Well, it was quite fun having the GT2 on track.
But imo this track is too short for having that many gt2 cars, dunno how it is in real lifes endurance racing, but there wasnt many laps without beeing stuck behind one.
Maybe making the gt2 class a bit more faster.
Wasnt the idea behind not using the X/UFR for gt2 class because they were too slow for the GT1's?
Because looking at the world records of the FWD's them are just a sec or so slower than the current GT2 class (not sure what is the pace, but I think around 1.45-46 for the fastest guys?)
But after all, I kinda think they belong to the endurance racing after all
I personally had a great time. The GT1 guys were very good about lapping with one minor exception, and the fact that the GT2s are as fast or faster in the corners made the lapping a lot easier, I think.
I agree with Jonesy that the GT2s could be made a little bit faster, but I also think they'd be fine if you left them the way they are (once properly balanced, of course).
The cornering speeds of the fwd's were too different
I need to hold a couple more balance sessions to get the cars perfect. But i don think they were too far off concidering this course is an extreme example of top speeds.
A big Problem are the GT1 Drivers, who always made Dive-Bombs in the Corners, or musst go at the inside of the corner and the GT2 Car is much faster around the corner.
They should receive, that a faster Car on the straight isn't faster in corners too.
Well, I would prefer the mini GTR's over limited big GTRs as 2nd class. Now it's impossible to see if it's a GT1 or GT2 car from a distance.
Also, most GT2 drivers drove very good. But some, I don't know who, but some were very unpredictable. When they left a gap on the right they suddenly closed the door when I tried to pass them. So I had to try on the left side.
I also hit one GT2 driver, I'm sorry for that, but he suddenly appeared in front of me on the last moment. Must have been a little latency.
Apart from a little touché with Zockmachine I had a very good race. From 8th to 3rd. \o/
Ive been driving a GT2 with no training whatsoever in front, so we didnt had a good set but hey, qualifying went bad, starting from the back, we read the topic of the testrace only 1 hour in front so we had 1 hour left to make a setup ROFL.
The race was much better loads of fights, i was around place 18 - 22 so that was the main group of GT2... Racepace was ok till the pitstop. Then it all went downhill, bad setup change, couldnt do anything in the second hour then cruise around...
In the race as a GT2 driver i had the feeling that SOME GT1 guys had no respect and just almost drove through my car instead of next to it... They need to understand we also need a place on the track... This happend quite often mostly in sector 2, were you almost cant overtake... And cant make place for the guys.
And correct me if im wrong guys who want to overtake the slower GT2's are responsible for choosing a good place todo it. Not just keep 100% throttle and ram into the back of a slower car.
I think the speed difference between GT1 and GT2 is still too big.
I got 2 small incidents were i couldnt go anywere and there was a GT1 just hammering on my back... In a 2 hour race not bad i think.
Next time i WILL be driving a GT1 if we are allowed to race in MoE that is...
IMO there are only a couple of places on that track where it's impossible to safely let a GT1 car past, namely... the first complex of corners and the last complex of corners. everywhere else there's a convenient 2nd line (though it can be a bit hairy in the two kinks in the infield straight).
I have mixed feelings about the speed differences. On one hand I quiet enjoyed it. But on the other hand they felt like being unreasonably slow - however, if GT2 is faster then it would (in theory) also take longer time to make the pass... so I'm not sure.
It's not that the slower GT2's slowed me down - by far the most of them were kind enough to leave room in good time.
But regarding the faster drivers being this and that - I can't agree 100%. I was once held back my a GT2 drivers who was deliberately defending - but defending what? Those moves were pointless. I 've been patiently waiting behind other G2 drivers, because I do know they can't always give room, just because a faster/lapping car is approaching, however some kept me waiting for too long when they shouldn't.
And finally there were a few who either didn't look in the rear view mirrors/side view at all, or didn't know what to do like when I was behind a GT2, slightly to the left, to indicate that I would pass him from that side, but then he moves infront of me. I then went on with passing him on right and he changed his mind and turned right too - didn't look like block/defensive driving but a sleepy driver - and it was during the oval part with loads of room :|
That reminds me, I had one incident where I was drafting behind my teammate and didn't notice the GT1 come up behind me. So, sorry to whoever that was.
Really, I don't think the problems you described are with the cars but rather with individual drivers, and those sorts of problems can be sorted out with practice and/or by sorting the wheat from the chaff as it were.
Was actually really good IMO, although I did have a couple of wow moments with GT2 cars (Mainly what are they going to do next) 1 which actually cost the lead I built up, after the last split I was willing to wait behind the GT2 car ahead, but he braked way sooner than I anticipated, so waiting turned into a lunge down the inside and flat spotted the tyre. I never noticed untill I checked them on lap 37 to realise they were practicly dead, then it popped.
To be fair though, I had more problems with lapping GT1 cars than GT2, most of the GT2 cars to my surprise were very kind in letting you by but even those who held there line made it obvious that they will give you room at a suitable time. Then some GT1 cars totally ignore the blue flag and cut you up after going wide in a corner, I don't know the rules on GT1 cars overlapping GT1 but i'm pretty sure that it should be like any other blue flag situation, not what I described.
Apologys for leaving early to, allmost had to pull out but then I figured scene as it was a test race that a swap over would be aloud.
Would anyone be up for a GT2 exclusive balance weekend next week?
some serious number crunching and head scratching from FXR XRR and FZR teams to get all 3 cars balanced.
personally i think KY1 and 2 are the worst possible examples for balance testing, so we should choose that courses polar opposite for the balance weekend.
It's going to take a lot of coordination between teams but if youre willing to work with me we can get that hammered out.
If it was during the first oval bend, then it was me I think it was you and your team mate, then another GT2 in front. I didn't even see him and nearly hit him, but dived out at the last second.
Hah, yeah, sorry man. I was trying to push him past the guy he was racing for position (I was lapping them) and I was so intent on drafting w/o wrecking that I completely ignored my mirrors. Oops.
My day was shot with some last minute errands I had to run during the race. Either way, LFS is acting up for me, even just for spectating online... I just get disconnected. Has been like this for a while, trying to fix it.
But for every 10 minutes of viewing I had, I noticed some really good strong points, and some bad points to the GT2 cars. Biggest strong point about this whole race, it looked like very close racing all around.
First, the GT1 class balancing seems ok still, with the Top 5 all fairly close in the first hour or so. Looked like some close/hard racing for a while with the front runners, was nice. Along with them trying to sift through the GT2 traffic, it was rather nice.
As for the GT2 class, it needs some refinement still. The XRR and FZR's top speed are relatively even, though the FZR seems to be choking a bit. It is a shame that nobody 'fast' really was using the FXR, I would like to have seen its capabilities. I do agree that the FXR needs to be somewhat of a benchmark, but not fully, because the FXR in both GT1 and GT2... their tires were FAR thicker compared to the FZR and XRR cars in the race. At least, at the end of the first stints that I saw.... GT2 topspeed and laptimes are a tad bit too slow I think. GT2 is a tiny bit less exciting with it's lower power, but seemed to provide good racing at that speed. They just didn't have enough top speed on long fast straightaways, resulting in GT1 cars to approach them at very high and dangerous speeds. I believe Hoellsen said the difference was pretty big on the front straight. Something like 40 km/h. It should be around 25-30 km/h difference for top speed, and the cars need a bit more power-on-tap it looks like, because if you look at the exit of the first slow corner (before first split), the GT2 cars would get off that very slowly, and the GT1 cars would have so much pick-up out of that corner and rocket right near the rear of them... the GT1 cars had to make really close calls in passing trying to swerve out of the way. I also noticed in such situations that the GT2 cars did a good job of holding their lines as a GT1 car approached. Yes some GT1 cars barged right in to the inside on some corners, but the GT2 cars were just a bit too slow to hold behind in GT1. But these speeds would always require the GT2 cars to hold their line in most cases, because they are so slow. The speed/power should be upped a little bit more, so everything doesn't feel so choked.
I'd propose all 3 cars to be refined under some hotlapping conditions until we can maybe have another short test race. If the cars are 10-12 secs slower than GT1, they should be maybe 8-9 secs slower after some changes. It would also be nice to see more FXR entries. We should shoot for making that car fair competition against the other two.
So far so good, and sorry for the Green Flag messages, got a new keyboard, and not used to the F-key arrangements versus my old keyboard *sigh*
EDIT: Oh yeah there will be things to try and help differentiate the two classes. Something on the bumper will be made for sure, but nothing big and large. I am pretty sure we will make the sunstrip visors be different colors depending on the class, and an optional number plate that will have the same coloring stripe on it or something.
When we first discussed the 2 class racing with the limited GTRs, I quickly made this kind of idea for the bumpers, but indeed... before the season starts, this will all be ready to go, and look better .
(This is just the bumper idea we first had --- Coloring is other way around for GT1 and GT2 in this pic (Very Old) --- There wont be color underneath rear wing)
It's only a supporting argument for increasing the power on the GT2 cars. My main complaint is the GT2 cars not being fast enough out of the corners for a brief moment, they cannot carry a fast exit speed, like extreme turbo lag or something.
I thought the racing with the two classes looked great, but GT2 could be a little quicker, it's obvious. We also don't need to try and get a "level" amount of bhp like "GT300/300bhp" for example. Just need to find something that suits the two classes nicely, and not try to fit one level of bhp... it just wont be even if you do that.
>>>>>
Our intent isn't to follow a tagline for a standardized power setting for all 3 GT2 cars, we only need to make a safe environment for both classes by way of tuning the GT2 cars to our liking, as well as balancing them. Correct me if I am wrong, but you said you used these values in a league beforehand, and said it worked great. Though in our test race the cars were not very balanced, and our only suggestion is to make them a tad quicker. We aren't talking like a 100 bhp increase here.
Test race values were FZR = 29% (304 bhp/ton), XRR = 33% (290bhp/ton), FXR = 36% (270bhp/ton). I'd estimate a change of values to something like these:
All of these result in the GT2 cars having 314bhp/ton power to weight ratio. These are purely estimates, but should be worth a try. Either car should only need to be adjusted around +/- 10 bhp MAX. The GT1 cars only have a 150 bhp difference with these values, as opposed to the 200 bhp difference before.
