I noticed recently on one server a really fast guy hotlapping AS National Consistently in 1:40xx in an fzr (I was spectating to find out where I myself am losing time) and about 3 laps from the end he came up against a slower guy in the middle of T1 as the faster guy was travelling about 30k faster he clipped the slower guys rear and then promptly tried to vote him off.

Tottaly uncalled for in my opinion as the fast guy has to realise there is slower and more inexperienced racers on track using crap setups and remember they are in a race and should act accordingly.

Remember you fast guys - there is usually someone watching just to learn your lines etc so act like an ass and it gets noted

In the case above the slower driver may not have had a decent setup and therefore was unable to correct his line mid corner or lacked the skill to do so.

Quote from Mykl :

but it's the times when people use it in a certain tone that it really gets on my nerves.

And therein is the biggest flaw in internet forums...things often come across in a completely different 'tone' or manner than they were meant. But without boring everyone to tears with long winded explanations of everything we say it's always going to be that way

Quote from mrodgers :

All this talk of people spamming "Blue Flag, move NOOB!", generally calling people noobs, and general noobish behavior is truely surprising me. I see nearly everthing is being commented from over there where the main base of LFS is.

I've been racing nearly nightly for 2 years now with LFS. I am now pretty much exclusively on the STCC servers. I have to say, I rarely see folks doing all this chat yelling or noobish behavior. I can't count how many times I've run up on a guy a lap down or a midrace joiner who pulled over and let me by in the last few weeks. I have seen on occasion the "Blue Flag" spam, but it is rare. I also often see on the map someone just joined and is coming down pitroad when I'm coming by and I see them easing down the exit waiting for traffic to pass.

Yes, I do see this stuff, the blue flag spam, the blue flag ignorers, the midrace joiners entering the track in traffic, but it is very very rare. Another thing I don't see often is racers getting irate over being crashed. This is probably the one thing that happens more than the others, but it is still not all that bad. I will see someone crash another racer, the sorry pop up in chat, and a "np" or "no problem" follow. Lately, I have even seen the majority of crashes followed up with the guy who crashed the other waiting for the one he crashed to resituate himself and take the position back.

I do follow these topics that pop up on the forum and do comment sometimes, but it isn't because I see it as often as I'm led to believe judging from the comments of the UK/Europe based community.

Anyone else over here in the US/Canada base agree or disagree with this? I'm really curious.

We don't generally see this type of behavior any more on our servers or the other servers here in the states.
It used to be much more frequent but I think the majority of the currently active LFS users in the US have been around awhile and have gotten thru that what seems to be a typical growth stage within the community.

To be honest it's been sooooo loong that I've seen someone getting votebanned by other racers, or to even see a vote ban going on. It used to happen sometimes when I was racing at as3/GTRs about a year ago but since the wreckers barricade was launched I've seen very few wreckers, and idiots in general. Of course there are some bad apples but as to my understanding these are getting rarer and rarer. I have't really done that much racin on STCC servers because the FXO is overkill and boring. Of course there is some bad drivers who push and nudge you all the time but usually I just leave. No point to race if it isn't fun

Imho, the best thing to do is to take things with humour, just a joke or two with a hidden message about blue flags and proper racing lines goes through much better, although only server admins who can follow the situation can really tell if there was anything learned.

Quote from Hyperactive :

To be honest it's been sooooo loong that I've seen someone getting votebanned by other racers,

Kev voted to ban Hyperactive (1/2)

Quote from thisnameistaken :

Kev voted to ban Hyperactive (0/48)

Fixed it for you

Quote from Hyperactive :

I have't really done that much racin on STCC servers because the FXO is overkill and boring.

Ok, i know its slightly OT , sorry to the OP, but this 'FXO' bullshit is starting to pee me off.
There is nothing boring about racing the FXO against other FXO's. The XRT is more challenging and fun to learn, as I'm now discovering, but i have no problem jumping back in the FXO if there's other FXO's on the grid.
It's a crap argument.
It doesn't matter what car your racing, as long as others are racing it too.
Being the only FXO against a load of XRT's is indeed overkill.

Racing lawn mowers isn't boring if your racing people in equal machinery.
If your bored of racing FXO's against other FXO's, then your bored of racing, full stop.

IMHO of course

minor rant over

sorry..better get back to topic before i get into trouble

Quote from The Moose :

Ok, i know its slightly OT , sorry to the OP, but this 'FXO' bullshit is starting to pee me off.
There is nothing boring about racing the FXO against other FXO's. The XRT is more challenging and fun to learn, as I'm now discovering, but i have no problem jumping back in the FXO if there's other FXO's on the grid.
It's a crap argument.
It doesn't matter what car your racing, as long as others are racing it too.
Being the only FXO against a load of XRT's is indeed overkill.

Racing lawn mowers isn't boring if your racing people in equal machinery.
If your bored of racing FXO's against other FXO's, then your bored of racing, full stop.

IMHO of course

minor rant over

sorry..better get back to topic before i get into trouble

It is Kev's fault that we are off-topic, so we might as well keep on going

The FXO is a FWD car. That basically means that it is impossible to spin with too much throttle. It is also a lot easier to drive than XRT making it easier to make mastaskilled racing moves and start accelerating earlier. Throttle control is easier too with FXO, it is just understeer what you may get. FXO is also easier to drive fast, I am not a fast driver but with FXO for me it is a lot easier to get close to the wrs than with XRT. The FXO is also quite hard to get upset by wrong inputs or driving over the kerbs too aggressively. With XRT even the normal corner exits are harder because you need to get back on power more carefully and control the car with throttle as well. With FXO you just keep the nose pointing right direction and if it is looking like going wide, just lift it a bit. Imho FXO is repetitive and gives me no real feeling of driving. Of course it is nice that you can get those easy wins with FXO but there is very little challenge in that car.

I just find it boring and repetitive Luckily the W9 patch game me finally the incentive to learnt he XRT properly. With preload it is just a great piece to drive, so controllable and still needs to be tidy to go fast


H. Active
-----------
Dedicated FXO hater
90210 Beverly hills

Big problem i've encountered now being Silver STCC is that i'm using an old Microsoft sidewinder FF wheel (Gameport Version) so I have to use buttons for throttle and brake due to lack of driver support for pedals hence XRT is hopeless and no access to FXO as you need gold I also hate the RB4 I call it the wallowing Pig

hence my slow times on silver and gold server - my career is at a sloooow pace at present

Quote from Hyperactive :

Of course it is nice that you can get those easy wins with FXO but there is very little challenge in that car.

I know what your saying about it being easy to drive.... but it's still not easy to win if your racing against other FXO's...that's all i was saying. Against equal opposition it still comes down to the driver.
I just cant find driving any of the cars boring and repetitive if your involved in good close racing.

Having said that, i'm enjoying driving the XRT now, its fun to learn..and requires a far more GPL style technique, but when it comes down to it i don't care what i'm racing as long as the racing is good and close, That why i've joined the UF1000 league and i cant wait for the STCC open wheeler servers either....i just love that F08

Quote from Hyperactive :

It is Kev's fault that we are off-topic,

Always happy to oblige.

Quote from Hyperactive :

H. Active
-----------
Dedicated FXO hater

Did you ever see my FXO skin?

Quote from thisnameistaken :

Always happy to oblige.

np

Quote from thisnameistaken :

Did you ever see my FXO skin?

Awesome, is it public?

With the patch it is quite fun that the XRT&RB4 and FXO are so close (i think they are) that it possible to have quite nice races between all threee cars. And now the FXO isn't the only trying to pass. TBO at best, different cars, different characteristics and close racing with small tradeoffs to get equal fields.

FO8 rocks too

Yes, all on topic

Quote from The Moose :

Your correct about it being rare on STCC, well, on Silver+Gold upwards which is where i remember seeing you mostly...

That is because I recently moved to silver license. When I say about STCC, I also include both copper/bronze servers as I ran those servers for quite a long time. Winning in XFG on the S1 server and gaining +5 or +7 points makes for a long stretch to the silver license .

I speak for all server, even Redline that I often see mentioned when talk of "get out noob" comes up. I don't frequent Redline very often as I just don't like the FOX and the same track night after night after night, but in my experience on Redline, I still never saw this type of behavior.

Edit: Lovely FXO skin, Kev. I'm another self-proclaimed FXO hater. As a matter of fact, I hate the whole TBO class! XFG racing FTW!!!!!!!!

Quote from LFSn00b :

If he doesn't make a mistake - ram him off. It's his fault.

No. You can pass him with more brutality but ramming and wrecking will just lead into more trouble.

Quote from LFSn00b :

If he doesn't make a mistake - ram him off. It's his fault.

I don't agree with this attitude at all. If you ram me off the course because you couldn't pass me then it's YOUR fault.

As somebody who tends to be a backmarker when there are *good* drivers on course I will tell you that I'm not moving off the racing line unless I joined mid session. I have the same right to a clean lap as you do.

Half the problem with a backmarker moving off the racing line is that it can be unsafe. Lets say somebody is behind me and wants to pass. I decide to go wide through the turn and let them by on the inside... in their impatience they decide to attempt a pass on the outside... oops, we wrecked, and now I'm getting yelled at on chat.

Lets say I decide to go a little slower through the turn so I can let stay of the racing line and let them by on my left at the exit of a right hand turn. Well crap, they weren't prepared for me to slow down so much... I got tapped and knocked off the course.

Here's what I *will* do... if I see somebody making a move to the inside at an *appropriate* turn I will ease up and let them by. Also, if it is convenient and safe I will lift on a straight away coming out of a turn to allow their momentum to overcome mine before the next braking zone. But if you're not a smart enough racer to see those opportunities, then I certainly don't deserve to be put into the wall for it.

But to expect a blue flagged racer to just jump off the course is wrong, and to actually ram them off the course is even worse.

Quote from LFSn00b :

So... I usually don't do that. But i don't say it's the best idea.

But if the lapped car is blocking, sure you can't do anything else that do a PIT to him.

Ofcourse, it's not the best chance. Neither is yelling "Blue Flag Noob" in chat.

I know ramming isn't a good habit, but i get wrecked nearly every race. Maybe it's my fault - maybe the opponent's. That we will never know.

I usually don't do that ramming thing - I'm a clean racer, with average racing skills. I just said an example of that.

I don't care if i see you do that only once in a blue moon like you say you occasionally do. If I ever see someone doing something that pathetic,taking out a slower driver, then you deserve the "noob" flac from people!

the only times i would ever ram someone is if they joined mid-race and weren't respecting the blue flag, or if they tried a dangerous pass that resulted in them sliding (slowly) across the track in front of me. last night both situations happened in one race, and both times i kept my right foot planted and pushed them out of my way, without even really thinking about it. i felt quite ashamed afterward, even though neither driver complained.

i was a complete noob not too many months ago, not checking my mirrors, braking too late, and generally having so much trouble keeping my own car on the track that i had no brain power left over to keep track of where the other cars were. i upset some people by driving like that, and so i just made sure to be as careful as i could.

now i'm better, but still obviously have some noobish tendencies, being impatient with people blocking me, etc. but we all make progress every day. or at least i like to think we do.

Quote from LFSn00b :

So... I usually don't do that. But i don't say it's the best idea.

But if the lapped car is blocking, sure you can't do anything else that do a PIT to him.

Ofcourse, it's not the best chance. Neither is yelling "Blue Flag Noob" in chat.

I know ramming isn't a good habit, but i get wrecked nearly every race. Maybe it's my fault - maybe the opponent's. That we will never know.

I usually don't do that ramming thing - I'm a clean racer, with average racing skills. I just said an example of that.

But the beginners of LFS - Drive the lessons, it helps a lot to get better.

And remember - RWD is the way to go

/ban FWD

Well ok... you're an average driver, and I'm probably worse than average. But if somebody is hauling around a course 3-4 seconds faster than me then they've probably figured out how to take the really important high speed turns about 3-5 mph faster than me or you. Which basically means that all they have to do is position themselves properly to easily get around me.

I guess on tighter courses this may be a problem though.



I don't mind FWD.

Quote from Mykl :

Yeah, I'm learning to like the STCC servers. Even on the STCC's demo server people are generally well behaved and a joy to drive with.

STCC don't have a demo server - could you provide more information? sounds like someone leaching their name!

Quote from Jakg :

STCC don't have a demo server - could you provide more information? sounds like someone leaching their name!

hmmmm... maybe it was something else... I'll check when I get home. Sorry if I've spread any misinformation.

Indeed, we have never run a demo server for LFS. If people want to be a part of the STCC experience then they need to give the devs some cash. Alas, none of it goes to me !

Quote :

i'm using an old Microsoft sidewinder FF wheel (Gameport Version) so I have to use buttons for throttle and brake due to lack of driver support for pedals

I have the exact same wheel (gameport version) and run XP with SP2. The pedals work fine, save for the fact that the connection into the wheel gets a bit dodgy seeing as it's so old, I had to slightly bend the pins with a screwdriver so that they made contact again, but after that the pedals worked again.

i used to use that wheel (gameport version) and the pedals worked fine (didnt use ANY drivers, just went Game Controllers>Add New)

Quote from LFSn00b :

Excuse me, when did i say i wreck lapped cars if they blocked me?

Quote from LFSn00b :

If he doesn't make a mistake - ram him off. It's his fault.

imo thats COMPLETELY unnaceptable, although luckily for the LFS'ing public the odds of Niko getting a lap over anything thats in motion mean were all safe

There are two things that fairly regularly frustrate me, and it's more experienced guys as well sometimes, not just the new guys...Firstly, as mentioned already, asking for setups during the race, over and over, then complaining because nobody responds (because we're racing). Secondly, someone coming online, one lap into a race and voting to restart continuously, telling everyone else to restart, and then complaining because people don't listen. Those just scream 'lack of respect' to me. I can deal with it now and then, it's just bad when one guy does it and then I see him the next week and he's still doing it and I know he's never going to learn!

just for clarification purposes, the term noob is not a derogatory term, it has been transformed into one but the way that the initial poster used the word is not in any form mean, foul or rude.

"Noob, short for Newbie,

Newbie: a newcomer or novice, esp. an inexperienced user of the Internet or of computers in general."

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