I know its a bit sad but thats not the point of the story. The point of the story is that Alonso wouldn't seem to be the kind of guy who's good with his fans.
I know its a bit sad but thats not the point of the story. The point of the story is that Alonso wouldn't seem to be the kind of guy who's good with his fans.
Your patronising tone is unnecessary, and you're wrong.
You can believe what you want,i don t have the time and need to go in a long discussion with you about it.
Don t forget to erase your little story about Alonso then......(i m sure you understood)
The only reason Alonso would ignore fans wearing Renault tops is for the sponsors, drivers have very strict rules about things like that. That or he simply didn't notice them, or he simply doesn't like all the media stuff, like our iceman friend.
As for sharing setups, well its no different to what goes on in LFS. The top guys help people out with their setups, then those people tweak them to suit their own style, it makes sense. You can't use that against Hamilton, infact if he refused to use Alonso's help, you would all be calling him an arrogant kid.
Saying speed isnt important, I know what you mean by that, you mean that 1 fast lap means nothing. But I think most people look at the bigger picture, consistency and overall race results. So when you say 'who is the fastest guy in F1?' the majority of people will say its the person leading the championship or a previous champion. Those in the know would obviously go into more detail and probably say Raikkonen, on his day, is the fastest driver.
As for sharing setups, well its no different to what goes on in LFS. The top guys help people out with their setups, then those people tweak them to suit their own style, it makes sense. You can't use that against Hamilton, infact if he refused to use Alonso's help, you would all be calling him an arrogant kid.
Saying speed isnt important, I know what you mean by that, you mean that 1 fast lap means nothing. But I think most people look at the bigger picture, consistency and overall race results. So when you say 'who is the fastest guy in F1?' the majority of people will say its the person leading the championship or a previous champion. Those in the know would obviously go into more detail and probably say Raikkonen, on his day, is the fastest driver.
(Leprekaun)
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by Leprekaun
I'm not attacking you QS, I just thought that maybe you didn't see my post or something
.Hamilton is good no doubt, but hes not the Messiah..
I think its pretty funny how ppl keep bringing up "oh he is in the best car and driver X could to the same job" thats utter rubbish,the real fast guys always end up in the best cars.
Always have always will..
As for setups being shared i would bet that neither Alonso or Hamilton have any real say in the final setup of the car anyways,could you imagine it "What camber you running Fernando? Umm like i know Lewis you knob! ask one of those laptop carrying guys"
Or something along those lines..
I think its pretty funny how ppl keep bringing up "oh he is in the best car and driver X could to the same job" thats utter rubbish,the real fast guys always end up in the best cars.
Always have always will..
As for setups being shared i would bet that neither Alonso or Hamilton have any real say in the final setup of the car anyways,could you imagine it "What camber you running Fernando? Umm like i know Lewis you knob! ask one of those laptop carrying guys"
Or something along those lines..
Huh, you know the rest.......
Where's Kev when you need him ? or would'nt he stoop so low as to state the bleedin obvious
No I saw it, I just didn't word my post correctly. I meant that people define the word speed differently, and that some include consistency and racecraft in it. I was just clarifying you meant speed over a few laps, rather than a whole race or season.
no, I never mentioned for how long. I mean that a driver needs to be consistently quick throughout the whole season.
throughout the whole season.He's a very naughty boy!
I would
If your car brakes down it doesn't really help how consistently fast you can be, or if your car is not good enough. The tracks we got left this season should be better for Ferrari than the last few though, so I'm looking for few good races.
Hehehe.
Blackout, you do seem to think I'm a bit thick to think that when the car has problems or car performance, you can still go quick. I understand this, I'm not the brightest guy around but I'm smart enough to know that
. See, really, the best way to judge a driver is to see how he does against his team mate. For example, I would suggest that Sato is better than Davidson because Sato sometimes can get into Q2 while Davidson rarely does and in race performance, Sato nearly always out performs Davidson. So this means that Sato is a better driver than Davidson, meaning that he is quicker, more consistent. I wouldn't necessarily say has better racecraft because mr. TV director doesn't like showing the battles some of the lower field drivers do so I can't tell.
Anyway, this has gone waay off topic. I've proven the statistics with Hamilton and I'm not a fan of the whole crazy media stuff myself but I do respect Hamilton as a driver and so far, as a person as well
.Theres something cool that I found out last night too
. Now, I swear to you that I heard this from my brother who used to race in a local F1 Challenge championship a few years back whom he met a former Mclaren engineer there and became friends with him . Anyway, this friend of his has a friend that is still involved with Mclaren now so he's hanging out with Hamilton and Alonso . Anyway, point of this is that this friend that still works for Mclaren told his friend who told my bro (I know it sounds confusing 
) that apparently, Hamilton is a really really bright guy or to put it in his own words "really with it". Now, all F1 drivers are smart, they have to be when you're racing at that level but considering that this engineer has been working with Mclaren for quite some time, he came across drivers like Raikkonen, Montoya and not to forget to mention, the test drivers as well like Paffet and De La Rosa. So, theres something special about Hamilton For the confused - a legend of the above:
I'm still confused. Can I get that in a flow chart?
Relying on statistics to say Hamilton is the best and at the same time saying you can only compare the teammates against each other doesn't really make any sense to me.
And off-topic? Here? Never!
I'll ask my cousin's brother who has a friend that played billiards with my cousin's other brother and has a friend who knows my cousin's first brother that uses a program a friend of mine uses which can make flowcharts like one my cousin's father had shown his son's friend one day he was playing billiards with my cousin.
For the time being I think this discussion has to be limited to only 6th level acquaintances with the King Of The World and present day champion of the future as foretold by prophet Frank.
I know what you mean. I perhaps misworded it
. What I was saying is that you can't say that Button is worse than Massa for example, same way you can't say that Massa is worse than Button but you can compare the Mclaren and Ferrari drivers since their cars are pretty equal so as I said, out of the top 4 runners, I believe Hamilton is the best. Reason why I said that the only real way to rely on knowing who's a better driver is to compare him to his team mate, I meant that for the lower teams because we all know that there is no chance in hell that a team like Honda will win a race this year since Honda only have 1 point. So, thats a good example for you for comparing team mates, I've come to the conclusion that Barrichello is more talented than Button because as Button has been with Honda now for 4 years to completely understand the car while its only Barrichello's 2nd year with the team and he's equaling Button's performance. True, Barrichello spent a few years with Ferrari where he was able to learn things from Schumacher but still, Barrichello was nowhere last year compared to Button and now he's really giving Button a run for his money.So with a top team like Mclaren or Ferrari, the drivers have the ability to win races because they have winning cars so whoever scores highest out of them, I'd say it would make him the best driver (out of the 4
).The logic of comparing team mates also applies for the top runners, however, its more like you're comparing 4 team mates than just 2.
Coulthard FTW!!!!!
How do you know their cars are pretty equal? Maybe the Ferrari is crap but Kimi and Filipe are awesome? Maybe the McLaren is amazing but the two novices in it can't drive it for shit. You can't say "You can't compare drivers in different teams" and then say "you can compare drivers in different teams".
You missed the thread a couple of weeks ago where we declared August to be Irrational Argument Month here in the forums.
It's been so popular I can see it being carried on into subsequent months/years.
well, tristan, I don't think you can say Fernando and Hamilton are noobs. If you want to say that Hamilton is, then ok but I strongly disagree because if you look at how well Hamilton did in former racing series, he won all of them and to jump into GP2 and win it in his first season, I think Hamilton is something proper. As for Fernando, well, he gave Schumacher a really tough time last year as they both battled it out to the last round and we all know how good Schumacher was. As for Raikkonen and Massa, Massa is doubtful for myself because he's never been spectacular but Raikkonen has raced with Alonso on many occasions. Its just that Kimi was unfortunate to have the flaming Mclaren over the last 2 years while Alonso had the super Renault. Way I see it, Kimi and Fernando are on equal ground and if perhaps one is better than another, it would definitely be Raikkonen. So, suffice to say, they're both very equal but its just that Hamilton has the edge over them.
As for the team mate comparison thing, yes I can say that you can compare drivers from different teams but at the same time, with certain teams, you can't compare them to others.
The Mclaren and Ferrari are equal, its that simple really. Each team have had the edge over the other in some races but overall, they all had their glory days. Thats why I can compare the 4 of them.
The reason why I can't compare other teams against each other is because really, all other teams except perhaps for Williams and Renault, are quite different from each other so it would be unfair to say that Yamamoto is nowhere compared Kovalainen because the Renault is much better than the Spyker.
Much like the Dead Horse Flogging April of '86.
Many great drivers dictate to the engineers how they want the car set up. Schumacher was very well known for it, as is Alonso. In fact it is often the case that teams pay bigger dollars for this type of driver expertise. Some drivers are very involved in the process. Alonso's car is very differently set up than Hamilton's as was Alonso's Renault compared to Fisichella's.
In motorcycle racing Mick Doohan's expertise was pivotal in the development and set up of his Hondas and almost certainly gave the team an edge over less savvy opposition.
If a driver is unhappy with excessive understeer he/she will convey that info to the engineers so that they can dial it out. The engineers are not going to say "no sorry, your setup looks fine to us, we aren't changing a thing". Some drivers can give very detailed instructions about what they believe needs to be changed, others might be more general in their analysis, but their input is essential in setting up the car so that they can drive it to the best of their ability.
Meh... all i can say i know your all gonna tell me off and disagree when i say this, but before montoya was in a mclaren, other then the classic greats, montoya was the fastest and IMO the best racer in modern times.. mika in the mclaren 2, and villnerve in the williams =) hammilton is awsome, but just doesnt have that fast sorta thing that they had if that makes any sence..
Overdoing it with Hamiltonomania
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