Quote from JohnUK89 :

1. In the application of a car turning a corner centrifugal force *does not exist*. You're looking at centripetal force there.

2. If you don't start sliding you have rolling friction between the road and the road. If you *do* start sliding then it is dynamic friction. Where does static friction come into this? Does a car magically turn a corner while not moving?

Rolling friction is a resistance to rolling (forward motion), and it is quite small in magnitude.

Static friction is friction between two surfaces that are not sliding against each other. It is the centripetal force, turning the car, if you are not skidding.

Dynamic friction is friction between surfaces that are sliding against each other, so it occurs when you are skidding.

Frictional force is mathematically equal to the normal force (i.e. - perpendicular to the surfaces; equal to weight, if on a horizontal surface) multiplied by the coefficient of friction (experimentally determined, for a pair of specified surfaces under specified conditions; commonly between 0 and 1). The coefficient of static friction can be any value up to a maximum (its generally quoted value IS the maximum) that occurs just before the surfaces start to slide; that is to say that static friction is maximum at the threshold of sliding/skidding. The coefficient of dynamic friction, is typically smaller than the coefficient of static friction, for a specified pair of surfaces and conditions, so that there is less frictional force between surfaces, when they are sliding (dynamic friction), than when they are not (static friction). This is why skidding is discouraged, for most effective vehicle control, including braking, steering and acceleration with the drive wheels.

Quote from lerts :

and that it went weell on pianos i find default formula bmw in blackwood to spin everytime you touch a piano

You spin every time you touch a piano?

I think your translator doesn't work very well. Did you mean Piano? Or Kerb? I'm now trying to work out what word you put in the translator to get "piano" out of it...

Quote from spankmeyer :

Just for the record: Lerts is not my fake account.

Quote from lerts :

i use ghost car it gets removed i use digital speedo it gets removed i use outside view it gets removed i use previus version to use ghostcar, records get removed being pointless keeping at

Not read any replies.

1. Ghostcar never in the game. Game updates might make unofficial addons not work. Like in EVERY game EVER.
2. Digital speedo still there in some cars
3. Outside view still there, to keep the arcade-brigade happy.
4. No need to use previous version - if you NEED to ghostcar you must suck!

Quote :

but what annoys me the most is the game is to favour arcade players against pilots

Pilots, like people who use external views and ghostcars?

Quote :

a pilot will search the limits without crossing if you spinn the wheel too much either front or rear wheels skid if back wheels you spin

Do the arcade drivers drive well below the limit then?

Quote :

if front wheels skid nothing happens

What???

Quote :

wait nothing happens and what about centrifugal force and diference between static and dinamic friction

Where does this mysterious centrifugal force act? How do you know static and dynamic frictions aren't modelled?

Quote :

if you oversteer the wheel and skid front wheels the car will go straight and go off the road no way it can keep turning

Erm, in real life (watch F1 parade laps, my parade laps [albeit less impressive], and nearly all parade laps before races) it occurs, as it does in LFS. It's even used by slightly stupid people to balance oversteer! They call it induced understeer, rather than steering to much without thinking of course.

Quote from spankmeyer :

Just for the record: Lerts is not my fake account.

I dunno, I doubt both your mental healths about the same.

Quote from lerts :

logic and intuition tells me rfactor is the one crrectly modeled

I hope my next pilot has a bit better intuition...

...in fact, I hope ALL pilots have better intuition. That's kind of scary, lol.

From his last post I started to actually believe those people that say killings happen because of games...

Quote from lerts :

formula bmw has a digital speedo but cant see it

Is Formula BWM in the demo now?

Quote from Jarulf :

Is Formula BWM in the demo now?

Yes.

buy S2 everything gets better.

I just wanted to express my astonishment about people who don´t support the developers by buying the game constantly complain about the game!

Was I sarcastic? Yes, but after having read so many complaints and whining by demo racers (We can´t drift any more for free!!!) I think I have the right to act like that.

What would the devolopers of Crysis say, ig people who only want to play the demo kept demanding features they are not willed to pay for?

Quote from NikLaw :

I just wanted to express my astonishment about people who don´t support the developers by buying the game constantly complain about the game!

And so you decided to treat all demo players as persons who can't speak, even the vast majority not complaining. Strictly speaking from a business point of view, do you think it's right treating potential customers that way? If you think you're right, why do you think you're the right person to do so, since you're a customer and not a seller?

Quote from lerts :

i use ghost car it gets removed i use digital speedo it gets removed i use outside view it gets removed i use previus version to use ghostcar, records get removed being pointless keeping at

but what annoys me the most is the game is to favour arcade players against pilots

a pilot will search the limits without crossing if you spinn the wheel too much either front or rear wheels skid if back wheels you spin

if front wheels skid nothing happens

wait nothing happens and what about centrifugal force and diference between static and dinamic friction

if you oversteer the wheel and skid front wheels the car will go straight and go off the road no way it can keep turning

if u pay for the game, then u can complain about it, since in your case it was free....shut it

Quote from NikLaw :

Since you are a demo racer, it doesn´t matter what you think. Even licensed racers are only supposed to suggest improvements or post constructive criticism.

Excuse me, But everyone has an opinion, This is what I hate about Live for Speed - People always saying bad things about us Demo Players.. I mean Come on.. it ruins the game!

EDIT: Oh and Niklaw can I just say... Not all demo players are whiners.. I dont whine about the game or what I dont have access to, I would love to buy S2 but my parents dont allow me, so C'mon stop dissing Demo players and go enjoy the game.

EDIT2: I agree with Sgt.Flippy, alot of deaths happen because of video games, People being treated Unfairly, being told "It doesnt matter what they think" Etc, Really Imo, everyone has an opinion on what happens, but except when Demo players demand s2 stuff etc, because they should go pay for s2 =]

Quote from Fredthebest :

Excuse me, But everyone has an opinion, This is what I hate about Live for Speed - People always saying bad things about us Demo Players.. I mean Come on.. it ruins the game!

True, everyone does have an opinion, but that of demoer's isn't really top of the dev's minds when they're considering something. Sure, they'll think of demoers when they do stuff to the game, because they want you to buy the real product.

Quote from Fredthebest :

EDIT: Oh and Niklaw can I just say... Not all demo players are whiners.. I dont whine about the game or what I dont have access to, I would love to buy S2 but my parents dont allow me, so C'mon stop dissing Demo players and go enjoy the game.

Dead true - not all demo players are whiners, some are/were valued members of the LFS community. However, such caracters are unfortunatly rare on these forums.

A typical demoer whines. Fact.

Someone said this in /b/:

Epic troll is still a troll.

I have nothing more to report. Carry on.

Quote from Gekkibi :

Someone said this in /b/:

Epic troll is still a troll.

I have nothing more to report. Carry on.

Is that you, Spanky?

Quote from niall09 :

Is that you, Spanky?

No, I got enough alter forumegos already.

I need to get a few alter egos myself :P

Quote from Albieg :

Strictly speaking from a business point of view, do you think it's right treating potential customers that way? If you think you're right, why do you think you're the right person to do so, since you're a customer and not a seller?

Something for you to dwell on. When you go to your...I dunno, let's say Tesco's, how many products have free samples that you can use or consume before actually buying the product? If you were to buy a 50 pound toaster, does the company give you a mini toaster that toasts one slice of bread for free?

If you ask me, I think the gaming and software industry has a strange way of business practices. If anything, it encourages freeloading.

Quote from jayhawk :

Something for you to dwell on. When you go to your...I dunno, let's say Tesco's

There's no Tesco where I live, but as a sysadmin I can assure you that there are plenty of people asking me daily to try and buy their software products, and they give me free demos, sometimes even full products for evaluation.

You probably don't even know what M$ is doing for companies involved in partnerships with them, and maybe you don't know what I'm entitled to offer as demos as a partner, or as an MCP.

And you probably think that a slice of bread and digital data are the same thing, since you're comparing apples and pears.

Just for the record, static/dynamic friction doesn't apply the same to tires as it does to objects like your stapler on your desk. Tires are much more complex, and in fact generate maximum grip with particular amounts of slippage. There's plenty of reading around the net to learn about tires. Centrifugal force also does not technically exist either. It's perfectly easy to understeer off the track in LFS. Come in to a turn to hot, turn the wheel all the way and report what happens.

No, in LFS tires do not magically turn into blocks of ice the minute any amount of slip starts to happen, unlike in RF. It's it's not obvious to you that tires don't act that way in real life, then take your car (if you can drive, are old enough etc then take your car into a parking lot safely when noone's around, and have a go).

Quote from Albieg :

And you probably think that a slice of bread and digital data are the same thing, since you're comparing apples and pears.

Please do not misinterpret me or twist my words. What I mean is that I find it strange that a industry such as as gaming and software, that a person can receives good or services for no monetary exchange, and that it is encouraged in this industry more so than any other that come to mind at the moment. I mean, software doesn't just magically come from nothing, there is a person or person who take a part of the companies profits in the form of labor, who ends up really paying for the demos? How can a company exist by giving a percentage of their profits away, never to see them, as there will alway be software freeloaders?

Make no mistake, Scavier are very dedicated, passionate group of people, but they also have bills to pay. For a person that exclusively uses the demo, then comes to the forum here and has the gall to complain about something that is given to them for free, at the expense of Scavier, and ultimately you, as we S2 users are the ones who absorb the cost of the demo users, is insulting to me, and it should be to you to.

Now if a demo user come to board to give informative feedback about the game as to better improve it, the more the merrier, we should all encourage that, and encourage demo users to buy the full game.

To have a demo user make a post venting their frustration about something they use for free, well, in my book, they have no leg to stand on.

Myself, I am so very grateful for the people who make add-on's at their own expense of time and effort, and never would I berate them for making something that I would not know how to do.

Then again, I am not part of the "entitlement generation".

Quote from jayhawk :

Please do not misinterpret me or twist my words.

Please do not misinterpret me or twist my words. I don't like demo users requests, but sensible suggestions may be always welcome, just as tech assistance request to evaluate something.

As I said before, the software industry has its rules, and the only things I'm entitled to are what you'll find written in laws and rules, generally speaking.

I have my ideas and they are quite radical, but I'm not willing to force them down your throat. My intervention was only to ask if one (not even entitled to speak for others) can treat potential customers - all of them - in a bad way. If so, you must have an outstanding product able to sell itself with word of mouth. If it's not so, you can't treat all potential customers badly, you show the door only to those breaking balls.

Saying that demo users - ALL of them - cannot voice an opinion or try to understand how LFS works participating in this forum is just bad commerce practice.

And I'm not the one who says how things work. I just happen to be part of the software/hardware industry, so I took a look at these aspects. I may disagree with them, but generally this is what happens.

Quote from Albieg :

*snip*

Oh, well alright then.

This thread has really made me laugh. I want a Piano mod now