.


@V: Why not make it possible to to prevent the use of Hybrids on public servers? You concede that leagues would have reason to do the same thing manually. It's not about length of races, it's about people, new people, not knowing what is going on, and wondering why the obvious choice for a road-race is not the fastest.
Maybe I'm being hyper-critical (it won't be the first time) but most races are 5 lappers (tops) and to newbies road-race=road-tyre, rallyx=hybrid or knobblies. The fact that this has to be explained and argued about is reason enough to do something about it (In my most humble of opinions). Why not just make the obvious and correct choice the only choice and save any debate over people running races that are too short.

call for moderator....this guy made 2 treads to the same thing please close 1....
one in bug section and this one here in general discussion.
to topic: he even said he drives too with hybrids, and i bet he like it, even when he says no.
who wouldnt like a faster setup?

don't close one, just merge them

Hi!

I'd like to dedicate something to the Fabio Fan Club :P

Cheers,
csimpok

OT: Victor - can you put in an emoticon for :P, cos it's used a lot, and it always appears as text, which I find disappointing

Edit: testing the solution shown below:

:P <--large P
<-- small p

Oooooh, it works

Let's just use hybrids while we can! Use a small 'p' instead

Wouldn't Road Supers solve this dilemma without the need to change anything else? I wouldn't go anywhere near a track with Road Normals (well, I wouldn't go anywhere near a racetrack with a hatchback either, but if I did I'd want some decent rubber on it). Lots of boos and hisses for road normals in general from this corner.

I opened a thread about the hybrid tyres two weeks ago. We discussed it there:

http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?t=2500

Quote from axus :

If you don't want to use Hybrids, set up a 15 lap race server - problem solved. If you want to test skills on both types of tyres set it up with a 15min qualy + 15 lap race. To get infront on the qualifying people would use Hybrids and to last in the race they would have to use Normals. One has to do the same thing in races in the GTR cars and it makes it more interesting as you need to be able to drive on both types of tyres, meaning you need more skill. If you don't have it - tough.

For this it must be an option, to use the same set in race what you used in the qualify.
The best if it would be a server option ... Not too hard to code, I think