I had a quick read of the script guide on LFS manual, and it seems that its not possible to make a script 'hold down' a key, so it won't be possible to make a lfs script to do the instant 90 degree look. -edit- maybe it is possible, ill look into it after dinner.
It would be possible to make a macro do the instant 90 degree look with a macro program like AutoHotkey.
The "DFP"-point is not valid. You can always go to the options and set up two keys you can press simultaneously while racing to controll your view, or you could simply use the profiler software or an lfs-script to make your dpad behave like it were the two buttons pressed...
it's not like it has been hardcoded into the game that you have to use the dpad to view around.
That makes most of racing wheels "ill-suited" for LFS. Even the G25 isn't any piece of ergonomic marvel and pressing two buttons to get a glance on your side is more of an annoyance. It is racisms towards the people with short fingers and I will not allow it!!!1111
In real life it is possible to move your head no matter what your feet and hands are doing. In LFS it isn't since everything is controlled by a button or axis, by hand and foot. We look into other directions by pressing a button. Before X30 it was hard to glance at your side while changing gears, now it is impossible. When I see a real life contraption that doesn't allow you to move your eyeballs or turn your head while shifting gears I'll start the praise on the new 45 look as well. HANS isn't a requirement either, just an option.
It is really just a feature that isn't yet properly implemented. But to make a petition of it is stupid, I agree.
Only stupid thing of me was to forget the amount of elitist attitude in sim racing (how i did, i dont know), ive been following thousands of discussions during my time in sim racing about realistic and whats not realistic, so much, that ive grown completely tired of it.. Only thing i care about personally nowadays is the amount of fun im having. No matter how elitist you try to get about it, its still only a damned a videogame, just like kids playing with toy cars.. the toys are just more expensive. Anyway, thanks to all who signed.. im gonna step out of this discussion (never leads anywhere, as any realistic/not realistic wont). Im going to have fun no matter how it is.. and frankly it wont even take at all time to get used to new look keys, since the new system is almost like in any other sim ive raced. Keep on arguing, maybe one day you achieve something with it
Thanks for your useless comments. I never mentioned the DFP. I didn't say that all feedback was whining - you seem to think I did. Learn to read. I also didn't say that anyone wasn't allowed to express an opinion, but in your case maybe that wouldn't be a bad suggestion.
Any wheel with two buttons is not ill suited to head turn. Not sure what you are trying to say otherwise.
HANS is a requirement for many race series and the number in which it is mandatory will increase.
MY post offered some advice about getting your issues heard and taken seriously and answered Deggis' post about why people feel the way they do about the realism. YOUR post was full of ignorant assumptions and drama. While I try to help people all you want to do is tear them down. Time you grew the hell up.
I think using a profiler type solution just to look around is unnessary and thought the way LFS handled the look buttons was really intuitive before , 2 buttons for left right or look back
About the HANS device you mention, you do realise that the tethers can be adjusted to allow for (yes more restricted) head movements, and the drivers view (his eyes) can easly look 90 deg left or right.
I think Quint was reacting to your paraghaph about bitching and moaning..... "One thing is for sure: bitching and moaning about changes won't get you very far. If you can't make a valid, sensible and polite argument for your case you won't gather much support. A petition is a waste of time, as petitions usually are. Insulting people who don't necessarily promote your view is also a waste of time. Hostility is no way forward, even if has been hatched from genuine frustration."
I understand a petition will not change anything , thats why I havn't added my name to it, but I do believe the way the view is handled in patch X31 is a step in the wrong direction and would like to continue disscussing it without all the mud slinging
Most if not all wheels are ill-suited when you have to press two buttons at the same time. It is a simple factor of human biology and wheel construction. 99% of the wheels have zero adjustability and the design is mostly based on looks and not usability. Humans have different size of hands and fingers. And so on...
There have been lots of good reasons why the instant 90-degree view should be still available on one button press. I'm not going to repeat them here.
HANS is required only on international races. Other than that it is optional. From what I've gathered. I guess the word international in LFS includes the single seaters and maybe the GTRs. Maybe, because the cars are seemingly old looking and as such it is a bit mystery whether you would race them internationally on 2007. Nor that HANS was used at the time they were originally used (early 90s?). Not that HANS limits so heavily your vision not would be the main reason why your vision is somewhat blocked in real racing car. The seat has a much greater effect on this and is (would be) the best and most natural way of simulating the limited view or fov in LFS.
I don't use the profiler personally. I also have never had any trouble using both buttons to look back, it isn't hard to do in my experience. A little practice does marvelous things.
Despite the adjustment of HANS, the typical racing harness doesn't give your shoulders much freedom to aid a head turn. You certainly won't be free too check blind spots.
I don't see why he would react to my comments unless he was guilty of bitching and moaning, but since I wasn't quoting anything he said I am at a loss to see why he took it upon himself to react the way he did. Unless he's just pissed off because of the changes and felt like taking it out on me. In any case, it was unwarranted to unleash his anger on me. My suggestion stands about making sensible arguments if you want to be taken seriously.
Thanks for taking the time to discuss your own concerns in a civilized manner, hopefully some others will learn form your example.
The requirement of HANS is not limited to international events (V8 Supercars since 2005, for example), it is up to each governing body to make their own rules. Racing seats also often have head protection which doesn't do much for your view either. Regardless of all that, HANS does limit your head and neck movement, as does a racing seat and harness.
I'm sure there have been lots of good reasons, though many people's feedback would serve them better if they detailed what controller and method they currently use. There IS a lot of silly and unproductive whining going on since the patch. Nobody learns anything from that.
I don't have any problem with a one-touch = 90 degree look, but neither do I foresee any problems in adapting to a 2-button look since it was never a problem when looking back under the old system.
although im getting used to it, i still find it a little uncomfortable trying to press both buttons on my g25 wheel to look left and right when im going round a corner and the wheel is almost upside down. I prettymuch never use the 45deg view. I would prefer one press to be 90 and maybe instead of looking straight back when you press both, it looks back 135deg, like looking over your shoulder at the cars blind spot, which to me seems about the furthest i can turn my head while driving, and still seems totally realistic.
I find it slightly worrying that people see the 45degree look as a useful way of using the mirrors! Mirrors should always be in your peripheral vision, and you should be able to look at both, not one or the other.
IRL if the mirrors, or at least the major mirror, is not in easy sight, you do something about it. Maybe the virtual mirror needs replacing with something that better resembles the wing-mirror perspective, but certainly a button that takes your view from the road ahead is not a sensible solution to that problem.
I expect someone to say: F1 drivers have to turn their head to look at their mirrors. That may be the case, although I'm sure they're in their peripheral vision at all times, but I guarantee that when they turn their head they can still see the road in front of them at the same time.
Really? See the file I attached. The head is turned more than 45 degrees, probably closer to 60. Coupled with the eye motion, that should give FOV of over 100 degrees, even taking the helmet into account.
Then let the cockpit geometry obscure part of view.
Pushing 2 buttons where one suffices is a pain in the ass and bad design. Creating artificial hardships and annoyances does not lead to more realism.
I always use the virtual mirror, so I don't need to check the side ones that often. When I look to the side, I actually need to look to the side -- fast -- and I don't need the multiple buttons bullshit. That's why people ask for an OPTION to be put in. If you prefer the 45-90 mode, fine. I'd rather have 75-100, or maybe even try 90-45.
