Quote from Jimmy_Lemon :

i am a skinner and i make textures.

iv used 20 AI's using my 4096 resolution skin on the grid and still had 100+ fps still playable game verry smoothe and fps stayed above 100 at all times.

because in reality lfs isnt "high quality" shadder and effects game like most so i dont get why people complain about "oh iv got no FPS", well its obviouse they wont if they dont spend a few bob and get a half decent pc, because there trying to run a game on a low end pc which actually works, if they tryed running a high image quality game on the same pc it would kill it

Well good for you, but average sim player don't have the money for the new shiny 700 euro graphic card... that doesn't mean LFS shouldn't get graphic update, but surely it DOESN'T need 4096x4096 skin textures...
I also do skins among other graphic textures, and you can put a lot of details in the 1024x1024 300 dpi file, maybe you can't put a 5 pt text saying "NOS Iz in TheRe" but i would surely not see it when i pass by someone going 200 km/h...
And don't you think that 32 players wearing 4096x4096 skins would cause some serious lagging?

Quote from geeman1 :

Did you read my post? Bandwith is the problem here. More higher res skins need more bandwidth and the devs have to pay for that bandwidth. Even if most players could run the game with 2048 skins, the devs would still need 16 times more money! Think about it!

not just skins, textures in general. lfs should have Low=512 setting, medium=1024 setting, high=2048 setting...

Quote from Jimmy_Lemon :

I dont see why such a great game should be more built towards low end pc's that arent built to play games in the first place

/me leaps some years into the future ...

Remember them silly quad core 3Ghz cpu and SLI 8xxx series - how anyone ever managed to play games on those snails is beyond me!

------------

Years ago people also used their pc's for gaming. Games weren't invented yesterday.
Not everybody has massive amounts of cash to spend on their pc. In fact there are many people who appreciate LFS being capable of running on their lower end system - dare I say the majority.

Quote from Boris Lozac :

And don't you think that 32 players wearing 4096x4096 skins would cause some serious lagging?

not one unsmoothe lag bump or anything for me.


and yeh yeh i kno im getting flamed here but im not botherd im just saying what i think im entitled to that.

Quote from Jimmy_Lemon :

not just skins, textures in general. lfs should have Low=512 setting, medium=1024 setting, high=2048 setting...

Yes, making LFS high res has been suggested before and I believe there are high res texures available for most of the stuff.

Quote from Jimmy_Lemon :

not one unsmoothe lag bump or anything for me.

Ofcourse you aren't experiencing any lag from using 4096*4096 skins on your AI's. Because of the simple fact they don't use any bandwith now do they? There's that keyword again, bandwith.

It's like talking to a wall.

Quote from Jimmy_Lemon :

not one unsmoothe lag bump or anything for me.


and yeh yeh i kno im getting flamed here but im not botherd im just saying what i think im entitled to that.

You're not thinking, that's the problem, if you would use just a tiny part of your brain, you would realize how stupid your idea is..

Quote from Jimmy_Lemon :

not one unsmoothe lag bump or anything for me.


and yeh yeh i kno im getting flamed here but im not botherd im just saying what i think im entitled to that.

Omg! Your only thinking for yourself! I CAN'T run things like that, I get an average of 18 FPS, I know "Go Upgrade!" well I can't I don't have enough money I'm in 7th grade and have other things to spend my money on. So why don't you just shut your selfish mouth and stop complaining! LFS is still in development so it WILL get better when they're ready.

Quote from Btoryo :

Omg! Your only thinking for yourself! I CAN'T run things like that, I get an average of 18 FPS, I know "Go Upgrade!" well I can't I don't have enough money I'm in 7th grade and have other things to spend my money on. So why don't you just shut your selfish mouth and stop complaining! LFS is still in development so it WILL get better when they're ready.

i know, which i why i SAID. there should be high settings for us high end users.

and yet all the performance of the current settings as a Low setting which you and alot of others would choose obviously

Quote from Jimmy_Lemon :

i know, which i why i SAID. there should be high settings for us high end users.

and yet all the performance of the current settings as a Low setting which you and alot of others would choose obviously

BUT, 4096 skins will take A LOT of bandwidth.

then why doesnt LFS use a optional thing so that you can host skins via your own internet space (if you Want to) so you can host your own super huge skins and are visable on lfs if people got there settings to see skins on super high res? bit like uploading a image to imageshack then doing a forum [img] code so you can see it on the forums.


O.o ok that sounded pretty good to me tbh lol

Quote from Jimmy_Lemon :

then why doesnt LFS use a optional thing so that you can host skins via your own internet space but is still visable on lfs? bit like uploading a image to imageshack then doing a forum [img] code so you can see it on the forums.

Because then the devs would have no control over the skins. People could upload anything like pornographic images and such. I can think of few other problems too.

Quote from geeman1 :

Because then the devs would have no control over the skins. People could upload anything like pornographic images and such.

a ingame button on the connection list to report the skin by the user then dev's check it out then the account may be banned for the unnacceptable image?

Quote from Jimmy_Lemon :

i dno why the need for the DDS is anyway. jpeg is fine.

[ snip ]

My guess is one simple reason... memory management.

There was a fair few reports of people not being able to run with the new larger grids due to FPS drops etc, AFAIK, DDS files are managed within DirectX memory far more efficiently than the likes of BMP / JPEG, hence it should help overall with performance.

The other advantage maybe future planning. DDS textures can carry an alpha channel too (unlike JPG). This opens possibilities up to 2 options:

Reflection control
Transparency control


Naturally shaders would need to be updated to be able to use them, but that maybe coming later.



Regards,

Ian

Quote from Jimmy_Lemon :

a ingame button on the connection list to report the skin by the user then dev's check it out then the account may be banned for the unnacceptable image?

But the image cant be deleted. I don't think devs are very keen on banning on minor thing like that. banning the whole user would be the only way to stop the image from being in the game.
Also everyone would have to download the high res skin, even if hey have lower res selected. Because the image could be only resized at the receiver end. Also people could upload huge images and then the download would take ages. Trust me, it isn't a good idea.

Quote from Ian.H :

Reflection control
Transparency control

aye true, iv been working with photoshop since as long as i can remember,


but wont this allso lead to people having see through cars if they just put transparency up full then people would ram them and then the poor soul's who hit the see through car would be blamed,

or worse a see through car ramming every one in T1

No.. because the car body would be using the reflection shader, not the transparency shader, which would be used for glass etc.



Regards,

Ian

Quote from Jimmy_Lemon :

i know im not botherd about peformance, i have enough of it (and im sure a few people do too) which is why theres room for 4x more resolution of all the textures on lfs (IE 2048-4096) as a HIGH setting.

if there was a high setting doesnt mean that you have to use it if you get low fps on a low end pc, which is why there should be still the settings there is now as a Low setting option.

While the images might be smaller on disk in jpg format they need to be unpacked to full size to actually render. So lets look at some memory requirements because I don't think you actually understand the ramifications of what you are asking.

512*512 @ 24bit colour = 768Kb
1024*1024 @ 24bit colour = 3072Kb
2048*2048 @ 24bit colour = 12288Kb
4096*4096 @ 24bit colour = 49152Kb or 49Mb per skin

With you asking for 4096*4096 skins and say on a server with 32 people requires 1.5Gb of ram on your graphics car just for the skins to render each frame OR a crap load of swapping to unpack each skin as its required.

I really doubt you system can run at 100fps if you had a full grid of 32 cars each with a different 4096*4096 skin

Sorry, I just do not believe you.

attached a file,

4096x4096 and its 566kb

used the skin MRT_Repsol_Hayden and blew it up to 4096x4096 for a quick example that resolution doesnt nessasery mean huge file size.

it could be compressed 50 times more to even half the size without loosing 1 pixel of image quality from what it currently is if you have the right tools.

ok im offline

Yes but thats a lower res skin blown up to be a higher res, the detail goes to pot when you do that. Try and get something even close to that size with a high detail skin of that resolution.

Quote from Jimmy_Lemon :

attached a file,

4096x4096 and its 566kb

used the skin MRT_Repsol_Hayden and blew it up to 4096x4096 for a quick example that resolution doesnt nessasery mean huge file size.

it could be compressed 50 times more to even half the size without loosing 1 pixel of image quality from what it currently is if you have the right tools.

ok im offline

Sorry, but what's the point for blowing up a skin that is not originally created in 4096x4096? The file size is different, and also blowing up to 4096x4096 for this skin is just still crap. For Hi-Res skin ( I mean 4096 in this case), the image should be much more clearer, and thus using up much more space than just 566kb.

Cmon, I am a photographer, and I deal with Photoshop everyday. I think I have enough knowledge in terms of the related proportion of resolution size to file size.

You're fighting a lost cause Jimmy, its just plain not going to happen, and I still have to agree with Maggot, no games have I ever seen come with 4096 resolutions, much less 2048. Its called.. big things in small packages, and they tend to be the best, no one wants to lug around 5 GB worth of textures they are only going to see once in their gaming career (in a single year).

That is just a ludicrous number anyways, thats around 2mb per skin, which, my current skins_x folder is at 2,328 skins, and @2mb per skin, thats 5GB of probably crappy jpegs compared to 146 mb worth of jpegs, 99% of which I only see once, and that has been building up the past 3 years for me too.

Its worthless what you're asking for.

No one wants something they wont see, its like going to the US military and saying you want to buy an SR-71 Blackbird, even if you had all the money in the world they wouldn't sell one to you, it wouldn't do you any good if you had one anyways.. you'd have nothing to do with it but look at it in awe.

Now.. if you really have that much money, think you could send some to me for a graduation present lol?

I had to drag the mouse atleast 4 times across that file to get from one end of the image to the other. This monitor's 1280 X 1024, pretty decent res- even shrinking the image down 50% won't contain it within the screen border. How is this at all practical, or even desirable?

Quote from Jimmy_Lemon :

not one unsmoothe lag bump or anything for me.


and yeh yeh i kno im getting flamed here but im not botherd im just saying what i think im entitled to that.

And so are we.

Quote from Jimmy_Lemon :

look harder

No thanks, I'd rather play LFS.

I have had no trouble running 30 cars with 2048x2048 skins while racing online, whether you call them HiRes or not.

Scawen are you now just simply increasing the quality of the existing 1024x1024 400kb skins that everyone has uploaded so they are still 1024x1024 but larger file size or will the user now have the ability to upload a larger file (say up to 1MB).
The reason a ask is that most 1024x1024 skins are downsized from 2048x2048 higher res skins. for them to now just have an increase in quality is not the best way of maintaining their quality to begin with. If you know what I mean.

EDIT: I was wrong in the above so please disregard. As I understand it skins download at 512x512 for cars and 256x256 for helmets normally, so now I get the Hi-Res skin download via payment option, you get 1024x1024 car and 512x512 helmet skins. Sorry for posting prior to proper research.