This is a call for testing by the teams.

We need to find some general basis for the class balance. We want to do this early even though there might be changes in the overall game until the season starts.

For now, we would like to do the following:
For GT1 class we need to find out the existing balance the way the game provides it.

For GT2 class, we are aiming ar around 400hp for the cars and then do some necessary adjustments.

Therefore, we would like to ask you guys to do some hotlapping with these configurations (and in all cars) to see how we end up. Pls keep to Kyoto National and Aston North, that should give us a good mix for track characteristics without you having to do 2:40min laptimes.

We are still thinking about having some multiplayer testing this upcoming weekend, but havent finally decided on it yet.

Here are the values you can use to test the GT2 class @ ~400 bhp.

GT1 (W-patch balancing figures):
FXR - 490 bhp (445 bhp/ton)
XRR - 490 bhp (453 bhp/ton)
FZR - 490 bhp (452 bhp/ton)


GT2 (400 bhp class):

FXR - 399 bhp (362 bhp/ton)
17% intake restriction

XRR - 399 bhp (369 bhp/ton)
17% intake restriction

FZR - 400 bhp (369 bhp/ton)
13% intake restriction

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NOTE: This is ONLY an intake restriction test, NO weight added.

If there are distinct advantages with either of the cars, there will have to be changes made with both weight and intake restriction in order for it to meet a decent 400 bhp standard and fair power/weight ratio.

And please inform teammates (or entire team) to try and help. We need as many people testing this as possible .

Report your laptimes on KY NATIONAL and AS NORTH with the GT1 and/or the GT2 class here

Just to give you an idea, here was just a short qualifying session I did with the 3 GT2 cars.

First notes:

Top speeds for all the cars are pretty much the same. Cornering speeds are almost as fast as the normal car, but brake points are a bit later and harder... GT1 cars will definitely be braking earlier.

FXR - Is fast and really easy to push in and out of the corners. Hardly any downforce needed. Car rarely seems out of control.

XRR - Not my best car, but it felt fast for cornering, just couldn't put in a decent time. Rear tire heat was high, maybe it was my setup.

FZR - Fastest by far, so easy to get a faster time. Feels too responsive going into corners and acceleration out is much better than the other two.

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You guys should be able to get faster times then me, this is only my first try for about 30 mins. I took the 3 setups for KY NAT from Inferno Setupfield, and just put the intake restriction on them and had to lower the downforce for all the setups. The cars will be using VERY LOW downforce for sure. Tire management will be a lot better with the GT2 class, as the heat is kept down to a much safer level. You should be able to get away with using hotlap-type pressures and have cool enough tires by the end of your stint. GT2 should also last a few laps longer than GT1 technically :o.

In comparison with these times, I bet the fastest time for GT2 could be a 1:38 - 1:40 or better probably, while GT1 times will be between 1:34 - 1:36. That is pretty good for racing I think... the cars aren't too slow at all, and safe for the track .

erm, i would just like to add a comment maybe.. i know XFR has like 230 hp, so 300 may be little too low a figure.. but for a GT2 class, imho 350 hp would be nice.. cause as far as i'm aware there is no gt400 class in real life racing series.. we could pull it from gt300 to gt350.. but from 490 hp to drop to 400 would make gt2 cars just a bit too fast and not so much different then gt1..

I would have thought 400bhp would have a little high too, if the 90bhp difference equates to a guestimate of 4 seconds slower, then dropping another 50 should be 2sec per lap.

My only concern with car balancing is that it actually ends up being balanced, and that a fastest lap isnt the sole peice of information. It seems the FXR gets f*cked over because its AWD and considered so easy to drive it cannot possibly have the same bph/ton value, but everything should be taken into account, fuel consumption, tyre wear, acceleration, top speed, AND the ease to drive.
It was the slack balancing in the first place that screwed things from the beginning and the tyre changes just extended them further.

If they end up being balanced hot-lap wise but one car can only go 45min on a tyres/fuel and another can only go 50min on tyres/fuel while the another can stretch the full hour, then that isnt balanced. Some things cant be measured, but things like acceleration & top speed can make a car considerably easier to pass others with.

Hopefully everything will be considered and the results will be balanced cars, otherwise this whole thing is a waste of everyones time and we might as well go back to a 95% FZR grid and enjoy the weather.

We are aware of these issues, Paul. We are currently planing to have the hotlapping as a first basis and then conduct a few short test races to figure out the rest.

Sorry if I missed something but why not add some ballast to the GT2 cars? At least the GT2 cars in SuperGT are some much heavier (50kg?) than the GT1 cars...?

Quote from scipy :

erm, i would just like to add a comment maybe.. i know XFR has like 230 hp, so 300 may be little too low a figure.. but for a GT2 class, imho 350 hp would be nice.. cause as far as i'm aware there is no gt400 class in real life racing series.. we could pull it from gt300 to gt350.. but from 490 hp to drop to 400 would make gt2 cars just a bit too fast and not so much different then gt1..

FWD GTRs are out of question, and you cannot increase the power on them, only decrease. They are TOO slow for the track with the GT1 cars around, at most they are always 10 secs slower on any track, that is too slow. And yes, this is done in real racing, there are many series that make different classes by limiting-power. The only drawback we have is that the cars look the same, but MoE will do its best to notice a difference (with an assigned color).

Quote from Hyperactive :

Sorry if I missed something but why not add some ballast to the GT2 cars? At least the GT2 cars in SuperGT are some much heavier (50kg?) than the GT1 cars...?

That will definitely be the next step... they will need some weight added. We don't want to make the cars too slow, but seeing that they brake later and need little downforce, weight will be the next step.

I'd be up for a test race, if you decide to have one.

Tweak, im pretty sure he's not refering either using or making the FWDs faster, but just using them as a reference point.

Using your guestimated times, with a 4 sec gap between classes, you'd be lapping a GT2 class car after 25 laps round a 1m 40 track, tracks like Blackwood would be very tight and you'd probably be passing/lapping about 1.5 cars per lap, but on the KY3 track and huge Aston layouts its not going to be as bad.
I can imagine 70% more cars going round ickle old Blackwood will be quite a task.

I know, but 300 bhp is just too slow, and the intake restriction limits the power in such a way that the car doesn't have a proper feeling powerband. 400 is not too much, nor too little. Afterall, the normal GTR cars aren't really even a GT1 class, they are actually more like a 'uber' GT2 class really. LFS has nothing like a GT1 car. So this is really a lot like having GT2 and GT3 cars on the track if you think about it.

That is the thing, if we start adding weight, then the cars will of course feel a bit 'correct' because of their slower speed, but we can't add too much that it makes drastic changes. Also if we use the 400 bhp as a base for GT2 and do anything else that will make the cars slower, they will be almost too slow in most cases... almost down to the level of the FWD GTRs, which you don't want to have happen.

And with BL1 being the smallest track on the calendar, yeah that is a given, but you really can't take it out of the season because it will be too packed. BL1 is 2.1 miles, and it is pretty much like the finale of ALMS here at Laguna Seca (2.2 mi, and similar laptimes as well). About the same amount of cars are on the track, some retire, but generally the racing is more or less near another car, and if the GT2 cars are at safe enough speeds, passing shouldn't be a problem before and after turns. It will definitely show who is smarter when passing the slower classes, because I know some GT1 cars will be impatient and want to pass right away. At Laguna Seca the slower class cars always give way to the LMP cars (go wide at hairpin or corkscrew), they have to be really generous in their actions, and pay attention to what is behind all the time.

Everyone will know to be safe because of the obvious warning with slow vs. fast, but this is why a good few test races will let us see how the two interact on the track.

I am shooting to see if the GT2 class will be fun to drive also, and not just something that feels like it needs more power. If it is too boring and unsafe, we could always opt for everyone using all normal GTR cars, but split up results based on what class you are entered in... but that can be really skewed perhaps.