Quote from tristancliffe :

Anyone else see how the bikes tyres disappear into the ground when turning? nK has a similar problem on the cars too, with bits moving through the asphalt or the body of the car moving through kerbs - looks to me like big shortcuts on the collision system.

now that youve said it yes
but it depends on if the models tyres are the same as the ones used in the physics ... obviously the model was quickly done to have something watchable

btw his musical taste is as bad as his coding

Quote from JTbo :

I think that I understand his approach, if he would be doing only netkar it would be even slower, contain even less features etc.

but right now he should not work on any nkp features
all hes expected to do is fix the damn thing to a point where it contains no more bugs ... that doesnt require any creativity just some hard work (which he ... again chickens out of)

Quote from Shotglass :

but right now he should not work on any nkp features
all hes expected to do is fix the damn thing to a point where it contains no more bugs ... that doesnt require any creativity just some hard work (which he ... again chickens out of)

You see that is the problem, I think. It is impossible to do just hard work and concentrate to one thing for example fixing bug certain bug, it drains all energy and won't accomplish anything, it is needed also to do something else that will just keep mind going and energy level full, it will help to make fixes too.
If I'm right and he does have similar trouble as I'm having then I believe it is rather impossible to understand by someone that is not suffering same problem. His mistake is to tell things too openly.

There is lot more than one or two ways of how human brains does work, for some it is rather different than others, that is what I have learned quite some time ago.

But still I certainly do find his way wrong, his PR is so bad, he never should have been publish that, not before new patch anyway, also he should have waited year and use it to make game working before release, but it is part of problem, he is unable to see how all his words and actions are seen by customers and he certainly would need someone to manage PR and make some wall(babelfish) between customers and himself.

Quote from JTbo :

You see that is the problem, I think. It is impossible to do just hard work and concentrate to one thing for example fixing bug certain bug, it drains all energy and won't accomplish anything, it is needed also to do something else that will just keep mind going and energy level full, it will help to make fixes too.

if you want to be self employed or generally want to work anywhere in the "tech" business (anything from engineering to scientifitc to coding) you have to be able to deal with crunch time work or youre simply in the wrong field - period
in any of these jobs its abosultely not abnormal to work all day for a few weeks on less than 6 hours of sleep each day to get something ready for a release/exhibition/conference

either youre able to deal with that or you should go looking for a 9 to 5 job

Quote from Shotglass :

if you want to be self employed or generally want to work anywhere in the "tech" business (anything from engineering to scientifitc to coding) you have to be able to deal with crunch time work or youre simply in the wrong field - period
in any of these jobs its abosultely not abnormal to work all day for a few weeks on less than 6 hours of sleep each day to get something ready for a release/exhibition/conference

either youre able to deal with that or you should go looking for a 9 to 5 job

Times are not problem, but method of working and I would say that Kunos is not quite right environment in commercial game development, it really does not work the way he is able to do it.

he would be perfect at siemens where you can spend weeks doing nothing at all without anybody noticing

Quote from Shotglass :

he would be perfect at siemens where you can spend weeks doing nothing at all without anybody noticing

ROFL, so that is why Siemens got into trouble in first place

I don't think he has been working much at all indeed, all negative feedback from how he has worked and how he has released software etc has surely made him to feel very uninterested of working with it. I'm not actually excepting to see fully working netkar at all, I'm hoping to see it, but I'm not excepting that to happen. There is lot of things that would need to happen that are not likely to happen and so we perhaps never see working netkar, bit of shame, but luckily we have LFS to enjoy.

Of course there is loss of license costs, don't know if anyone will ever get moneys back and also it is already long time ago spent money for many, so don't really know what I should think about that issue.

I still do start NKP sometime and drive few laps, find out that it is almost there but small things that are missing are keeping me away from it, then it collects dust again for few months. I don't test multiplayer as it is pointless, I can perhaps get one good lap without problems, but mostly there is some troubles in mp code if I even can get online in first place so it is not multiplayer game for me.

Netkar Pro Hillclimb test http://stage6.divx.com/user/si ... 71671/test-trento-bondone

Quote from The Moose :

Netkar Pro Hillclimb test http://stage6.divx.com/user/si ... 71671/test-trento-bondone

Hmm, I hope this is not official material, quite few hits to railings and at least one big one that should finish race easily

Track looks like ok, but don't know about car, why all sharper corners are coasted and accelerator is used only when wheels are pointing relatively straight, why slide and loose come to mind?

Well, have to wait and see, hope for best

It's like Test Drive on steroids, but without the cars coming the other way...

Makes me ponder that track creators are on the whole probably better off sticking with proper circuit type affairs, without all this 'natural' scenery displaying. Kyoto is great like this... the nature's kept out of the way- behind fences for the most part. You generally don't get to see how boxy it really is.

Looks like a fun ride though

I'll start with the positives.

Nice graphics mostly. Really nice track by the looks of it, with nice shadows. Grass texture still looks a bit poo, but that might also be the DivX compression.

On to the negatives, all of which are "in my opinion, based on a single view of the video".

Bees! At least no one can say LFS sounds the worst anymore!
Dead - the car is dead. No squirming on the tyres or getting squirrelly on the brakes. No little slides to speak of. Too much body movement in my opinion for such a car. But it's the lifeless car behaviour that gets me most, as though the tread area, sidewalls, suspension etc aren't desperately trying to cling on to adhesion, and it's a feeling I've had (or not had, depending on how you look at it) in nK yet, and remains it's biggest physics flaw.

I just hope that the formula car, multiplayer, on-track experience is a flawless 100fps lag-free (excepting my wireless connection lag) one, with almost no area open to critisism.

Looks excellent. closest thing to this I've seen yet http://www.veoh.com/videos/e13387 I do agree though that the car behaviour does seem a little sterile but that could be down tot he setup or the driver. Plus we could get to run the formulas up those hills which would be great fun.

Quote from tristancliffe :

Dead - the car is dead. No squirming on the tyres or getting squirrelly on the brakes. No little slides to speak of. Too much body movement in my opinion for such a car. But it's the lifeless car behaviour that gets me most, as though the tread area, sidewalls, suspension etc aren't desperately trying to cling on to adhesion, and it's a feeling I've had (or not had, depending on how you look at it) in nK yet, and remains it's biggest physics flaw.

Actually that was one nice thing about seeing the onboard video you recorded at Rockingham. We see a lot of onboard video from single-seaters of course, but little from lower formulae and none recorded with a newbie driving the car.

So it's nice to be able to see how twitchy and slippery the car can be, rather than deferring to "We said we've got some data from an F3 team, and their tester said it's realistic."

Tristan, there was not car body rolling or tilting, it kind of floated steadily, only some head movement (camera actually) by G forces effect, which was quite much for my liking and rather slow for such also. Also shadows were on track but never got into car.

So they have some work to do.

good thing the textures didnt get repetitive at all and that the put some effort into creating the guardrails rather than just copy pasting everything

(either italy changed a whole lot since i was last there or kunos has a very skewed view of how neat and well maintained the roads in his home country are)

Quote from Shotglass :

either italy changed a whole lot since i was last there or kunos has a very skewed view of how neat and well maintained the roads in his home country are

lol...very true, Italy has the worst roads i have experienced outside of India

Still, i imagine they keep that stretch of road in pretty good order.



Here's footage of a real Osella driving the Trento Bondonne http://www.badongo.com/vid/438181

Looks remarkably similar car behaviour to me...VERY grippy and pretty neutral handling.

BTW..there is no damage model at all in that nKPro vid. It is a VERY easy car to damage apparently, so don't expect to get away with hitting anything

Quote from tristancliffe :

I just hope that the formula car, multiplayer, on-track experience is a flawless 100fps lag-free (excepting my wireless connection lag) one, with almost no area open to critisism.

ROFL.... What your after is MiracleCarSim Pro . Currently not in production.

I'd like LFS to be a Flawless 100FPS lag-free sim with almost no area open to criticism, as well as nKPro. It'll never happen.

Quote from The Moose :

lol...very true, Italy has the worst roads i have experienced outside of India

Still, i imagine they keep that stretch of road in pretty good order.

i suppose they do ... but something tells me the guard rails arent quite as immaculate (especially with a whole bunch of high powered cars driven by amateurs racing there) and the tarmac doenst look as perfect either

Quote from Shotglass :

something tells me the guard rails arent quite as immaculate and the tarmac doenst look as perfect either

I completely agree with you. It's all a bit 'shiny and new' looking for sure. I doubt i'll worry to much about it though once i'm driving



A new netBike demo vid. http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=zdCGg58wGXI

Well, LFS has less flaws, gives me way more than 100fps, looks as good, is virtually lag free (excepting my horrid wireless connection), and not open to much critisism in many areas (though open to lots in some, obviously).

What I meant was that I hope nKP can finally deliver what it's been promising for about 3 years.

Watch that vid again - see how the car moves occasionally, and requires corrections. See how it squirms ever so slightly when he brakes hard (which isn't often, as he's not REALLY trying by the looks of it). The nKP video has none of that. Edit: Okay, a tiny tiny bit of oversteer on the exit of corners, but...

I'm upressed, looks better than nKPro did on my PC, i'll gve it a whirl when they give me a demo which A. Shows how fast i'm going (people complain at Demo'ers not having sigs, think about nKPro's lack of a speedo!) B. has tin-tops.

The sound was crappy, but i'm sure it will get better (Kunos wouldn't realise something barely finished, would he? :P), it did seem a little "wierd" that the car seems to either be turning or going straight, and it seems to change several times throughout each corner. Think it's just because i'm not used to having no wheel infront of me to see, though.

Must confess nK Pro ran fine on my PC (although i was a bit of a n00b back then, feck knows what options i had it running on!), and i'd hope my PC could chew through it (at least from that video if it can't nK Pro would have to be as badly coded as BF2!)

DOh! i just tried it,and my opinion is : its a pile of crap there is absolutely no real physics in it,well the tires can break off.The graphics are ok.. the sounds hah,its joke.And it takes 10 minutes to figure out how u start the car
Umm i dont like it..

Quote from e2mustang :

DOh! i just tried it,and my opinion is : its a pile of crap there is absolutely no real physics in it,well the tires can break off.The graphics are ok.. the sounds hah,its joke.And it takes 10 minutes to figure out how u start the car
Umm i dont like it..

Thats your opinion indeed, imho it has the best physics behind RBR, some things are even better than in RBR but overall the feeling in RBR (on tarmac) is better. LFS 3rd.

Quote from marcjs :

Thats your opinion indeed, imho it has the best physics behind RBR, some things are even better than in RBR but overall the feeling in RBR (on tarmac) is better. LFS 3rd.

I tried Nkpro's demo and the only feeling I got from it was that it was a game in alpha stage ( a real alpha stage not the LFS gold alpha kind of stage )

Quote from tristancliffe :

Bees! At least no one can say LFS sounds the worst anymore!

After patch W, it never did

Quote from Maelstrom :

I tried Nkpro's demo and the only feeling I got from it was that it was a game in alpha stage ( a real alpha stage not the LFS gold alpha kind of stage )

Alpha does not present actually quality of product, just that all features are not implemented yet.

It is indeed shame that NKP is way it is, netkar namie was so much more in some ways...