GT2 class doesn't mean the drivers are slower - they are not. In fact racing in slower class is harder cause of constant looking at the map and mirrors paying attention to faster cars approaching but NOT moving for them (GT1 can go around on the straights quite easily wherever they choose, thats the common practice). GT2 drives their own race, equally important to GT1.
Hardest decision for teams will be choosing the class I guess.
MoE has always wanted to have multi-class racing, we just never had enough cars on the track to do it. It's not "just because we can", it is because they want to, and always have.
You pretty much answered that yourself!
That is exactly what it is. You keep speaking of motivation, that is a good thing isn't it?
Tell me, at least 1 hour into our endurance races, some teams are already +1 or +2 laps down... do you REALLY think they can un-lap themselves? What if we had all 27 cars being GT1... and you were 27th and many laps down. The only teams that will try to catch up are ones that are able to, and all others will just quit. We've seen that plenty of times throughout the season, and that is just with a 18 car grid!
If you think something magical is going to happen, and teams will suddenly be on par with tons of other teams, think again.
All I'm saying is that MoE should be like it is. The slower teams should be motivated to strive for positions - and c'mon... I didn't mean during one single race :| If MoE was at that level, then I really wouldn't care about this, but the thing is that MoE is much more than that which is why I'm against splitting up the attending teams.
I also said I don't mind mixed classes, but do it in another league. MoE is working fine as it is.
There really isn't any point in having discussion about it. In the end it's up to the organizers. But a definitive -1 from me, if that counts for anything.
I meant during the whole season. I didn't see many teams improve and strive to become better. Everyone pretty much got their rightful positions throughout the entire season. And everyone drives at their full potential.
Oh well, I think some people will say they don't like the idea of 2 classes, but then if MoE goes forward with this, everyone racing under 2 classes will have positive reactions I am sure, once they give it a try.
I like Misko's idea about identifying the cars for GT2 with some kind of stripe on the back.
2-3 GT1 cars in close battle with eachother lapping 2-3 GT2 cars in close battle with eachother all at the same time on the same straight/corner/sequence, trying to find space around and grab some opportunity in the process (while keeping it safe) is whats difficult and fun and satisfying. And that going on and on for 6, 12, 24 hours. Of course it has nothing to do with F1 lapping. This is two races going on at the same time. It seems you never been there.
Actually, that is the way MoE was planned from the very beginning on. Us organizers are avid fans of sports car racing and especially of the races sports cars are made for: endurance. The big idea behind MoE was to recreate the sensation of the LMS/ALMS, including their two biggest racing, the Sebring 12h and of course the 24h of Le Mans.
We were stuck with the limited racer space LFS had given us and we needed to find a way to work around the limited spec space as well. That was the sole reason why there only was one class when we started out. I do believe you can find older posts that mentioned the possibility of multi class racing once LFS allows for it by more server room. If not, I can show you a handful of IRC logs of the time even before we announced the project.
If we had sports prototypes we would be longing not only for two classes, but 3-4, just as it is in real sportscar racing. Endurance racing is not only about competing with cars as fast as yours. It also is about managing the race just fine, coping with the situations at hand and coexisting with other class cars. It is not hotlapping nor "make room I am quicker" racing. It is racing with your heart, soul and head.
Moving to two class racing will allow us to get one step closer to our ultimate goal: recreating the ultimate endurance racing experience. The next pieces will be changing light and weather, but that, I am afraid, is out of our hands to realize. I am sure if you give the two class racing and the new challenges it brings a chance, you will know what we mean what an endurance racing experience is. Part of it is that you accept slower class cars not as roadblock, but as fellow competitors.
Oh and btw, keep in mind that there have been numerous sportscar races won by "slower" classes. Just recently, the LMP2 Porsche RS Spyder beat the LMP1 Audi R10 in Long Beach. 2003 the Porsche GT3RS, a GT2 car, took overall honors at the 24h of Spa over the GT1 class cars. In 1979, Le Mans was won by a Porsche 935, basically a GT1 class car today, over a sports prototype.
Have you thought about the numbers for each class?
I proposed something like 15 GT1, and 12 GT2. That is plenty for each. Or if GT1 needs more priority, just make it 17 GT1 and 10 GT2.
I know that when I was racing on AS GP in the 24 hour race, yes it did feel lonely with 16 or so GT1 cars on the track, but I can only imagine how often I'll see other cars with nearly as many GT2 cars on track woo hoo. That makes for a lot of action in the corners and people to draft . Really changes the racing atmosphere for all the cars.
As Hoellsen said, the LMP2 cars have sometimes beaten the LMP1 cars. The Porsche's and Zyteks have beaten or even out-qualified them numerous times .
Of course, if we had a power-limited pack of GTRs for GT2, they obviously wouldn't get pole position, but hell... it is possible for them to even be ahead of some GT1 cars I imagine.
Just to be clear - to me, MoE is kinda like F1 - the ultimate in LFS Community.
I will respect your decisions and then take it from there. I've only expressed my opinion, hoping it would have any kind of influence.
I'm aware of what mixed class racing is about and you can rest assured that I would rather attend a mixed class than a hot lap league :P But I really don't consider MoE as a hot lap league.
How would qualifing work? Ovcourse every team is going to want to be in the GT1 class and nothing less, I was thinking about an event or the first event in all GT1 and just split then following the results, but with races allways being full of time outs and black screens it could be somewhat of a lottery for the peopl who often suffer from the above.
I really like the idea of restircted GTR's, even though I really liked the idea of 28 teams competing, the GT2 class would be quite exiting.
Changes are good though, if nothing changed it would get boring, so bring it on.
But also a major flaw would be that if a team had problems, then they could purposely try and finish at the cut-off point where the results are split (so they'd get a win in the 2nd half group).
Not everyone will want to be in GT1... but at least the biggest and fastest teams will give GT1 a shot, no doubt. GT2 can still be a worthwhile group to win a season in, so I think a lot of other teams we have never seen before in MoE, will participate in GT2.
There were 23 scoring teams last season, there could definitely be room for more great teams. Of those 23, I'd say about 6 of them would make a move to GT2.
With a modest 5 race experience in MoE GT in the GT2 class last season, I'd say that two classes bring more challenge for the GT1 cars. If it didn't have any effect I'm sure we hadn't seen any accidents caused by the faster cars while they were making their dangerous and silly overtaking attempts. Going outside then inside and then overtake outside in a fast sweeping corner and not waiting for the straight can cause havoc and ruin races. I think overtaking a slower car really shows what are the drivers made off.
Is there 27 teams that are all capable of driving at a suitable standard? Its not individual drivers either, its teams of 6 drivers and a team might be called to use more than that on occasions (6 for 24hr, maybe 1 or 2 'new' drivers may be needed in other rounds) and they have to be of a standard where they're not going to make silly mistakes and spoil races.
We quit the LFS GT series because there were leading GT1 cars making bad mistakes, the explanation that they have to be given a chance to prove themselves was so-so as a reason to accept them in, but will that be good enough for MoE proper??
Last season a few teams stepped in when there was spaces and did well, and for those 3-4 teams im sure they'll only improve the series competitiveness throughout the field, however i have reservations about the other 7 or so teams after those that competed in a round or more last series.
If MoE is the pinical of LFS Racing then the standard of driving needs to reflect that, having 27 teams is great, but I just hope that there arent teams in there who are effectively there to make up the numbers, they may have every intention of doing well, but i've seen the LFS GT standard and some just arent ready for this level IMO.
If someone can say theres 25+ teams perfectly capable of driving side by side each other then what the hell, 1 class or 2, doesnt make much difference as it should be a great series. Call it elitest or whatever you want to call it, but MoE shouldnt be a free-for-all series, it should be locked and only the best need apply. If you dont make the grade you dont get a spot. Personally i dont think we'd get more than 22-24 suitable teams but i'd be happy to be proved wrong .
Fantastic, so is that Cyber putting themselves forward for the GT2 class? How about Thunder & Ocrana or whatever they're called this year?
Now that we can add 4 more cars to the grid (31?), We better get moving to see just how many devoted teams will participate.
I've put together a list of teams from last season and teams I think could fit in with MoE...
Previous Season Entrants (some teams removed because they are no longer around)
Cyber Racing
tHUNder Racing
OCRANA/SK
Mercury Racing Team
1ST Racing
GRENTIS Racing Team
pod - virtual gaming
#low racing
master blasters
HFD Racing
n!faculty
Pedal To The Metal
Clownpaint
team XFR
Triple 7 Racing
Zwarte Wind Racing
iNf!N!tY*Skills
Prodrive Racing
Scirocco Players
Shock.fx
Muroc Racing Team
Possible New Entrants? (in no particular order, and just a bunch of chosen ones from a list)
spdo Racing (FOX drivers mostly)
vMaxSR
CeRT (Czech e-Racing Team - dead?)
SCR (can aussies play?)
triso racing (dead?)
dSRC (they've got to play someday!)
A-Spec Russian Team
CoRe Racing
MRNL (dead?)
KR - Krautracing
SCCC
n1 racing
Team Inferno
VB - Vipers Do Brazil
ELITE Squad
Everlast Racing
Burnout Crew
UKCT? (lol)
SERT - Serbian Racing Team
FRH - French Racing Highschool?
Team Den Blå Avis
DSR - Dark Side Racing
DBP - Driven By Passion
XP - Xpower Racing
DR - Dynamic Racing
TPS
ZT
FPR
And I still have trouble finding 30+ fast teams that will for sure be devoted to this series and have plenty of drivers to choose from. Definitely should still only allow 1 team to enter per car. Of this list, I think you could get all of them together for this series. We'll just have to see.
Didnt TPS and (bn.) particpated in LFS GT? From the results say seemed quite competitiv. What about ZT they are organising the 24 hour race, they are damn fast.
and FPR would like to enter, no matter if its the girls car , lets see we'll try to apply for a place when registration is open.
I'd just like to point out that we have broadened our sights, and have been driving the FZR along with some of the road cars a lot recently! 2 pole positions and a couple of second places behind infinity and TPS in our first two team races (LFS GT) .
That list is based on my knowledge of teams that have had prior experience in leagues, and are known to be fair and smart on the track. Correct me if I am wrong, you are fairly new, and I haven't got the slightest clue who you are or how fast you guys are.
I am sure there will be tryouts so you guys can prove if you are worthy.
woo hoo. That makes for a lot of action in the corners and people to draft 
, lets see we'll try to apply for a place when registration is open.