Guys, any of you wishing to swap divisions please confirm your interest here!

That includes both people going from 1st to 2nd but also 2nd to 1st.

We have 2 days to sort this out.

Please be aware that if people swap we are not sure what we will do about points.

Obviously we want to keep both leagues as full as possible and have good racing as well

Regards,

Dru.

No thanks PBR are loving DIV 2, I hear moo maybe on there way to div 2? Bring it on danny we have had some good races in the past

Yes, I really want Moo to get moved to division 2. Our only real competition was Evopower and Dynofiend

EDIT: @FOGlegsy - you won't stand a chance

Quote from LFSn00b :

I'll stay in Div 2 if possible =)

you did not even turn up for the first round m8 and without explanation you'll be lucky to be included still ni the league anyhow...

Quote from Dru :

Guys, any of you wishing to swap divisions please confirm your interest here!

That includes both people going from 1st to 2nd but also 2nd to 1st.

We have 2 days to sort this out.

Please be aware that if people swap we are not sure what we will do about points.

Obviously we want to keep both leagues as full as possible and have good racing as well

Regards,

Dru.

no need for yfb ,too. We're happy staying in Div 2...
If we would swarp, one of my aims couldn't be reached: To beat you Dru as often as possible (Once I did it so far )

Quote from Dru :

you did not even turn up

Another no-show from LFSn00b? It's becoming quite a habit. This didn't even require him to get on a plane.
Could be heading for the unenviable title of 'Least reliable person in LFS'

I'm pretty happy in Division 1, but I wasn't really happy with the Sprint race, there were too many incidents where I was crashed into and bumped allover.

Sprint race will always be a bit like that, and the slower end of the pack will have that the most because they're going to have much faster cars needing to get past the slower cars, if it wasnt a reversed grid you'd be fine (or better off) but because you have an inevitable flow of fast cars trying to make their move it'll never be easy.

Because the tracks are small there are less corners, which kinda means few passing corners. If you thought SO2 was hard going in sprint, wait till FE2R!!

Quickly wizzing through the replays i dont think you had anything more than taps, and they werent intentional or anything other than normal door to door, bumper to bumper stuff I see week in week out in DTM, V8's, BTCC & WTCC and is pretty commonplace in any road car based racing. Your biggest problem is going to be the reversed grid, with the faster drivers behind you trying to resume a more natural order. If it was just careless driving and stuff like that i'd understand, but nobody 'crashed' into you, it was all typical racing with minimal contact allowed. If in doubt, request the incident is reviewed, even if its just a small thing and warrents a warning to the other person, its a warning to be a bit more careful which i'd assume is better than saying nothing and allowing similar to continue. If its 'bad' then it'll be taken further.
As i say though, watching your race in full i dont think you had it bad, plenty of paint removed but nothing nasty or particularly careless.

Dear all,

I have received confirmation that Moo racing wish to go to Division 2.

This change will be made from round 2 onwards.

Moo Racing's points will be adjusted based on any finishing times of what points they 'would' have scored. This does NOT affect any Division 2 scorers, and it keeps interest in the league.

Actually in this instance, Niether Moo Racing driver scored ANY points at the first round so this does not affect the points situation at all



I have recived confirmation that Dynomoose racing wish to remain in Division 1.

I have recieved confirmation that PM Ant wishes to stay in the Division 2 championship, there for D1 will be slightly smaller than previous and the grid will be slightly bigger for D2.


Also at present, because of certain ZWR Drivers real life commitments, there looks like there will be some adjustment of driver line ups.

Let me confirm that any 'driver change' is completely legal as long as we are informed before the race of any 'nominateed drivers' to score constructors points.

I also need to ask about promotion to D1.

I looks like I will have to change Divisions from D2 to D1, I want a straw poll to see whether the D1 guys would allow me to have effectively 'scored' points from round 1, based on my race times...

If this was allowed i would have scored a total of 40 points from a 9th placed feature race finish and 12 points from a 10th place finish in the sprint, based on race times.

This would put me 10th in the Div 1 championship.

Please let me have your open opinions.

If i am not allowed these points then i will happily only score constructors points from Round 2 only.

Please bear in mind that this will mean a change in ZWR driver line up

Regards,

Dru.

Shame, I was looking forward to some close racing with you dru.

that's fine by me Dru!

Quote from anttt69 :

Shame, I was looking forward to some close racing with you dru.

I know - organising and racing sux - but the organisation need is greater than my personal need for driver championship...

Yes it would have been great it was looking close, the option of course if for you to come up to div 1 as well Ant, but well, thats your call, again it would be more to do with a closeness of racing rather than a championship run...

Regards,

Dru.

Thanks for sorting it out Dru

I'm looking forward to some more equal competition (I hope) on Thursday

Quote from Dru :

I looks like I will have to change Divisions from D2 to D1, I want a straw poll to see whether the D1 guys would allow me to have effectively 'scored' points from round 1, based on my race times...

If this was allowed i would have scored a total of 40 points from a 9th placed feature race finish and 12 points from a 10th place finish in the sprint, based on race times.

This would put me 10th in the Div 1 championship.

Please let me have your open opinions.

I know I'm not taking part in this competition (I'm just nosey ) but how about giving Div #1 finishers, say, 150% of the points of Div #2 finishers? If you've only run two races so far it shouldn't be too hard to work out the points up until now, and it would make the scoring fairer for people who change divisions.

Quote from thisnameistaken :

I know I'm not taking part in this competition (I'm just nosey ) but how about giving Div #1 finishers, say, 150% of the points of Div #2 finishers? If you've only run two races so far it shouldn't be too hard to work out the points up until now, and it would make the scoring fairer for people who change divisions.

This is both true and untrue

As, at the mo if i do the scores to take me to Div 1 based on my race finishing times from the two races i would be 10th with 40 points.

IF you did 1.5 points for the Div1 guys, then i would be 8th with 97 odd points

also it would mean a big advantage to people dropping from first to second division to then carryon competeing.

The point of this is to adjust once now for the rest of the season, rather than a fluid change division here or there...

so

i think the ruling will be......

Div 1 to Div 2 change, you lose any points you have scored and start again (Moo haven't scored any anyways so this is not a real problem)

Anyone wishing to go up from div 2 to div 1 gets retrospective points based on race times.

This only affects me as i'm the only one foolish enough to go up

So i will start from round 2 in the Div 1 championship with 40 points - this has been asked but apart from Chris who said yes sure - no one else has commented...

Please i give people 24 hours to object to this

Regards,

Dru.

Quote from Dru :

Div 1 to Div 2 change, you lose any points you have scored and start again (Moo haven't scored any anyways so this is not a real problem)

Anyone wishing to go up from div 2 to div 1 gets retrospective points based on race times.

Sorry to keep sticking my oar in, but this seems counter-intuitive to me. Surely points are harder to come by in Div #1, so any points scored in Div #1 should be more valuable than points scored in Div #2. Going by that logic, Div #1 racers moving down a division ought to keep their points and if anything have them valued more highly than points scored by Div #2 racers? Conversely, racers coming from Div #2 to Div #1 ought to have their points devalued because they were earned in an easier division.

I can appreciate that it would be difficult to do it fairly though.

Quote from thisnameistaken :

Sorry to keep sticking my oar in, but this seems counter-intuitive to me. Surely points are harder to come by in Div #1, so any points scored in Div #1 should be more valuable than points scored in Div #2. Going by that logic, Div #1 racers moving down a division ought to keep their points and if anything have them valued more highly than points scored by Div #2 racers? Conversely, racers coming from Div #2 to Div #1 ought to have their points devalued because they were earned in an easier division.

I can appreciate that it would be difficult to do it fairly though.

This is why the only fair way is to do it with race times, all other ways are flawed.

Also people could DELIBERATLY drop down to division 2 just to win the championship as they would start with a larger points haul, also they would be doing it for the wrong reason, I don't want quick drivers going down to div 2 just becuase they don't cut the mustard in div 1, similarly i would prefer people racing in divisions that they are competative in, after all this series is about racing..

The thin with me going up to Div 1 is becuase i'm needed there for the team rather than own personal glory... i'm happy to say that anyone transfering divisions drop the points scored in the other division thats fine, but i'm interested in hearing what people in the league think on the subject hence the question to those guys, which apart from Chris has not been responded too

Regards,

Dru.

Regarding the scoring of it all...
Kev, Dru and myself did some chatting on MSN a few days ago and i randomly took x2 & x0.5 as multipliers for going down or up a division, It was 1pt out for Anttt if he moved and 5.5pts out for Dru if you halved their total score to get one figure, and compared to the method Dru is using which is to use the finishing time to judge where they'd be.

If Anttt was moved to div1 (which IMO he should, he's clearly too fast and seems to want the dull easy win) then his D2 times would have put him 5th and 10th, giving him 58pts. His D2 score was 114, halved would be 57, so as a multiplier its pretty accurate there.
Dru would have been 1 place behind Anttt with 6th and 11th worth 50pts, and his D2 score was 97, halved is 44.5pts

So thats 2 method's we discussed as ways of making it fair, both give results that are pretty close to the alternative method, so i dont see as theres any problem with going with one or the other. I agree points are easier to get hold of in Div2 than Div1, but we've looked at 2 methods of removing any kind of bonus/boost acheived by swapping over,


For the record - I object to Dru moving over with 40pts, i think it should be 45-50. Mainly because thats what would have been have done for Moo if they moved divisions and also Anttt if he were to.
otherwise, no objection to you or anyone else switching over as you'd probably know anyway

Quote from PaulC2K :

Regarding the scoring of it all...
Kev, Dru and myself did some chatting on MSN a few days ago and i randomly took x2 & x0.5 as multipliers for going down or up a division, It was 1pt out for Anttt if he moved and 5.5pts out for Dru if you halved their total score to get one figure, and compared to the method Dru is using which is to use the finishing time to judge where they'd be.

If Anttt was moved to div1 (which IMO he should, he's clearly too fast and seems to want the dull easy win) then his D2 times would have put him 5th and 10th, giving him 58pts. His D2 score was 114, halved would be 57, so as a multiplier its pretty accurate there.
Dru would have been 1 place behind Anttt with 6th and 11th worth 50pts, and his D2 score was 97, halved is 44.5pts

So thats 2 method's we discussed as ways of making it fair, both give results that are pretty close to the alternative method, so i dont see as theres any problem with going with one or the other. I agree points are easier to get hold of in Div2 than Div1, but we've looked at 2 methods of removing any kind of bonus/boost acheived by swapping over,


For the record - I object to Dru moving over with 40pts, i think it should be 45-50. Mainly because thats what would have been have done for Moo if they moved divisions and also Anttt if he were to.
otherwise, no objection to you or anyone else switching over as you'd probably know anyway

+1 for Ant moving but at the end of the day, it's his decision no one is being forced to move, we are moving people who want to race in a better suited division for them on their own request (ala Moo Racing) and I'm moving becuase of Driver commitments and i will be there all season to score constructors points for ZWR in Div 1.

for me, my points aren't important, as an admin i'm lucky that i can be racing at all, however, i'm there to score points for ZWR rather than score individual points for me, personally. but kudos to Paul for at least saying i should get some points to start with whatever people see fair i will adopt , don't want to go and annoy all you lot, afterall it's all of you that are here that is making this league soo great

Regards,

Dru.