Slooooooow in.. fast out.. find your turning point, wait a while.. and find your throttle application point, and you can drive it on the power out of any turn.

You can't turn the wheel and expect the car to turn of course Slow with the inputs, nothing too sudden.. not too fast into the corners and a lot of patience.. then I hope it'll get better. Boring as it may be, ISI packed Barcelona with the game, which is fairly well modelled. See if you can get your times to a steady 2:08 using the 'stock' tyres.

And yes, get 1.250, some things improved there! (and apply the readme PLR file sound settings, and in general make sure you get like 60+fps all the time)

Quote from Niels Heusinkveld :

Slooooooow in.. fast out.. find your turning point, wait a while.. and find your throttle application point, and you can drive it on the power out of any turn.

You can't turn the wheel and expect the car to turn of course Slow with the inputs, nothing too sudden.. not too fast into the corners and a lot of patience.. then I hope it'll get better. Boring as it may be, ISI packed Barcelona with the game, which is fairly well modelled. See if you can get your times to a steady 2:08 using the 'stock' tyres.

And yes, get 1.250, some things improved there! (and apply the readme PLR file sound settings, and in general make sure you get like 60+fps all the time)

Barcelona reminds me, my rfactor shows loading bar that goes till end and freezes there, Motopark works fine, I guess it happens only with this car but need to test more tomorrow to get anything useful from that.

JT: Yup, using a DFP (set at 720 degrees). I will grab the realfeel plugin at some point as I plan to add some config settings for it to an update of rF Ignition at some point but had given up with rF before it was released.

I did notice that if you shift the weight around in the corner, you can definitely use your right foot to steer it and keep it there in a smooth powerslide too (but there's a limit that can be reached.. as expected.. but it feels a _LOT_ better than most other rF mods in this respect, which most seem to suffer the age old F1C issue of "more than 10 degrees and kiss ya arse goodbye!" syndrome).

I only did maybe 20 laps and the track's pretty tight and 1.3miles long and as I say, not touched rF in ages (actually not played any racing game for a couple of months) so I suspect I need to get used to things again. That said, it didn't feel "horrible".. I guess I was expecting a little more front end bite, even from a road car.. but then again, it's a Vette.. and getting US cars to corner is like getting blood from a stone


Niels: I'll try some more and a few other tracks (only ISI addon track I have is Silverstone) and will have a gander at the realfeel plugin sometime too (and adjust the sound stuff in the PLR file). 60fps is just a dream however, I get on average nearer 30-40, 20 at the back of a grid with 11 AI, 6 cars visible.. my FX5900XT don't cut it for much more than that, but it still seemed fine to drive (maybe I just got used to lower FPS over the time).

I didn't change the setup much, just the fuel.. so I'd need to give it a proper test really, the above was my first initial thoughts. I do prefer street cars to GTR style cars too, so this could be fun.. shame the AI is a pittance in rF as I don't play it online


ajp: Track's 'Ashtown Park'.. my first attempt at track building built about a year ago, but never completed it how I wanted it to be so never publicly released it.



Regards,

Ian

Quote from The General Lee :

Play LFS fgs.

Quote from shadow2kx :

It's suicide to talk about rTractor on LFS forum

Quote from The Very End :

Yes, rTractor = :gnasher:

Good job LFS community. And then people wonder why some people doesn't take LFS or it's players seriously...

Quote from Ian.H :

ajp: Track's 'Ashtown Park'.. my first attempt at track building built about a year ago, but never completed it how I wanted it to be so never publicly released it.

Still looks nice

Quote from JTbo :

There are some issues in it however, damage is horrible, all you get is wheel felling off and small dents, there is no severity in crashing at all and this is damage set to 100%
Of course damage engine does not support fibreglass, but I would prefer to see car getting hurt from 50mph hit to wall so people would avoid doing such things and there bit unrealistic looking but severe damage would serve it's place just fine.

Yeah if you look in the RACE generic damage file you'll see a comment a long the lines of carbon fibre shatters so we won't bother with body deformation. rFactor can do damage so much better than most mods do. Mesh deformation may not be the most realistic way of doing things but it looks so much better than nothing or even worse giant undamaged body panels flying about the place.

One of the limitations with the rF damage model is that the wheel locations don't change with mesh deformation like they
do in LFS so you can have wheels magically attached to thin air. A lot of mods restrict the mesh deformation around the wheels and cockpit, which I don't think is terribly convincing.

One thing that does need changing in the Corvette mod is the roof feelers are all set too low at 0.7, they should be 1.0 to stop it sinking into the ground when it rolls.

Apart from crashing the Corvettes are great fun to drive, especially round Riverside

@ Deggis: Pretty sure that was mostly tongue in cheek

How you can have Alfa 75 there ???

Quote from JTbo :

How you can have Alfa 75 there ???

RACE X mod

http://racesimtracker.com/

v1 of the Corvette together with the RealFeel plugin completely changed my opinion about rFactor. This new version is even better. Excellent job with the physics, Niels, it's an absolute pleasure to drive!

Quote from Ian.H :

JT: Yup, using a DFP (set at 720 degrees). I will grab the realfeel plugin at some point as I plan to add some config settings for it to an update of rF Ignition at some point but had given up with rF before it was released.

I did notice that if you shift the weight around in the corner, you can definitely use your right foot to steer it and keep it there in a smooth powerslide too (but there's a limit that can be reached.. as expected.. but it feels a _LOT_ better than most other rF mods in this respect, which most seem to suffer the age old F1C issue of "more than 10 degrees and kiss ya arse goodbye!" syndrome).

I only did maybe 20 laps and the track's pretty tight and 1.3miles long and as I say, not touched rF in ages (actually not played any racing game for a couple of months) so I suspect I need to get used to things again. That said, it didn't feel "horrible".. I guess I was expecting a little more front end bite, even from a road car.. but then again, it's a Vette.. and getting US cars to corner is like getting blood from a stone


Niels: I'll try some more and a few other tracks (only ISI addon track I have is Silverstone) and will have a gander at the realfeel plugin sometime too (and adjust the sound stuff in the PLR file). 60fps is just a dream however, I get on average nearer 30-40, 20 at the back of a grid with 11 AI, 6 cars visible.. my FX5900XT don't cut it for much more than that, but it still seemed fine to drive (maybe I just got used to lower FPS over the time).

I didn't change the setup much, just the fuel.. so I'd need to give it a proper test really, the above was my first initial thoughts. I do prefer street cars to GTR style cars too, so this could be fun.. shame the AI is a pittance in rF as I don't play it online


ajp: Track's 'Ashtown Park'.. my first attempt at track building built about a year ago, but never completed it how I wanted it to be so never publicly released it.



Regards,

Ian

Morning Ian,

Those framerates are killin ya! What about dx7 mode, no AI cars? Plus did you do the 'frames rendered ahead=0' trick (using RivaTuner)? If you that and manage to get the fps up to 60+, it becomes quite a different experience.

I've said enough about how I feel about the DFP.. I...umm dislike it. I would not calibrate more than about 450 degrees with it, just to make its internal resistance 'acceptable'.

Glad you agree its better than most though, I always post at the LFS forum because.. if an LFS player likes an rFactor car, something must be quite good somewhere..

Hi Neils..

Quote from Niels Heusinkveld :

Morning Ian,

Those framerates are killin ya! What about dx7 mode, no AI cars? Plus did you do the 'frames rendered ahead=0' trick (using RivaTuner)? If you that and manage to get the fps up to 60+, it becomes quite a different experience.

Not tried DX7, but did do a solo test run to begin with (although didn't check FPS). I'll check next time what I get solo

RenderAhead is set to 0 with RivaTuner and a few other tweaks within it too. Used to be much worse when I only had an onboard gfx chip and the chicane at FE Green / Gold at the last corner dropped to ~8fps.. somehow still managed to be "drivable"

Quote :

I've said enough about how I feel about the DFP.. I...umm dislike it. I would not calibrate more than about 450 degrees with it, just to make its internal resistance 'acceptable'.

I'm not really a "hardcore gamer" so don't spend a great deal on things for gaming although when I tried Bladerunner's G25 when I dropped round there one afternoon.. it was a cool feeling.

Quote :

Glad you agree its better than most though, I always post at the LFS forum because.. if an LFS player likes an rFactor car, something must be quite good somewhere..

Credit where credit's due and you've definitely managed to achieve the 'connected to the road' feeling My main dislike of rF is actually the AI and ISI themselves. There's some great content available for rF and believe there'd be a whole lot more if ISI actually bothered to document anything.

I like the materials you've used too. Actually looks like a car, not either a plastic box or a glass ornament

I'll be giving this another test drive later (with realfeel) in between packing.. off to Amsterdam Thursday and then to Prague for a 6 day stag "night"



Regards,

Ian


PS: Fancy offering some advice (not looking to be held by the hand, just some pointers really.. I learn by doing, not having it done for me ) when I get back on how to achieve such physics? Would love to get the XRT I converted handling nicely and more like a street car than a hovercraft I'd be happy to send the current build to you. Just don't laugh too hard.. I'm a "getting things in game" person, not a physics / sound guru

Ian have you seen Kangaloosh car factory? It takes a lot of the guess work out of building suspension for rF cars, the only snag is you need to have fairly detailed geometry measurements, IIRC it's what Niels used on the Corvette.

Hi ajp..

Quote from ajp71 :

Ian have you seen Kangaloosh car factory? It takes a lot of the guess work out of building suspension for rF cars, the only snag is you need to have fairly detailed geometry measurements, IIRC it's what Niels used on the Corvette.

I grabbed a copy last night and loaded the XRT HDV file, but didn't get much further yet (only spent a few mins nosing about). I do plan to have a closer look and see if I can figure it all out, but I don't really have any specs per-se on the XRT for geometry, I guess doing some research on a Starion maybe useful to help with this part.

This was part of the reason I slowed down so much on my LFS conversion. Getting the models ingame, looking ok and running was easy.. getting them feeling right with no previous physics editing experience (or any real knowledge for that matter) was a challenge



Regards,

Ian

Quote from ajp71 :

Ian have you seen Kangaloosh car factory? It takes a lot of the guess work out of building suspension for rF cars, the only snag is you need to have fairly detailed geometry measurements, IIRC it's what Niels used on the Corvette.

That + Niels own tool + some Niels tire magic would do a trick, without last one it will be pretty ok, but something missing, trust me, I know

Ahh, now tyres........ is something I have absolutely no idea about.. my XRT currently runs on ZR slicks, which feel horrible!



Regards,

Ian

Quote from Ian.H :

Ahh, now tyres........ is something I have absolutely no idea about.. my XRT currently runs on ZR slicks, which feel horrible!



Regards,

Ian

Hunt down niels tools and there was tire generator if I don't remember wrong, or was it only my version, can't remember, but anyway that will get you started.

One annoying thing is that one tire that works great in one car does not work at all in other car, also there is lot of parameters in tire files that most have no idea what they do, but that is certainly worst part of that engine where most development would be needed.

So if you try C6 runflat tires on some other car it can give totally different handling characteristics, much more different than car otherwise would.

Quote from Ian.H :

Ahh, now tyres........ is something I have absolutely no idea about.. my XRT currently runs on ZR slicks, which feel horrible!

No! Nicking a tire file from a decent mod is a fast track solution to getting something semi-decent, just copying and pasting the slip curve part of the .tbc file made transformed the GP79 mod into something that was actually drivable and quite fun, although I still think something was majorly odd with the suspension. Maybe the suspension analysis tools within LFS/Bob's setup analyzer and talking to Bob may get you somewhere to finding some basic geometry. I gave up on trying to build a car from scratch because I wanted to do the physics first then worry about dressing it (or probably never bother) but unfortunately I soon found that the wheelbase and track are dependent on the 3D model.

Quote from ajp71 :

No! Nicking a tire file from a decent mod is a fast track solution to getting something semi-decent, just copying and pasting the slip curve part of the .tbc file made transformed the GP79 mod into something that was actually drivable and quite fun, although I still think something was majorly odd with the suspension. Maybe the suspension analysis tools within LFS/Bob's setup analyzer and talking to Bob may get you somewhere to finding some basic geometry. I gave up on trying to build a car from scratch because I wanted to do the physics first then worry about dressing it (or probably never bother) but unfortunately I soon found that the wheelbase and track are dependent on the 3D model.

But you can do just so little with just slip curve, that is perhaps, what would I say, 20% at max? It has it's effect to steering feel and such, but slide of doom is not all because of that, there are lot more parameters that affect to that and car weight, tire load rating etc. affect to some more.

Editing the tyres is far too difficult as the model itself just doesn't guarantee results.. You really have to feed it well.. plus the rest of the car has to be correct as well.. I get some masochistic pleasure from it nowadays..

BTW, don't forget that there are no less than 3 choices of rubber for the corvette, from 'not so good' (though not bad!) 0.89G on the skidpad to 0.98 to 1.07..

Basically you get 3 cars hehe

Quote from Niels Heusinkveld :

Editing the tyres is far too difficult as the model itself just doesn't guarantee results.. You really have to feed it well.. plus the rest of the car has to be correct as well.. I get some masochistic pleasure from it nowadays..

BTW, don't forget that there are no less than 3 choices of rubber for the corvette, from 'not so good' (though not bad!) 0.89G on the skidpad to 0.98 to 1.07..

Basically you get 3 cars hehe

True, difference is so big with those tires that it is like 3 cars. Oh you get pleasure from working with tires? I have a job for you then, just need few things checked and it should be then ready, so 3 new tires should be made, you know for what

Had another crack with this and peeked about more in the upgrades etc (just got in and drove before). The tyre differences make quite a lot of difference on the track, and the realfeel plugin is pretty cool too!

I exported a lap from a replay (excuse the fact there's no sound, rF's export function is no more than pure crap!) which IMO, really shows the body and suspension movements. Using the track-day tyres this time around. Nice work Niels

Video download (18Mb DivX)



Regards,

Ian

Quote from Ian.H :

but I don't really have any specs per-se on the XRT for geometry, I guess doing some research on a Starion maybe useful to help with this part.

iirc all research wont do much as rfactor cant model macphersons

Quote from Shotglass :

iirc all research wont do much as rfactor cant model macphersons

Hey surely rF must model them seeing as 80% of the cars made for it use them?

Quote from ajp71 :

Hey surely rF must model them seeing as 80% of the cars made for it use them?

Wikipedia lists them as unknown...

Quote from bbman :

Wikipedia lists them as unknown...

Not a very reliable source, do the ISI sims really have dirt on tires affecting grip like in LFS?