Neils - will you make a GTR2 conversion of your car sometime? I'm totally new and noobish to GTR2 but I've seen some content swapping between ISI sims, so I know it's possible. I don't have rFactor, that's why I'm asking.

Anyway, sounds like you have a hit - congrats!

Off Topic - Is there a higher opinion of GTR2 over rFactor among LFS'ers, or are they regarded fairly similarly? GTR2's been quite enjoyable for me over the last couple of weeks. rFactor certainly cops a fair bashing over here, so I'm wondering what you guys think of GTR2. Same story- or what?

Quote from Electrik Kar :

Off Topic - Is there a higher opinion of GTR2 over rFactor among LFS'ers, or are they regarded fairly similarly? GTR2's been quite enjoyable for me over the last couple of weeks. rFactor certainly cops a fair bashing over here, so I'm wondering what you guys think of GTR2. Same story- or what?

The physics are identical, GTR2 is just a (bad IMO) rF mod sold as a standalone sim. GTR2 does have wheather, I don't know how well implimented it is what I have found though is that for someone who has a computer that is somewhat challenged GTR2 produces lower framerates on minimum details DX7 than rF on med/high on DX8, needless to say it also looks far worse

They all (rfactor / gtr2 / gt legends / race) use the same base engine, at least as far as 99% of the physics go. It all depends on the numbers they enter.

There is good and bad news, they all do a pretty horrible job of 'tire force combining'.. but at least the devs know this and plan to improve that.

Its the biggest limitation in the engine. At RSC they're now talking about brake duct lift.. When tire physics improve, so will the cars..

I'm not doing any GTR2 stuff, in fact, now that I know how poor the force combining is, I'll probably leave it after the z06 is done. It is certainly possible to get some fairly good handling, MUCH better than I ever thought possible with ISI, and in some cases more believable than LFS (especially below / at the limit).. but there are limits to what you can do.

Simracing physics are for a great extend stuck in the 90s. Go iRacing!

Thanks for those answers.

I'm actually quite surprised how well GTR2 works out of the box on my computer (same goes with the M3 challenge). Quite a contrast to the new Race demo and then rFactor when I tried it last (about 1 and a half years ago ). Smooth fps are of paramount importance for racing sims so if that's not sorted then I guess you won't enjoy yourself. I just wonder why- if the games are so similar, I've had such a range of experiences with framerates? FPS out of the way- I agree that the tire physics aren't as good as LFS. That seems to cut across all of these ISI games. There's a distinct 'feel' as Gohfeld23 points out, that doesn't sit right with a long term LFSer. Feels like you have to drag your car around corners sometimes, but that's probably my driving more than anything. I call the tire physics 'muddy' to explain it- it's harder to visualise what your tires are doing and where your car will end up. This is the worst thing about these games for me.

Tire physics out of the way (and I agree it's very hard to sweep THAT under the rug) the game is very enjoyable. The cars, the sounds, the tracks - it all adds up to a very nice package that I'm finding hard to put down of late. I'm finding some nice mods (the nord) and having a blast. AI is good and frequently leaves me in the dust. I'm miles ahead of the AI in pro mode on LFS so this is a refreshing change. Graphics are excellent (need 16X AF to make the tracks look nice). Just having a working windscreen is soooo nice- I have no idea why! Menus are pretty bad.

Anyway - if anyone has some good suggestions for mods - tracks/cars , or text settings which improve the game, feel free to PM me, I'll be very grateful.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=rLFfiFCiwNw

a really crap job of editing, but some shots of the z06 physics... Work in Progress..

Cool! So that's why it's been all quiet... 8)

Actually I hadn't touched rFactor for more than a week, but I now have more realistic tire data that i more or less copy/pasted in, despite the issues with the tire model.. I'm just going to use real numbers and forward people who dislike it to ISI..

The car is still fairly good to drive, 505hp is nice.

any chance you could post a link to that track?

http://rfactorcentral.com/detail.cfm?ID=Skidpad

tada..

it uses the normal terrain.tdf which I've edited to get rid of the sine wave bumps though.

For those interested the first part of the F1 1955 mod has been released. It includes the W196 (other cars to follow) the car has been researched in huge amounts of detail and certainly not rushed (see the Team Players forums).

It says it has a file included with the mod about the physics creation, I'll post it when I've downloaded

http://rfactorcentral.com/detail.cfm?ID=1955%20F1

I know, this is a little late and all, but I didn't have a chance to try out the v2 corvette before (and hadn't touched rFactor for quite some time), and I'm thoroughly amazed by the job you've done Niels!

I took the C6 around Nordschleife for a few laps, and the whole experience is soo convincing, it's just awesome! Together with realfeel, I actually think this feels better than LFS. I really feel like driving a big heavy car around the Nos. A feeling I never had with rFactor before (except with your v1 maybe, but not to the same extent), and I still don't have to the same extent with LFS.

Thx so much for this .

Quote from ajp71 :

For those interested the first part of the F1 1955 mod has been released. It includes the W196 (other cars to follow) the car has been researched in huge amounts of detail and certainly not rushed (see the Team Players forums).

It says it has a file included with the mod about the physics creation, I'll post it when I've downloaded

http://rfactorcentral.com/detail.cfm?ID=1955%20F1

To be honest the car feels so awful to drive, just *yuck*.

I guess a lot and lot time has been put into it but imho the 1950s F1 car for Racer is better than this. I mean, is the car made of rubber?

I really hope that they keep tweaking the physics files, the car just feels so wrong on so many levels .

Hyperactive: And you have driven a 1955 F1 car yes.....:mr-t:

Quote from frankwer :

Hyperactive: And you have driven a 1955 F1 car yes.....:mr-t:

I just said it feels awful to drive.

I have driven a '67 car

I think the Merc isn't that bad... Much fun to throw it into a corner and steer with the throttle...

Hyperactive are you using RealFeel?

My impression of this mod has been completely the opposite, I've found it's a beautiful car to drive, very controllable with no nasty traits under braking/snap oversteer, that the '65 GPL cars were especially good for. I've found the car to be extremely easy to control both through the steering and, unusually for ISI, through the right foot.

My guess is you're just being a noob trying to drive it like a modern car It has very very little grip, and more in common (in terms of driving style and pace) with the '30s titans than the '60s cars that have set the precedent for historic sim racing (well GPL is the only good historic simulation). These cars have got serious grip issues, which can lead to it being very easy to just wack on opposite lock then suddenly find yourself being flung the other way when the tires finally grip, you need to do everything smoothly and think ahead a lot more, it won't dart about like a single seater. Most of all though think about how fast you're going, this car is capable of well over 150mph but even Fangio would be struggling to keep up with the average track day noob in a 911 round the 'ring. The first time I tried it I went to Mallory and soon found that you have to be very careful not to lock up on low speed braking and that the throttle pedal can't just be nailed bellow 100mph.

If your using RealFeel start again driving it like you would your own road car and gradually find the limit and characteristics of the car, I think you'll find it considerably less frustrating.

The physics seem to have a lot of thought put into them, I've only skimmed through the physics document but I think half the things discussed in there don't even get considered by SimBin/most mods

simply stunning!!! wow wow wow

care to post your realfeel settings ajp? i tried 37deg steering lock with 900deg rotation and increased caster to 5 but i feel almost nothing through the steering max force @ -5000

e: my bad, i'd forgotten how realfeel actually works it's perfect now...i'm totally blown away...thanks ajp71!

Quote from kompa :

simply stunning!!! wow wow wow

care to post your realfeel settings ajp? i tried 37deg steering lock with 900deg rotation and increased caster to 5 but i feel almost nothing through the steering max force @ -5000

Setting the FF too 'low' in rF is very important because it gets rid of the ISI effects (IIRC you still have to have it turned on in rF for it to work). My other rF settings are FF strength -100 (Logitech wheel) and all the digital sliders to as low as possible and sensitivity max with no deadzones (those shouldn't affect FF though). My FF is light but gives loads of information, I've always found setting it too high to loose the information because the wheel is constantly fighting itself.

Hey Niels,

I've got a question regarding top speed of the C6.

I'm only hitting 247 km/h or something going down Döttinger Höhe on the Nordschleife in 5th gear (not even redlining), no matter whether I use the shorter or the default gearing. Shouldn't the C6 be capable of higher speeds?

Regards,

Linsen

btw: How much money would I have to pay you to create the Renault Clio 172 for me ?

the only problem i can spot with the C6 is that 5th and 6th are far too long and have nearly no pull at all. Its basically a road car, but trying to use 5th or 6th gear at 70mph and the car just goes backwards. Everything else is perfect.

Just checked the gearing on the Corvette Z06, not sure what the differences are, but 6th is geared to give 235mph (nearly 40mph above its top speed). So acceleration should be fairly poor - you'd certainly never use it when racing.

I think you can reach around 175mph (275km/h) in 5th. 6th is just an overdrive (cruising gear) which you'd never use on a track and won't reach vmax in

Fairly common claim that gears are wrong, those have been checked many times with many people and those are correct. Gearing is just how it is, try some super oval maybe there you can reach top speed, other tracks I don't think so.

Cruising @ 1000rpm, that is how you drive it on highway, make straight level track to test same.

In games we experience easily car not having enough power when trying to drive normally, that is as we have used to use all power from engine, also lack of forces etc is not at least helping.

Try driving way you drive IRL and you will find out how horrible slow any car feels

Heya,

The acceleration is pretty accurate, within a tenth or two to 150mph. The german mag reached 253km/h on the dottinger hohe, I have reached a bit faster, depends on how late you shift / how quickly you enter the straight / how manly you feel for that lefthander..

5th gear on both the C6 and z06 are the top speed gears, 6th are pure economy cruising gears.

Okay, thx guys. I didn't really expect any different answers, tbh, but thought asking couldn't hurt .

Is that magazine you're talking about "Sport Auto", Niels? They managed a time of 8.15 min around the Nos. Has anybody been able to match that, yet? (Certainly not me, I'm still 35 seconds behind, but that seems pretty realistic, seeing that I lift at several places or don't floor it out of fear of loosing it -- also, I still don't know the Nos at heart).