Hi, I play lfs demo for a while now, and already tried the full game at a friend's house, since I like to drive IRL sports cars, I try to play lfs the closest possible to RL, so I use g25, no aids, 720 degrees, h-shifter...

the problem is that using this setup I can't be as fast as other drivers (for example on Blackwood I run usually at 1.34 on xfg and 1.25 with xrt) so I can only have fun playing single player or in rare servers where I get some demo players that have lap times close to mine. (there are lots of kb or mouse that run at 1.33 or 1.23 so I don't have any fun and I feel that I'm disturbing the race (never got any complaint since I'm a clean driver and I don't defend my place when the other driver is faster)

so the questions are: are there players with same setups doing competitive times? (so I can have hope to one day make a 1.23 with the xrt ps: I've done it but with 200 degrees, sequential shifter, auto clutch, blip... but with the above setup I feel that's almost impossible)

will it be possible to have servers only running those kinds of setups? so If I buy the game I can play against people that run in the same conditions?

ps: for the ones that will complain about dividing the people: there are already servers that only allow people running faster than for example 1.34 on xfg, or that only allow some cars... so if I can't enter those servers (and I understand why... running bf1 against xfg or players that run 1.38 on a pro server ruins the race) I should be able to enter servers that only allow for more realistic and harder ways... (I know driving with other controls is also hard... but it's possible (just look at wr's, but with setups like mine I dont know if its possible to brake wr's)

Is it possible to run the bf1 using clutch to start but not to change gear like RL? (same for GTR)

I love LFS just feel that some RWD cars (raf, xrt) a bit too hard compared to RL, but heck the RWD cars that I use in RL are better than those

I would already bought the game if there was a retail version... but probably going to buy it online in a few weaks... too much work now... don't want to get distracted.

Long Live LFS

Quote from raizde2 :

Is it possible to run the bf1 using clutch to start but not to change gear like RL? (same for GTR)

The clutch is not needed for shifting the BF1, so yes, you can do this. I think it's required for the GTR cars though.

Quote from raizde2 :

Long Live LFS

Amen.

I didn't think using a g25 was a disadvantage? Have you run faster times using kb yourself?

Quote from raizde2 :

so the questions are: are there players with same setups doing competitive times?

IMHO the extra wheel rotation is probably slowing you down the most. I run my DFP at 420 degrees at the moment because I'm lazy and don't want to be ragging it around after every corner, but I've also found that you can lose a lot of time catching the rear end after a corner when you've got a lot of rotation on your wheel, definitely.

On the other hand I'm pretty sure I'm quicker on most combos now using a clutch pedal, right-foot braking and manual throttle blipping and so on, than I am with left-foot braking, paddle shifters and 200 degrees of steering. It's all about what you're used to.

As for other players: I took part in a race with AndroidXP a few months back in the LX6 around Aston Club, along with a few other very quick racers, and he won the (15 lap, IIRC) race comfortably using the sort of setup you're using.

And he's shit!

. (decided not to post, nothing sinister).

brandonagr:

kb nop... not even tried, but mouse yes and with my friend's wheel (logitech momo or something 200 degrees)

thisnameistaken:

yes you're right, I also feel that the degrees are the the thing that makes my times worse... especially on xrt which whenever I try harder hotlapping I do powerslides at some turn exits (with 200 I can avoid it) but with less degrees than 720 I dont feel that the sim is close to reallity drift in 200 is too easy, and avoiding driving mistakes also too easy,
I prefer h-shifter... but don't agree that's faster than sequencial... unless you cheat like changing it before clutching or something... if you do it like real life you still loose a bit change gears. if not... f1, rally and gtr would still be using h-shifters IRL (but when we get used to it yes it feels like it... but if you practise both you'll see a bit faster times with paddles)

3 more things:
IRL its bad to full throttle at middle of the turn to improve exit speed but all the wr's do it LOL (IRL full throttle with the wheels still turned would make the car spin (which with 720 feels a bit like that)

My setups are from wr's and stuff like that... with low pressure and for mouse or kb probably... so If I had an ideal car setup for my control setup probably would be easier for me, especially for the xrt wich I find too loose on rear wheels.

the manual throttle blip doesnt affect my times but makes me miss some turns (I prefer doing heal-toe with inverted brake pedal like most real cars, I also modded my brake pedal to be higher which improved... but I need a better mod and still the improvement is not that noticeable and with lots of laps I get tired or miss some... on a real car is easier for me)

in s2 of course u have competition using a wheel, only because xfg is a slow car, challenge some kb players to use a mrt, f08, bf1, fox, gtr's ,,, u will win absolutely

Quote from raizde2 :

I prefer h-shifter... but don't agree that's faster than sequencial... unless you cheat like changing it before clutching or something...

I don't have any experience of using an H-shifter so I can't comment. I use the sequential stick on my DFP with the road cars in LFS, and that's definitely quicker for me in the demo cars than it is to use auto-clutch. In the race cars in S2 it's no advantage though - the cars with sequential gearboxes change gear very quickly with auto-clutch.

Quote from raizde2 :

IRL its bad to full throttle at middle of the turn to improve exit speed but all the wr's do it LOL (IRL full throttle with the wheels still turned would make the car spin (which with 720 feels a bit like that)

I suppose it depends on the car. In the XRT it's possible to go full throttle at the apex on many corners because it won't go crazy until the turbo kicks in, by which time you've nearly finished the corner. Even with some of the cars that have a lot of immediate power you can still sometimes floor it early and compensate with steering if you have enough practice. Driving like that won't do your tyres much good on long races though.

Quote from raizde2 :

the manual throttle blip doesnt affect my times but makes me miss some turns (I prefer doing heal-toe with inverted brake pedal like most real cars, I also modded my brake pedal to be higher which improved... but I need a better mod and still the improvement is not that noticeable and with lots of laps I get tired or miss some

Yeah me too, but I still prefer it to left-foot braking. I just prefer having more to do - I get bored if the car is easy to drive.

Looking forward to racing you in S2. I think you'll fit in very well.

i have a dfp, but i use 720 and i use the shifter sucks that i dont have a clutch tho....
i love racing like this because its much more fun....
i dont really car about winning too much but if i win the its a bonus...
i think i have more 2nd places then 3rd and first but that will do for me atleast i no i earned it properly. i dont see why some body would spend £200 on a wheel only to use it in the same manner as a £20 wheel.... and how can people play a race sim with a mouse and keybored. u wouldnt play an army sim with a steering wheel...

ups I forgot your wheel doesnt have clutch pedal yes... so you blip without using heal toe (which sometimes misses ) yes sequential shifter or paddles is the same... with h-shifter in theory is slower since u press down the cluth pedal (bit slower then a button), than change a gear (also slower with h-shifter) then letting go clutch

compensating with a wheel 720 is also possible ( I do it but you loose a bit of speed since it takes longer to turn it instead of only 200) to check the difference just see the animated arms... when turning with 200 degrees his arms turn the wheel at impossible speeds to do the 720

chanoman tks for the notice, I went to lfsworld and yes wheel wins kb and mouse on some cars the problem is that I bet that almost none uses 900 degrees to do the wr's

bradonagr... using g25 is not a disavantage neither in fun or speed... but if you use the g25 with more wheel turn it gets funnier (for me at least) but you'll loose speed it makes you do more reallistic laps but slower ones, in real life I dont think any race driver would beat the wr's...

it's not as easy to control a car so close to the limit


on RBR I always used old driving setup (seq shifter instead of paddles, clutch to change gears... but with 200 degrees, now I tried with paddles no clutch to change gears... but with 540 degrees and my times got worse by 2 secs and I crash a bit more (the degrees change was the factor ... since the rest made it easier)

(never ran a rally car IRL... only made dirt races with a normal car and other stuff, but it's one of my car dreams )

well... have to go... I'll check the post tomorrow

oh, Hi Becky I love the STCC idea, sorry for the problems you had, hope all gets better, I have all the race broadcasts

Quote from raizde2 :

...1.34 on xfg and 1.25 with xrt) so I can only have fun playing single player or in rare servers where I get some demo players that have lap times close to mine.
Long Live LFS

Fuh...Fuh Fuh!!?! 1:25?! Dang homie you are fast ._. Is that with supers?

Jeeze, even though I am show-drifting, I can only catch myself a 1:33 regular, and a 1:28 as my PB x_x

Maybe I should take up Speed Drifting or Gripping

Quote from SLIDE WAYZ :

and how can people play a race sim with a mouse and keybored. u wouldnt play an army sim with a steering wheel...

I use keyboard and I still kick some arse

Slide wayz:

can you tell me your best time on blackwood with the demo cars using 720? just so I can know how much I can still improve

yes, driving with more degrees is awsome

and drifting is also much more challenging and fun much more smooth movements and throttle control, since u cant save it just by turning the wheel

criticaldrift:

supers?? if you mean the turbo yes (xrt is the turbo and xrg isn't)

I do it with a custom car setup that I got from the internet, with low fuel,... if you cant do at least 1.28 you should go pick a new car setup and watch some wr replays to see the problem

the good racers do 1.33 with xfg and 1.23 with xrt so my times aren't that good.


on a demo server I saw a mouse driver doing all 4 laps after the first one 1.33.00 or close (the server had those pb times and he was always 0.0x from them) ... so he was really something... very regular.

there are some quick bastards using the mouse, but you should be quicker with a wheel once you get the hang of it, as for a start you can modulate the throttle

A few of us have recently been using the G25 in 'Hardcore Mode' () and we have found almost without exception that our times are about 2%-3% down on our paddle shift/no clutch times.

Yes, I reckon that using a G25 in full sim mode IS slower..but it is a damn sight more fun!

Quote from raizde2 :

Is it possible to run the bf1 using clutch to start but not to change gear like RL? (same for GTR)

I love LFS just feel that some RWD cars (raf, xrt) a bit too hard compared to RL, but heck the RWD cars that I use in RL are better than those

Quote from raizde2 :

I would already bought the game if there was a retail version... but probably going to buy it online in a few weaks... too much work now... don't want to get distracted.

Long Live LFS

720 degrees is obviously harder but also much more fun than regular 270 degrees. But I reckon that my driving has become much smoother since I got my G25. Because the lock to lock distance is so long I concentrate more to use the smallest amount of turning possible, and it works like a charm.

I am definitely significantly slower with my G25 than I was with my DFP.

I used to use 500-720 deg on the DFP and, if anything, the G25 wheel is EASIER to use in 720 than the DFP in 500 because the FFB is so much better. So I don't think the wheel turn is slowing you down.

Going from left-foot braking to right-foot braking slows you down considerably, as does having to heel-toe downshift rather than just 'blip' with your right foot.

Gone is your ability to carry a little throttle under brakes (helps with stability without hurting turn-in; sort of a sneaky way to get 'the best of both worlds') and your transition from brake to throttle and vice-versa will inevitably be slower and not as smooth.

I have been a hardcore left-foot braker since GPL back in the day, and in every sim I have played I've always found it beneficial to carry some throttle under brakes... not anymore, I'm afraid!

But, as others have mentioned, it is now way more fun and way more 'realistic'! It would be great if someone setup a hardcore G25 server so that we could all compete against each other.

With regards to setups, be careful with the WR setups as some are designed to be used with a trailing throttle under brakes. Just move the brake bias forward 2-5%, and that should fix any 'spinning-out-under-brakes-if-I-even-THINK-about-turning-in' issues that you (I!) may have.

Viva la G25!

Quote from sam1600 :

It would be great if someone setup a hardcore G25 server so that we could all compete against each other.

[dSRC] W17-G25 Full Sim

(needs LFS Join pointed to W17 LFS.exe - or just browse for it in the server list )

Hi people,

raizde2, I feel that you may be slower perhaps because you are simply increasing the realism level of your simming experience and that brings additional difficulties - it is just harder!

think about this: imagine driving a real XRT car in a real Blackwood GP track with real weather and real fear of crashing or dying... how close do you reckon you would get to 1:25?

Cheers,

Quote from Bladerunner :

A few of us have recently been using the G25 in 'Hardcore Mode' () and we have found almost without exception that our times are about 2%-3% down on our paddle shift/no clutch times.

Yes, I reckon that using a G25 in full sim mode IS slower..but it is a damn sight more fun!

What do you mean by Full sim mode? Clutch, 720 and H-shift?

Quote from Bladerunner :

[dSRC] W17-G25 Full Sim

(needs LFS Join pointed to W17 LFS.exe - or just browse for it in the server list )

Fantastic, thanks Bladerunner.

I'm not running W17 as yet - I was going to wait for it to become official. But now... maybe I'll give it a go!

Speed is not the only issue here too. I drove a lot of races in STCC servers where my lap times were 1 or 2 seconds per lap slower than people around me but they kept crashing, hitting grass etc. which allowed me to score points up to my silver licence and even some victories once in a while

This hasn't been said here yet but the highger rotation can be slower but it is more accurate and you can be alot smoother with large rotation. Though obviously if you slide it is harder to get it back but thats racing
When i first had my g25 i went back to demo as i wanted to race the xfg and i ended up getting within a few tenths of it. My pb is a 1:34.5 and i got times of arouns 1:34.8, it took som getting used to though but it is possible to get close to your pb's. I think it is harder and so generally slower but as said it is alot more fun

Quote from CharlesMartin :

Speed is not the only issue here too. I drove a lot of races in STCC servers where my lap times were 1 or 2 seconds per lap slower than people around me but they kept crashing, hitting grass etc. which allowed me to score points up to my silver licence and even some victories once in a while

This is true, but if anything it's harder to maintain consistency with the G25. It's easy to fluff up a shift, and it's harder to be as consistent on the brakes as you have to physically move your foot off one pedal and onto the other.