Right, ahhhhh, technically evryone here was wrong apart from shiny red cobra. I had the most original release of Live For Speed (cast your minds back, what's it, 3 years now??). Now, I got that as a demo, and i could upgrade to s1 through unlock. But when it came to s2, I couldn't download it. (121mb at 56kbs = about 21 hours download (at optimal download, which never happens) = €75.60 MINIMUM, or €756.00 MAXIMUM) see where i'm coming from now?? And yes, since the irish government is a major shareholder in Eircom plc., they have a huge say in where broadband goes. Anyway thanks to everyone who helped (tinyk, never read the PMs, but thanks anyway) and well done to those of you who still posted on a year old thread!! lol