Hey all,

I've been getting into FSX since I recently obtained a PC capable of actually running it properly, and I was wondering if there are any people here willing to go do some flying online? I know it's possible to just go online in any server, but I figured it would be more fun with some chaps from the LFS community, going up and just flying around a bit; perhaps some 'sigh-seeing', formation flying or just island hopping or whatever

I don't know how popular flight sims are in general (although I did find a few threads covering other aspects of FSX) but I'd like to try getting some people together (or just two ;p)

Anyhoo, I have a vent server available for chatting if anyone is interested, let me know.

Attaching some screenies would be a great idea. I'm too lazy for searching it on Google

Quote from LFSn00b :

Meh i want FSX How good it is?

Well, I don't know how much into flightsims you are, but it's more or less FS9 with more complexity in the landscape, and some more demanding graphical features like wingflexing and all sorts of movable parts

The expansion has carrier take-offs/landings with the F/A-18.

Other than that, it's just another flightsim with updated graphics, and a bunch of really fun and challenging missions. Online mode has ATC support, so players can assume the role of tower and give headings and approaches to other players, although I have not tried this myself

As for the screenshots: I'd have to reboot into *Vista to get some proper screens (DX10 and all), and so I'll do that tomorrow-morning, any requests?

*More of an excuse, I'm busy with other games right now =)

I use X-Plane. Not as pretty, but it's like LFS in terms of realistic aircraft handling. In fact, it's almost exactly the same. It's like three guys going up against Microsoft. The graphics are nowhere near as much eye-candy, but it's hailed as much more realistic since it actually models airflow over the aircraft. In fact, recently he upgraded the tire physics for when you are on the ground to what he called "car simulation level" realism.

How "hard" is it? I've got a fairly crappy M$ one of these...



Even worth trying to play with one of these? My "experience" includes BF2 and the good old Combat Flight Sim (1 & 2), so perhaps i'll crash and burn but meh.

I wouldn't even bother with FSX or FS9 if you're not serious about spending *hours* navigating, reading instruments, flying mundane routes, and practicing your maneuvers. Personally, I love that kind of thing, which is why I love flight simming. I can spend hours simply flying a small WWI fighter around France, or even a large modern aircraft across the Atlantic.

As far as X-Plane goes, yes, it does indeed have its merits - and it's a very good simulation - but MSFS is far from unrealistic. It never has been marketed as a 'game' and, as such, has never been plagued with severe dumbing down and fudging like in so many 'sims' in the sim-racing world. I wouldn't say that the X-Plane/MSFS sim-divide is obvious - they both have fantastic merits, and unbelievable drawbacks.

There is little merit in any realistic flight simulator unless you are willing to just sit for hours doing relatively nothing, just because you want to clock up flight hours and experience. Payware addons like FSPassengers add a lot to the immersion factor of passenger flights (both modern and older), but require a lot more skill.

Don't expect to be having lots of fun flying around on MSFS or X-Plane if you're not willing to take it at least half as seriously as real aviation. Otherwise, you may want to go and play a flying 'game' instead.

As for controls, well, your keyboard *can* suffice - but I'd strongly recommend against it. At the very basic end, any old joystick will do - but ideally you want a very sturdy, robust and precise set of tools. The low-end of stuff you're looking at (minus rudder and a proper flight-column) is something like Saitek's X52 (or X45 if you can still find it) - though these are better suited to sims like Falcon 4.0 and LOMAC (for obvious reasons).

Edit: (more stuff)
You'll also want to be looking in the direction of some quality addons (there are some top-notch freeware ones, but for the absolute quality - you want to go payware... things like SSTSIM are very well rated in the dedicated FS community). The default planes in both MSFS and X-Plane are lacking in those details that make the flight-simming experience perfect (things like nicely detailed VCs, etc). That's an obvious side effect of something being shipped with a product like this.

Don't expect to have a nice banter with the ATC in either sim, they're very limited and are honed for near-perfect route-based flight. Of course, you can always fly VFR... but where's the fun in that for anything over the size of a King Air? There are some ATC add-ons for MSFS, and apparently some do some good stuff (but I haven't bothered - as the normal ATC doesn't interfere with my flying).

Basically, if you're looking for civilian and commercial flight-simulation, you want MSFS9 (or X if you feel like risking it) or X-Plane. If you're looking for realistic combat sims, there are only two options here... LOMAC or Falcon 4.0 (For LOMAC you'll want Flaming Cliffs addon, as it's essentially a huge bug-fixing addon, plus a new plane, to correct the state of release when Ubi forced the release of LOMAC early).

Pacific Fighters would be my choice. Very hard to handle and you have to aim/shoot something.

Quote from VoiD :

Pacific Fighters would be my choice. Very hard to handle and you have to aim/shoot something.

Rather get Il2 1946, as it includes Il2 Sturmovik + Forgotten Battles+ the Aces Expansion + Pacific Fighters + a few bits more. And that's the piece to have when you want to dogfight online.

Heck, if you're one of the idiot sods that has a 360 controller, even FSX is decent with that, due to it actually being accurate by using xInput rather than DirectInput.

Ha funny, reading this thread while thinking about IL2 and then the two last posts (if i type fast enough..probably 4 by now) mention it.

My previous job had one guy who was a total FS geek. He brought a laptop and an old stick to the ship to "practise" the flights he would do during his stint home. At home he has a whole cockpit with several screens and flies long haul flights online with a payware plane (think a 747-800 or A3XX?) and real persons doing the towercontroll and weatherinfo. Slightly nuts imo but if it's fun to him, why not.

On the IL2 topic.
Play it regularly, but only on one set of servers as i can't stand most (arcade settings,icons,3rd person view,speedbar etc)
Anyone who plays it now and then should check the servers of ; http://warbirdsofprey.org/index.php ; simply love them..historic objective based maps with both pacific and european theatre covered, fullreal settings and good teamwork over TS.

And to comply with the screenshot request ill post a few of their friday night(US-time) bomberevents (free to join for anyone interested )









Many more and even a track(for the fans :d) of our Ploesti-raid from two weeks back here :
http://neuvostoliitto.org/nakki/

I wish FSX would install on my new computer. It either bluescreens or refuses to read the data when I put in the 2nd disc. The disc is not the problem, either.

Quote from JamesF1 :

Stuff

Good read for those willing to take a step into proper flight simming

Just to get the point across: although I do want to have regular old fun, I don't want to fly around and crash into buildings at random, I actually want to do some proper flying ;D

Meanwhile... anyone interested? I'm reading a lot on other sims, which is interesting (X-Plane looks quite nice as a simulation), but obtaining the other software and leaving FSX is a step too soon ;-)

Quote from ColeusRattus :

Rather get Il2 1946, as it includes Il2 Sturmovik + Forgotten Battles+ the Aces Expansion + Pacific Fighters + a few bits more. And that's the piece to have when you want to dogfight online.

Actually I meant IL2-1946. Was a bit confused about the names and versions...

I have fs9. I got it recently after playing fs2002 quite long time and i really like it.
Some people are saying negative things of fsx and they have switched back to fs9, im not sure what problems they had but anyways.
I have some vids in youtube of my fs2002 landings.
http://www.youtube.com/user/tondzali

Just say when and where im ready to do some online flyin´

Quote from Jertje :

I actually want to do some proper flying ;D

Hey Jertje, I'd recommed WSPilots, great community and hoplists on their servers.

At the moment they have Glacier Bay Search and Rescue hops, a round the world hoplist (never changed), and an Italy, Austria and Switzerland hoplist. www.wspilots.com << check it out

Quote from Jertje :

Meanwhile... anyone interested? I'm reading a lot on other sims, which is interesting (X-Plane looks quite nice as a simulation), but obtaining the other software and leaving FSX is a step too soon ;-)

Definitely - when I have time and if you grab a cheap copy of FS9 I can't bring myself to spend time with FSX... especially as it'll run like sludge on my PC. I have some good routes I used to fly with some friends that could be done. We often attempted to have races to the destination whilst flying legally and in the same plane - it was great fun

But more back on topic: I can definately recommend FSX.
On my mediocre rig it does run acceptable (~25 fps on medium settings), and while I like the realism aspect of it, I am not one of those guys who actually enjoy doing real time flights across the atlantic. Thus, civilian flight sims usually don't hook me up anymore after I tried every plane and took a look at some landmarks.
FSX offers great missions (and an even better interactive flight school), thus making it enough of a "game" for me to enjoy.

... then maybe you should join Vatsim.
These guys are very professional and maybe a bit nuts (but aren't we simmers all nuts in some way?). Just click on "Visual Display" under Network and you get an Idea what's going on there. If you have X-Plane, FS<pick a number> or another supported Sim just join a Airport and listen to the Traffic. It's like in reality... really sick
Ah, and this could look like Statistics from real Airports / Flights... but it's Vatsim too: Vataware.

Quote from ColeusRattus :

But more back on topic: I can definately recommend FSX.
On my mediocre rig it does run acceptable (~25 fps on medium settings), and while I like the realism aspect of it, I am not one of those guys who actually enjoy doing real time flights across the atlantic. Thus, civilian flight sims usually don't hook me up anymore after I tried every plane and took a look at some landmarks.
FSX offers great missions (and an even better interactive flight school), thus making it enough of a "game" for me to enjoy.

You only ever need about 25-30fps out of a flight-sim anyway (unless it's a combat one) - so that's fine, really

Quote from buedi :

...Vatsim...

Seconded

Quote from buedi :

... then maybe you should join Vatsim.
These guys are very professional and maybe a bit nuts (but aren't we simmers all nuts in some way?). Just click on "Visual Display" under Network and you get an Idea what's going on there. If you have X-Plane, FS<pick a number> or another supported Sim just join a Airport and listen to the Traffic. It's like in reality... really sick
Ah, and this could look like Statistics from real Airports / Flights... but it's Vatsim too: Vataware.

Although that looks quite epic, after reading a bit and trying to set up the program, I concluded that it is the most confusing setup process in the world. I'd probably have better luck constructing a nuclear weapon with instructions in Russian.

Just to get the right idea: I have to install the program to be able to listen in on the ATC, correct?

Edit: And I'll try to get my hands on FS9 asap ;p

Quote from JamesF1 :

You only ever need about 25-30fps out of a flight-sim anyway (unless it's a combat one) - so that's fine, really

Yup, i have FS9 locked at 22fps and it's smooth as silk.

Na , this game are like other sim of MS , all the same S***

nothing more complicated than teamspeak?

but then, going online in vatsim for the first time is the single most nervous experience I had for a longgg time. Especially when you are outside your comfort zone of flying pre-planned routes and have to change course/decenting rate and reprogramme the fmc according to tower instruction all in a short time.

Quote from Jertje :

Although that looks quite epic, after reading a bit and trying to set up the program, I concluded that it is the most confusing setup process in the world. I'd probably have better luck constructing a nuclear weapon with instructions in Russian.

It IS epic and I spent a complete Sunday just reading all the Stuff on the Homepage because I did not want to make something wrong. In the Evening I grabbed my balls, sat on a Parking Ramp on EDDF and just listened to what they where talking. I was so nervous, I was just listening and did not have the heart to talk to the ATC
I NEVER thought that Online Gaming can make one so nervous.

You should start with the "New Pilots Start Here" link on the Vatsim Homepage. You need an Account first. The "New Pilots Start Here" Page is your friend for the next few hours. If you want to jump in fast, grab the Manual for setting up FSInn and CoPilot for FX9 / FSX here: Manual
But never ever start on the Runway on a Airport with much Traffic (think: KLAX).

Currently I have not installed FSX and all this stuff, because I needed space on the HD. Also currently there is even not time to play LFS, so FSX has to wait a bit. But if you are interested in Realistic Civil Flight and are willing to invest a lot of time you should try Vatsim.

Quote from Jertje :

Just to get the right idea: I have to install the program to be able to listen in on the ATC, correct?

Edit: And I'll try to get my hands on FS9 asap ;p

To "join" you need an Account + FSInn or Squawkbox. I chose FSInn. FS9? And I thought you are flying with FSX?

Quote from Jertje :

Edit: And I'll try to get my hands on FS9 asap ;p

That's by no means necessary - I just personally prefer it to FSX because of the larger mod-base (due to how long it's been around), etc. And also because I struggle, with my current rig, to achieve full maxed-out settings on FS9... so I'm not the biggest advocate of FSX - as I can't run it at much more than a crawl

I've heard plenty of good things said about FSX. The best thing to do is to go around the web and search for some FSX reviews from respectable flight-sim websites - lots of them compare it to FS9 in a good degree of detail, and you'll get a good idea of which will suit you best (and, indeed, whether you want to invest in FS9 at all).

Quote from The Moose :

Yup, i have FS9 locked at 22fps and it's smooth as silk.

I have mine locked at 22, too... but for some people that's not quite enough. Flight simming isn't an FPS-penis contest like sim-racing, or other genre, seem to be (It's more "who's got the biggest joystick?"-contest )

Quote from Inouva :

Na , this game are like other sim of MS , all the same S***

That's completely untrue. Of course, if you see it as a "game", then it's going to seem terrible - it has no crash physics, no modelling of non-essential flight data, etc, etc. but this isn't a game. If you get to a situation where you see the 'CRASH' message, it's already far too late.

Microsoft aren't such failures at their sims as you seem to think. MSFS is the pinnacle of commercially available flight-sims (though, as I said in my post above, not without X-Plane), and other departments of the Microsoft sim initiative have produced things like MS Train Simulator (which, at the time, was the best available train simulation... and probably still is, the new EA-published one is nowhere near as good in my view).