The first thing I want to check out when I updated to the patch Y is the clutch.
I tried to let the XRT going in the game as I often do in real world.
I gave a little bit gas, and slowly release the clutch, and then the car started to move.
After 20 times of doing this, the clutch gone....
I honestly did it in a very gentle way....the rev. never goes above 4K rpm...but...that's the truth

You can't man-handle the truth!

I tested for 2hrs on this very clutch....
every clutch would die out around 20-30 times of starting....I mean on XRT

while driving press F10, it will show you, besides car damage, the Clutch tTemperature, the more heat the less effective it gets, so, monitor that, and keep it cool. It's color coded, by the way

Quote from nelson_trujillo :

while driving press F10, it will show you, besides car damage, the Clutch tTemperature, the more heat the less effective it gets, so, monitor that, and keep it cool. It's color coded, by the way

then i got u.
CT means clutch temperature....
i thought it is the measure of how hard the clutch was damaged...

Quote from yueyue :

I honestly did it in a very gentle way....the rev. never goes above 4K rpm...but...that's the truth

Would you expect a normal road car in real life to enjoy that treatment over and over 30 times or so?

Solution- Let off the gas when you shift (that means don't flatshift), don't try to go from a dead stop in 3rd gear either.

No, I think he is right in his conclusion. The clutch is not right for this moment, and there is no such thing in real world.

A clutch that becomes dead after 15 or 30 minutes of gently race just can be made of paper.

Clutchs are made of resistent materials, made for sliding and heating.

Scawen should review his numbers, cause the clutch waste is not real at this moment.

Quote from Speed Soro :

Scawen should review his numbers, cause the clutch waste is not real at this moment.

I think alot are missing the point

LFS is a race simultator so naturally Scawen will concentrate on getting things to work close to realistic in race conditions, this sometimes means a temporay compromise in realism in normal driving conditions.

That has happened with tyre physics and now with clutch heat. Doesn't mean it will remain that way, it will no doubt be refined as we go along. But the priority is to get it implemented and behaving acceptably in race conditions first. This in my view has been achieved.

If you can't drive one of the cars in LFS at the moment in race conditions without significant heat build up in the clutch then your doing something terribly wrong

Quote from wabbit :

Would you expect a normal road car in real life to enjoy that treatment over and over 30 times or so?

you knw, in big cities of China, during the traffic jams, taxi drivers(they all drive stick shift cars because those are cheap to buy) usually do more than what i have tested

Quote from h3adbang3r :

Solution- Let off the gas when you shift (that means don't flatshift), don't try to go from a dead stop in 3rd gear either.

I even did not shift to second gear.
I just tested the starting, so i didnt do flatshift

Quote from Glenn67 :

I think alot are missing the point

LFS is a race simultator so naturally Scawen will concentrate on getting things to work close to realistic in race conditions, this sometimes means a temporay compromise in realism in normal driving conditions.

That has happened with tyre physics and now with clutch heat. Doesn't mean it will remain that way, it will no doubt be refined as we go along. But the priority is to get it implemented and behaving acceptably in race conditions first. This in my view has been achieved.

If you can't drive one of the cars in LFS at the moment in race conditions without significant heat build up in the clutch then your doing something terribly wrong

yep, i agree with u.
but, i just feel a little bit uncomfortable cause i alway expect LFS to be perfect

Just a heads up YueYue, you can multi quote, you don't need a new post each time. Just click the middle tab in the lower left of each post...................^^ that one, erm does that make sense ? it's the button with the quotation marks and the + sign

I also felt like the clutch was too sensitive to damage as I drove as I do in real life speed shifting and I did not have a problem in real life. Another problem is that our controllers do not have a friction point so it is hard to tell when to push on the gas. Clutch slipping is seen as the temperature rises. It looks like I need to learn driving all over again with clutch.

The CT damage gauge shows wear and temperature.

The length of the bar shows wear and the color shows temperature.

EDIT: I learned how to avoid wear on the clutch right after posting this. Haha. It just means I have to adjust my driving style and skill. :-)

Yeah Clutch is very Unrealistic !!!

Temperature values must be adjusted and timing too !!!


New Patch is needed ASAP !!!

during the test patch I recomended when they do brake temperatures and grip values there.. They should just make the clutch heat more of a intial grip level that doesn't get too high..

Or unless your excessively power shifting (over doing it not apply torque correctly), flat shifting, downshifting, and just sliping it making it extreamly like 2-3x normeral opererating temp.. Then it starts a glaze, if you glaze it too much then you start having problems....

I never did get a response back


The clutch is made to apply the torque to the wheels, if it can't do the properly under light conditions.. Technically it's not doing it's job


But the game is a alpha still, and will always keep improving.. I'm sure there will be alot more patches people disagree with

Nonono, CT is clutch temperature, you can't damage the clutch just yet.
Feels about right if you ask me :S
Burned a clutch out driving a VW jetta up a hill once at a stop sign, tried about the same angle in LFS and did just as good a job burning out the clutch ingame as I did in my friend's jetta

Quote from XCNuse :

Nonono, CT is clutch temperature, you can't damage the clutch just yet.
Feels about right if you ask me :S
Burned a clutch out driving a VW jetta up a hill once at a stop sign, tried about the same angle in LFS and did just as good a job burning out the clutch ingame as I did in my friend's jetta

I got 100k out of my jetta.. My GTI is at 109k.. I can torque it and hold it going up hills all day

I use a button for a clutch and have'nt had a problem....

IRL, when I get into a new car with a clutch.. I'll feel the grip point before before I start driving it.. Maybe I'll drive city how I would in the city and try to simulate traffic (few stops before I get to the intersections)

Yes, clutch is not right, it is bit too strong at the moment for most of cars.

Look that RPM gauge of yours, you don't ever launch car at 3000rpm IRL, that is really rare, yet you launch it at 6000rpm in LFS, you have 1st gear that will get your speed to near 80kph in lfs, you don't have such IRL, probably more like 50 or even 40kph.

I did test clutch on XRT, I did take over 20 starts, similar to fast launch from traffic lights, accelerated to 80 kph, braked and did same again, non stop, hardly any clutch temp.

If you have problems with clutch, you are doing something wrong, or your setup is wrong, be prepared that in some day future clutch is not going to be as strong as it is now.

Quote from JTbo :

you don't ever launch car at 3000rpm IRL, that is really rare, yet you launch it at 6000rpm in LFS

True.. In real life If I'm just driving it I'll get it up around .9k-1.1k and hold the torqe untill I get going..

if I'm taking off quickly about 1400 to 3200 ish.. But I've tuned cars and stuff, I feel like all the LFS car's act as if it is chipped with a lightened flywheel..

My jetta has a lightned flywheel and a stage II clutch and I can release the torque fine at like 4-5k

Quote from XCNuse :

Nonono, CT is clutch temperature, you can't damage the clutch just yet.
Feels about right if you ask me :S
Burned a clutch out driving a VW jetta up a hill once at a stop sign, tried about the same angle in LFS and did just as good a job burning out the clutch ingame as I did in my friend's jetta

Really, then why get a get a bright red bar even when the bar was small. The bar then increased in size and the clutch started slipping.

When the bar is red, that means it is overheated, and you'll notice that it will slip. It is the exact same way with the tire and suspension displays, when they turn red, they're overheated/damaged (and I say damaged here because the suspension.. doesn't exactly have temperature issues).

If there were damage, you wouldn't be able to switch gears.. period without destroying a gearbox.. unless you want to get into the serious technicalities of how to do that without destroying a gearbox, I on the other hand do not know exactly how to do that, just have the concept of how it works down.

Now if you don't believe me about it being only temperature, here are the exact words from .. whoever updated the LFS main site explaining the updates.
"Clutch overheating system and display in F9 / F10"
heat.. is a form of energy and is determined by a temperature scale, thus.. it has nothing to do with damage.

As i understand it, when the clutch heats up it physically expands, thereby it can't fully disengage from the bit thats attached to the gearbox, so full power can't be put through the transmission. When the clutch is slipping its the two plates of the clutch physically rubbing against each other which results in an intermittent surge of power (power on/power off ie clutch in clutch out), thats why if you wait a while the clutch cools down and you get full drive again....

Having said all that, i agree with JTbo, i personally think the clutch is a bit to strong, i'd like it much weaker thereby eliminating the ability to flatshift.


Ok just read that first bit again, and i don't know what the hell i said, it didnt make much sense at all, maybe someone with a bit more of a techy brain will explain it better

Current clutch model does not have perfect glazing implemented, that is what would happen because of heat + lot of slippage and it won't go away when clutch cools down.

I think everyone should read and understand this, it helps a bit of understanding why clutch must be used way it must be used.

Quote from JTbo :

Yes, clutch is not right, it is bit too strong at the moment for most of cars.

Look that RPM gauge of yours, you don't ever launch car at 3000rpm IRL, that is really rare, yet you launch it at 6000rpm in LFS, you have 1st gear that will get your speed to near 80kph in lfs, you don't have such IRL, probably more like 50 or even 40kph.

I did test clutch on XRT, I did take over 20 starts, similar to fast launch from traffic lights, accelerated to 80 kph, braked and did same again, non stop, hardly any clutch temp.

If you have problems with clutch, you are doing something wrong, or your setup is wrong, be prepared that in some day future clutch is not going to be as strong as it is now.

I believe this man holds the correct answer.
Most setups in live for speed are setup with excessively long 1st gear's. I downloaded a setup pack and most setups for most cars had 1st gear winding out to 80 - 100km/h that's insanity. Unless we are talking supercars I wouldn't expect to be able to do more then 60km/h in most cars 1st gear. Remember in the real world that gear must be short enough to allow you to accelerate from a stand still without having to slip the clutch excessively. It is when you have an extremely tall 1st gear that you burn clutches because you have to keep slipping it so much to get the car moving while remaining in the powerband.

Now this is a interesting little subject here.
Short 1st gear and a low rpm launch will not kill the clutch
If you have a tall 1st gear you can still get away without killing the clutch if your extremely violent with it and are able to make the car wheel spin, Suddenly all the force is transmitted to the wheels which become the component without enough grip to provide positive forward drive.
Worst case scenario and this happens often is if your tyres are extremely grippy and 1st gear is very tall it's possible that the power of the engine and the grip of the tyres can overcome the clamping force and grip of the clutch which means when you let the clutch out you get massive slip, heat and a ruined clutch.

Clutch heat isn't the end of the world. Set your car up accordingly to be realistic and drive accordingly to this new condition and I think you will be fine.

On a side note I have adjusted my setups and I now no longer have any clutch heat problems. I did around about 9 hours of racing yesterday and not once did I cook my clutch unless I tried to kill it. And i'm racing with a G25, full manual and H pattern shifter.