Well I think that Racing and Drifting are tied together because experienced/sunday drifter can usually handle his car better under sudden slidesituations.

He knows how the gears, throttle & brakes can help during slides or late braking. It's not like drifters are the only ones with that skill (skilled racers know these things too), but drifting practice always helps one to gain those skills.

So drifting is and always will be a very important part of racing (even in Formula 1 they do drift to keep the car going on tarmac instead of grass ) because you learn so much about handling when you have done some drifting.

To me Drifting is all about FUN and I don't "race" by drifting very often. I usually do drifting offline and practice the "perfect" lines and car handling by that. It's very relaxing too and is not tied to any point gaining or anything for me.
Sometimes I go on a drift server that does have that calculator but that calculator works in such way that you have to drift unnaturally. I prefer "pure" drifting with smooth and sometimes even crazy lines that really challenge you to know how to handle your car.

To me the there's drifting in the race world and racing in the world of drifting and I love them both :eclipsee_

I used to have a terrible idea of drifting. But that was because of the Fast and Furious series, str33t NFS games and rice boys who are apparently unable to say the word "race" and think that their muffler size measured in centimetres equals top speed (so a 3 metre long muffler would equal a top speed of 300 km/h).

But since I joined the motorsport community, that idea has somewhat faded, and I'm even practising a few drifts every now and then, when I feel like having some offline fun. I still frown upon rice boys just as much as I used to, though. An old VW Beetle could probably beat their drag ridden, overweight noise factories in a real rice. I mean, race.

Until they start putting high leverage, long handled, ratchetless hand brake levers in race cars, they aren't really drifting, which is as much about using the hand brakes as using power slides and clutch kicking.

Plus what could be more exciting than hanging out the rear end at those incredible speeds, like up to 75mph. Ok, too scary, most of the drifting is done at around 50mph or less. Maybe there should be a new game, drift for slow.

Still when I think of drifting in games, there is semi-reality and then there is fantasy.

npdrift.wmv

I don't even see why people have to be part of a "drift fraternity" or "race fraternity" or however it was stated above. Can't someone like both. . . ?

Quote :

I don't even see why people have to be part of a "drift fraternity" or "race fraternity" or however it was stated above. Can't someone like both?

I like both, but I spend about 4 times more racing than drifting, so I prefer racing. I also like arcade racing games as well as simulation racing type games. I also like other types of games like Tombraider and the Myst series. Outside of gaming, I like motorcycles (I own a Hayabusa), radio control gliders, and I used to play table tennis (but the current places are too far away). Sort of an odd mix of hobbies.

Quote from JeffR :

I like both, but I spend about 4 times more racing than drifting, so I prefer racing. I also like arcade racing games as well as simulation racing type games. I also like other types of games like Tombraider and the Myst series. Outside of gaming, I like motorcycles (I own a Hayabusa), radio control gliders, and I used to play table tennis (but the current places are too far away). Sort of an odd mix of hobbies.

Yep pretty much same here too. I like many kind of sports instead of being focused on only one.

PS. Cr!t!calDrift, read my post and see, I like both of them

To me, nothing really wrong with drifting.. abit fun here and there making smoke and hanging on to a car around a long turn can be fun.. but still, its not racing

Racing is Racing and Drifting is Drifting but competition is an element that can be seen in both

Heres my opinion.Racing is when you drive and try to get to 1st place.Drifting is when you slide the car in the corners and get alot of smoke and angle.Feel free to disagree with me.

Yeah and sometimes its also about showing off the best style,angle,and smoke as you can while maintaining the speed.

Quote from JeffR :

I like both, but I spend about 4 times more racing than drifting, so I prefer racing. I also like arcade racing games as well as simulation racing type games. I also like other types of games like Tombraider and the Myst series. Outside of gaming, I like motorcycles (I own a Hayabusa), radio control gliders, and I used to play table tennis (but the current places are too far away). Sort of an odd mix of hobbies.

I am the same. I drop in on drift servers from time to time and also practice offline but I see it all as part of car control. When you know where the edge of grip is and what happens when you step over it you are better able to hold the edge in a corner.

my only problem with drifting is how it is taking up so many servers...I can only race in like 5-6 in North America
everyone want to drift or crash...thank goodness other sims exist so i can race
after all it is RACING i am looking for in a RACING SIM...

Quote from GT Touring :

my only problem with drifting is how it is taking up so many servers...

Drifting is not 'taking up' those servers, most of them were set up for drifting - it's not like they would be available to you for racing if drifting were somehow banned from LFS.

If you want racing servers and there aren't enough, why not set up your own ?
Then publicize it so that you get some folks on there to race with. (Being the Admin, you will have the power to ban as many drifters as you like, so it's a win/win if you are anti-drift )

Col

He may mean that drift servers take up the time of potential racers, but its all the same. I wouldn't play LFS if I couldn't drift, and I don't think I'm alone in that sentiment.

Quote from flymike91 :

He may mean that drift servers take up the time of potential racers, but its all the same. I wouldn't play LFS if I couldn't drift, and I don't think I'm alone in that sentiment.

It's like the record industries saying P2P are taking away their potential customers, when in fact those who download via P2P aren't going to pay for music with or without P2P.

Come on you so called racers, go bully every drifter away and see if you get more races. FAT CHANCE!

Quote from dion187 :

in response to this i dont see drift as race i mean take everyone that disgrees they say grip is objective of fast (to a point) but drifting is a saught of race its who can go fastest SIDEWAYS!! may not be the fastest but may be the funnest it isnt realy a race its go aspects of racing but its liek 3/4 race and 1/4 show ect

Did you realy have to bump this? i thought i would be done getting emails saying people have responded to this...and now it might all start again withanother bunch of "OMGZZ I PWNZZORRRR AT DORRIFtoOSSSSS" (Luckily not from demo anymore)

Quote from Gunn :

No, they hate drifters because so many young people with immature behaviour happen to be attracted to drifting. Therefore you see a lot of drifters in the community who are a total PITA, many of whom don't understand what a race simulator is and who often will make suggestions that are irrelevant to the development of a race sim, and they often voice their opinions in annoying ways.
This type of behaviour is not limited to any group of players but manifests itself most often with players who openly support drifting. Therefore an animosity towards that group builds up over time and people form stereotypical opinions about the group as a whole.

Many drifters seem to go out of their way to try and make an issue of the "us VS them" debate, which incidentally, only usually rears it's ugly head when drifters make threads like this one. Many drifters act all victimised when somebody suggests that a race sim should concentrate on developing features pertaining to racing, instead of drifting. Some people seem to take it personally that this is a race simulator and not a drift simulator. It is what it is. Don't take it personally.

It's only natural that some kind of division occurs.

The division here isn't really about the drifting, it's about people's attitudes and behaviour towards a group of people who coincidentally like drifting.

LOL if you replace "drifter" with "LFS Fan" you get the exact situation of how those lfs fans who are visiting the other sim forums at RSC are percived. (Obnoxious, flame spamming 14y.o kids.) The overall LFS community has matured alot recently since LFS now is a very proper sim.
But from reading this thread I see the immature obnoxiousness still lives in the community

You compare drifting to figure skating. I would compare it to Ski jump, the main objective IS to go fast, but doing it "stylish" is alos important.

A short story on the evolution of drifting:
a. Trying to make a underpowered street car on tarmac look like its driving like a rally car. Mostly useless but looks kind of cool. Since it was done with normal mind bogglingly understeery street cars on mountain roads with very tight hairpins oversteer was used to fight the understeer.
b. Touge competition, (operation described earlier in the thread). A set of rules to do somewahat fair street racing on a short tarmac stage.
Combine the both to get the racing that happend in the anime Initial-D. The fictious Akina mountains has a very special type of tarmac with gravel type grip which gives powersliding an advantage (just like it does in rally and iceracing) hence drifting is useful. Going wide also makes sure your car is wide enough to prevent any passing in the turns (swerve on the straights and a faster car is still second)
In comes commercial interests seeing the profit potential in having Initial-D style competition with real cars. Hence having to regulate some rules and have judges to prevent anyone from trying to "cheat" by driving properly (grip driving)

Some (maybe even most) that discuss drifting at this forum should read the d1gp regulations, and judge the sport from that. NOT from arcade games like NFS, stupid hollywood movies or from what 13y.o kids say it is. That would make you look less stupid when you open your mouth.

You could say its not racing, well I diddn't call "left turn only"-racing or drag racing proper racing either a few years ago. I like to watch skateboarding but as an art form not a competition. Remove the judges and its a decent ultra sprint racing style (where all races between similar cars with similarly skilled races will tie)

Further studies: Check out the rally vids of Christian Rigollet, some episodes of Initial-D (skip the teen drama parts you might go mentally ill) some d1gp races, and a race of iceracing (like trophee andross).

Quote from heson :

That would make you look less stupid when you open your mouth.

This is the internet -> http://www.ofoghlu.net/log/Lanet-vi-Internet-Map.jpg

This is the forum -> http://www.lfsforum.net/

And this is me saying.

No one gives a shit.

Quote from mkinnov8 :

Then im retarded, anyone with me? Also really tired of this same subject. Fair enough its a form of motorsport, however I was always brought up on the belief that to go fast you need grip. Thus to me, the more I drift and slide, the more time I lose, and the more I ware out my tires.

It would be no supprise to me if people think im wrong, they can think what they like, same with drifting. Each to their own works for me.

you find that yourself ? drifting is slower than grip ITS A FACT dont need to get a proof of it.

so drifting is a sport like racing, juged principaly by angle / speed

so why evryone hate drifter we dont play in our server ... play in your race server and drifters will play in drift server. its a racing simulation thats why drift is used in this game.

Not this shit again.

Drifters go to the drift servers.

Racers go to the race servers.

Those who do both choose a server according to what you want to do now.

About the speed thing.
Fastest way around any track is a slight four wheel drift. Unfortunately this chews up your tyres very quickly and requires very much consentration so in a race you can't do that.

Can we PLEASE have a lock on this?

Quote from March Hare :

Not this shit again.

Drifters go to the drift servers.

Racers go to the race servers.

Those who do both choose a server according to what you want to do now.

About the speed thing.
Fastest way around any track is a slight four wheel drift. Unfortunately this chews up your tyres very quickly and requires very much consentration so in a race you can't do that.

wrong.

The fastest way is to keep the car as straight as possible, everytime you loose traction on the rear wheels, its forward motion that is lost longitudaly, loosing that little bit of speed. It might be usefull in rallying, but not road racing.

Quote from March Hare :

Not this shit again.

Drifters go to the drift servers.

Racers go to the race servers.

Those who do both choose a server according to what you want to do now.

Quote from bbman :

Can we PLEASE have a lock on this?

Exactly.

Quote from jayhawk :

Exactly.

+1 for the lock

I didn't read this whole thread I don't want to go through 3 pages just to read flame posts or whatever.


Lets say, the immature "drifters" are the people who make a thread about why drifting is better than racing or whatnot. Yet the good people, and the more mature people, just don't care. I don't know why you made this thread since it just will end up in a flame war.

Quote from lfs-drift staff :

you find that yourself ? drifting is slower than grip ITS A FACT dont need to get a proof of it.

so drifting is a sport like racing, juged principaly by angle / speed

so why evryone hate drifter we dont play in our server ... play in your race server and drifters will play in drift server. its a racing simulation thats why drift is used in this game.

Sigh.

Theres speed drifting, battle drifting, other kinds.

Grow up.