Does anyone else agree that the tires are too durable in this game? The softest tires, which IMO should be shot after a few hotlaps, will last a moderately long race distance. They even get better with wear because of the cooling/heating effects.

I'd like to see a soft tire that will give R1-R2 levels of grip but wear down much more rapidly. I'd like to see people actually using R4 tires in long races. I never see them used for anything right now. And running the soft tires never puts you at risk of a blowout. You basically have to do a burnout for 30 sec to get a blowout.

Also, the tire models have high peak slip angles, which would further accelerate tire wear.

Anyway, making the tires wear more seems like an easy change to make and should not affect any other parts of the physics and would add another strategic dimension to longer races.

Sorry, mods, I clicked on the wrong forum. Can this be moved to Improvement Suggestions?

Thanks!

Done.

I only have 2 questions for you.
Have you ever done some research on modern tyre technology?
Have you ever driven with R1 or 2 compound tyres?

IRL, tyres wear out much less then the currently do in LFS. Some cars do it somewhat realistically (FZR and FOX) but others are quite bad in comparison to real life.

So it's a no for the change for me.

Same here man..

You need to research a bit more...

Quote from gohfeld23 :

I only have 2 questions for you.
Have you ever done some research on modern tyre technology?
Have you ever driven with R1 or 2 compound tyres?

Yes and yes. I've done plenty of 60+ lap races on R2s in the BF1. The car runs out of fuel long before the tires give up the ghost. And yes I'm running competitive times.

Modern tires can be as hard as you want, but spec racing series seem to prefer softer tires because it requires more pitting that jumbles up the running order. Notice that the F1 cars haven't even been able to run the softest compound much this year because they are wearing too quickly.

Quote from Falcon140 :

Same here man..

You need to research a bit more...

What does this question have to do with tire data? Do you *want* softer tires or not? It's a matter of opinion. Not all racing tires are hard as bricks.

C'mon, peanut gallery, give me some helpful comments.

Neither of you has addressed my post. When even the softest tire can last *two* full fuel runs in most cars, that is crazy. What is the point of having an R4 tire, then?

Quote from petrichor :

Notice that the F1 cars haven't even been able to run the softest compound much this year because they are wearing too quickly.

As I understand it (but I will concede right here that I know next-to-nothing about tyres), it's more a matter of certain compounds being better-suited to certain surfaces and temperature ranges - get them out of that "comfort zone" and they don't behave so well.

From what I've heard graining is the bigger problem on the softer compounds, reducing grip but not necessarily wearing the rubber away especially quickly. In fact Wurz (who one-stopped around Montreal last week) was saying that he was having to deliberately scrub his tyres excessively to keep them grippy, and he ran half the race on the super-soft compound that was designed for Monaco.

I don't think it's a matter of realism about the life span of the tire:

For example in early 90's F1 they have qualifying tire that are designed to be ruined after a lap or even less, but in modern F1 they don't have that, softest tire could last a whole stint without major complain.

Since no one labelled R1 as a qualifying tire, it's interpretation is up to everyone's will. Maybe qualifying tire is never intended to be in LFS(which I think will be the trend in the future since it is a huge waste of resources in real life).

However I also have nothing against a broader performance difference in different compounds, since trying to find a clean lap with qualifying tires on a busy track is nail biting stuff.

So in the end there's nothing WRONG about LFS tire's life span, it is just a matter of choice by the devs, which even if it stays the same it won't affect how online competition runs a bit, I think the performance difference is rightly spaced between different compounds, so if there's need for qualifying tire, it might require a new compound choice. (but actually R1 might just work like that on the BF1, however we never know.)

I eat the tires in the bf1 but it might be me... ... I have had some punctures in the FZR at Aston National. And I think the tires are just ok right now.

Quote from petrichor :

Yes and yes. I've done plenty of 60+ lap races on R2s in the BF1. The car runs out of fuel long before the tires give up the ghost. And yes I'm running competitive times.

Modern tires can be as hard as you want, but spec racing series seem to prefer softer tires because it requires more pitting that jumbles up the running order. Notice that the F1 cars haven't even been able to run the softest compound much this year because they are wearing too quickly.

You might choose to re-read my post and answer accordingly.
My questions were pertaining to real life and REAL R compound tyres.
Also, you need to take F1 out of the equation since F1 tyres are designed to behave a certain way, have an allowed amount of grip and wear at a certain pace. (anyone old enough to remember the amazingly psychotic tyres during late 80' early 90's )
DTM, LMS, etc do NOT have as strict regulations so the grip levels, wear, etc is up to todays compound technology.

So once again, have you ever driven a race ready car (any class) equiped with R compound tyres in REAL LIFE?
If you have, you will know how long tyres last. On many conditions that I have experienced, tyres are the last thing on my mind when on track in terms of wear and heat. Hence why we never bring more then one extra set to any event. (Money hasn't been an issue since we have one extremly generous rubber sponsor)

Your argument is about something being in the game but not used.
Well, would you prefer the devs to make a requirement to run downforce at a max at all times because it's there?

Once again, No to Q tyres and no to faster wear. If anything, slow it down a bit.

personaly i think the road supers heat up to slowly on the track i had my tyres front and back really hot after just 2 laps RL im talking about

When i'm driving a slick car the only time I dont run R2's is on an endurance oval race, everything else R2's will last at least one and a half fuel tanks.

I've rarely seen race tyres so durable as in LFS. I mean, there are tyres as hard as LFS' that get used in some formulas that run a control tyre, cheap racing where tyres are supposed to last several races (although the top guys get fresh boots every race anyway...), but there are also formulas that use tyres which degrade much faster or let you run softer compounds.

Quote from MAD3.0LT :

personaly i think the road supers heat up to slowly on the track i had my tyres front and back really hot after just 2 laps RL im talking about

Definately, tyre temperatures in LFS do not fluctuate quickly enough. In fact, it's the biggest gaping whole in the physics. The temperature that LFS shows appears more like an average temperature over the course of the lap (except it isn't, its the real data), there should be greater peeks and lows through the lap.

It is the average temp, ctrl-shift for the surface temp.

Becky just got owned

j/k, but yes, the normal F9 display shows the average temperature of the whole tyre tread, while pressing shift+ctrl shows the immediate surface temperature - which does fluctuate quite a lot.

I think one thing missing in LFS currently is actually a loss of grip as the tyre wears down. Right now a completely new and a fully worn tyre seem to be exactly the same thing, only that the latter doesn't hold energy as much (cooler temps), has a shorter radius and maybe a bit less weight. Though, from what I hear of real drivers it seems to be more like "grips awesome for the first three laps, then lets go noticeably" or similar.

I've said this before in other suggestion threads, and I think it still pertains: We really need differing track temps before anyone will have a good reason to use anything other than R2s. I can guarantee that if you had to run a 30 lap race on a 130* track, rather than the cold, balmy, British tracks we have now, you'd rethink using R2s.

At the very least, the tracks should have different temperatures depending on location (ie: Fern Bay's track temp should be a lot hotter than Blackwood's). Even better would be to then vary the temps according to time (ie: Early morning or overcast would be cooler than sunny mid-day). The best solution would be to allow server side control (and/or somewhat random generation) of the track temp.

Can you imagine a league where you have to look at the weather forecast and choose your tires accordingly? Do you take R2s, hoping that the predicted forecast is correct and that it will be cool for the race, or do you take harder tires because there's a good chance that the sun will break and the track will be hot?

Quote from Just general quote :

When i'm driving a slick car the only time I dont run R2's is on an endurance oval race, everything else R2's will last at least one and a half fuel tanks.

I have raced in 2 leagues in my LFS "career", both being hour long races. One in patch P/Q, the other in T I think (so pre and post tire physics changes). I ran R2's and could probably have run the entire race with them. But I changed when I pitted on the mandatory 1 pit.

Though, at Westhill in the FZR, I can't go 2 laps on R2's without them burning up. But, that is heat related more than wear.