LOL you noticed
LOL you noticed
rotf
How would he be able to catch up with me? Hit his nawwzzz button?
I got the subi for my b-day, and the celica was a piece of shit when i got it... the engine is totally decimated, the rear wheels have so much camber, you would swear that it converts into a boat... i slide a lot...
Yeah - the latter sounds a lot like my car.
Too bad I'll be driving it until I can save enough to buy a new car myself.
Headline on the CNN website this morning... ENJOY!
...........................
that is NOT me
Maybe not, but it COULD be...and that is the point we have been trying to force into your head throughout this thread!
That was so...useless. Once again an idiot takes the lifes of 7 others, I hope he get a very hard punishment for his actions.
Would be nice if he never was allowed to drive a car again, NEVER.
Would be nice if he never was allowed to drive a car again, NEVER.
while youre absolutely right keep in mind that those 7 were stupid enough to spectate a street race
True, but still the biggest idiot is the one that missjudge his own driving skills, but I guess he belived he would have the biggest cock of them all if the tok a real show for them -.-
It`s sad and pathetic.
The driver wasn't racing and wasn't involved in the street race. Apparently, tyre smoke from the street racers obscured visibility which meant that the driver couldn't see the crowd which had spilled out onto the highway to watch the race. Now, you can certainly argue that the driver should have slowed down when they saw the tyre smoke and that if they had been traveling more slowly they would have been able to react in time to avoid plowing into the crowd. However, based on what appears to have happened, my view is that the driver isn't really culpable and that those who died were killed more by their own stupidity than by the driver's recklessness.
All I know, is if I ever spectate a race like that, I'll do it from the safety of my spectator stand 7 feet in the air with breakaway legs and a soft, padded bottom.
You got a point there, but still, it got to be one hell of a stupid driver that doesn`t care if he can`t see the road, but still drives. At least he should lose his lisence for like..forever, IMO. It`s about beeing carefull, and responsible.
Neighter one of those were that, the spectators should never been on that place they were, but the driver should clearly know that you never drives, or at least not fast, on a road you can`t see propper.
In this case the accident was due to people standing in the road, which is rather retarded by the sounds of it the driver of the car was more likely to be completely unaware of his surroundings and simply drove through them without noticing than street racing.
Sorry? That sounds like a really really retarded safety concept.
That'll cause you to fall and break your neck
And you sound like a really really retarded person if you took that seriously
Unfortunately, government authorities need to set standards based on the lowest common denominator, thanks to liability, discrimination, etc.
IMHO, a learner driver should be trained to determine the maximum safe speed based on road conditions, vehicle, and their own ability, rather than superficially-imposed speed limit signage.
Speed limits ARE good. But very many drivers don't seem to know how to use them. They are limits (ie. maximum safe value), not targets (ie. one does not need to "stick" to the limit - 90% of drivers seem to subscribe to this line of thinking), and definitely not a measuring stick for one's penis length (you know the morons who always try to drive faster). Sometimes one needs to drive slower, or sometimes at the same speed as the signed value, but some people don't get that.
Police, ambulance, and fire appliance drivers are trained to drive to the maximum safe speed, regardless of the signed speed limit. If similar training is given to all learner drivers, we could have theoretically higher posted speed limits, less congestion, better fuel economy (because drivers will be try to be smoother and more observant), and ultimately a more efficient and safe driving environment.
As for street racing, put the perpetrators into a very special kind of community service: attending to dead or injured people in road collisions.
btw, i can, have taken a bunch of friends down to San Francisco during a long weekend...
and btw, i am racing on abandoned roads, that is completely different from street racing as you guys imagine, running through the streets or highway, or anyplace with population, as i said before, i don't live anywhere near a city...
I knew an associate who wrote off her car doing this very thing. She was going faster than she should have on an "abandoned" rural road. Another driver happened to be doing the same thing in the opposite direction. Result was a nasty prang.
I lived out in the country just after leaving home, and like a lot of young men, did some pretty adventurous driving on "abandoned" roads. Unfortunately there were sometimes other people thinking the same thing. Whether by skill or luck (probably the latter), I avoided collisions on two occasions. Lessons well learnt: abandoned places aren't abandoned!
Despite being a handy racer (in sanctioned motorsport), there is no substitute for proper caution.
the difference between a mountain pass racer, and a track racer:
knowing to be prepared on left hand turns...
@openingpost: Since when are there pedestrians on the highway?
Most people allready discourage street racing (it's called common sense, nice for a game or movie, but like most things in a game or movie to risky). There will always be people that will think differently, there are also people that jump over roofs of high buildings without protection, people that are deaf because they compete who can dive the deepest under water (and their ears can't handle the presure).
Most people allready discourage street racing (it's called common sense, nice for a game or movie, but like most things in a game or movie to risky). There will always be people that will think differently, there are also people that jump over roofs of high buildings without protection, people that are deaf because they compete who can dive the deepest under water (and their ears can't handle the presure).
Imho, that would be plain wrong
. When a new driver gets his drivers' license he think he knows all and thinks he is the greates driver. He has balls sized of bowling balls and self esteem of angry bee. In reality, he has basically no experience, all his skills are based on books and very little training and he hasn't yet developed no kind of understanding and experience what might happen. And most importantly he has not developed the skills for driving the car. Understeer, oversteer, braking distances, all this comes from practise and with experience. Making hard decisions, like trying to drive at correct speeds when the environment and weather changes are hard for most experienced drivers as well. Boosting that false sense of skillfulness would just increase the kiddo death toll. Naturally the actual percentage of the doriftos is small but imho I wouldn't give any encouragement that has its chances to end up in disasters.
Yet another flame bait thread. A few comments.
I live in the USA, about 50 miles SE of Los Angeles, and here street racing almost always means drag racing. I don't know how popular street racing is these days in my area. The last I heard of street racing other than news shows was near where my wife used to work, back in the 1980's in a manufacturing district that was virtually deserted at night. The only street racing I ever witnessed occured in the late 1960's. It was a large group, and occasionally at around 2:00 am, they would setup road blocks (the kind with the yellow flashers) at both ends of a somewhat long straight stretch (about 1 mile) of road with no side roads near the LA airport, completely blocking it off from any traffic (either the cops ignored this or it was just dumb luck the guys never got busted). Sometimes they setup a timing tree. The 1/4 mile point was also marked off, and there was 3/4 miles to slow down before hitting the road blocks (the road continued straight for several more miles though). It generally lasted about an hour and occasionally some real drag racers would bring out alcohol dragsters to these events. I doubt underground street racing was ever that organized again.
I've seen a lot of videos of 2 or more drivers doing rolling speed pulls on open sections of freeway, and yet I can't recall any new reports relating accidents to these. It seems the plannned runs rarely result in accidents.
Almost all of the accidents I do see reported are due to impromptu drag or speed runs on streets where the combination of adrenaline and testosterone kick in. For example, a Porsche driver decided to drag race against a motorcyle, and continued increasing speed in an futile effort to catch up, lost control on a turn, and ran into one of the trees that are used in the divider on this road. I personally saw the aftermath from a distance. These are small oak trees, but apparently very strong. The car was split into multiple pieces, I could see pieces of the red 911 scattered (body was already removed by this time), and the windsheild stuck up high in a tree. The motorcyclist was long gone and never caught, but I'm sure he has trouble sleeping over this.
This pales when compared to the 10 or so fatilites that have occurred over the last 24 years at an intersection close to my home. The main issue is that the approach from the south and west are uphill at a slight grade, so somewhat limited visibility, combined with the fact that it's near a senior community, and configuration changes that occurred over the years. Originally the north and south bound left turns lanes were awkwardly placed, making it easy to assume an approaching car was in a left turn lane when it wasn't. This was fixed early on, but accidents continued to happen (probably the visibility issue). Even after the intersection was "fixed", had controlled left turn signals, there were still a couple of accidents, but involving seniors. One was a case where a senior turned left onto the 55mph northbound road, but in the southbound lanes, and the road immediately turns to the west where he had a head on collision with another car.
Personally, I will speed up a bit when oppurtunity presents itself, such as a large section of open freeway (no traffic) appears, or a "rabbit" passes by in open section, meaning that if I let the "rabbit" continue to gain on me, there's little chance of trouble or a ticket (my last ticket was for 65mph towards the end of the Carter mandated 55mph speed limit on previously 70mph roads, back in 1984). Otherwise, I just go with the flow. Morning commuters seem to be the fastest local drivers, speed limit is 65mph here, but most are going around 70mph to 80mph (slow lane to fast lane) on a local freeway in the morning. In the evenings, there's too much traffic (shoppers added in to the mix), so it's pretty slow going.
The highest speeds occur on roads where it's known that the highway patrol most tolerates the speeds. There are isolated sections of interstate 5 between Los Angeles and San Francisco where it's not uncommon to see traffic doing 85 to 90mph. On the other hand, the speeds from Los Angeles south to San Diego, or north east to Las Vegas are slower (more tickets issued).
My last comment for this post is about Nordschleife. Why do they let motorcycles run there? This is basically a pay to play on a complicated race track, 13 mile, 70+ turns, and there are a lot of accidents, and many of the motorcycle accidents are fatal, due to having armco instead of run off areas, even for very experienced riders like Joerund Seim.
I live in the USA, about 50 miles SE of Los Angeles, and here street racing almost always means drag racing. I don't know how popular street racing is these days in my area. The last I heard of street racing other than news shows was near where my wife used to work, back in the 1980's in a manufacturing district that was virtually deserted at night. The only street racing I ever witnessed occured in the late 1960's. It was a large group, and occasionally at around 2:00 am, they would setup road blocks (the kind with the yellow flashers) at both ends of a somewhat long straight stretch (about 1 mile) of road with no side roads near the LA airport, completely blocking it off from any traffic (either the cops ignored this or it was just dumb luck the guys never got busted). Sometimes they setup a timing tree. The 1/4 mile point was also marked off, and there was 3/4 miles to slow down before hitting the road blocks (the road continued straight for several more miles though). It generally lasted about an hour and occasionally some real drag racers would bring out alcohol dragsters to these events. I doubt underground street racing was ever that organized again.
I've seen a lot of videos of 2 or more drivers doing rolling speed pulls on open sections of freeway, and yet I can't recall any new reports relating accidents to these. It seems the plannned runs rarely result in accidents.
Almost all of the accidents I do see reported are due to impromptu drag or speed runs on streets where the combination of adrenaline and testosterone kick in. For example, a Porsche driver decided to drag race against a motorcyle, and continued increasing speed in an futile effort to catch up, lost control on a turn, and ran into one of the trees that are used in the divider on this road. I personally saw the aftermath from a distance. These are small oak trees, but apparently very strong. The car was split into multiple pieces, I could see pieces of the red 911 scattered (body was already removed by this time), and the windsheild stuck up high in a tree. The motorcyclist was long gone and never caught, but I'm sure he has trouble sleeping over this.
This pales when compared to the 10 or so fatilites that have occurred over the last 24 years at an intersection close to my home. The main issue is that the approach from the south and west are uphill at a slight grade, so somewhat limited visibility, combined with the fact that it's near a senior community, and configuration changes that occurred over the years. Originally the north and south bound left turns lanes were awkwardly placed, making it easy to assume an approaching car was in a left turn lane when it wasn't. This was fixed early on, but accidents continued to happen (probably the visibility issue). Even after the intersection was "fixed", had controlled left turn signals, there were still a couple of accidents, but involving seniors. One was a case where a senior turned left onto the 55mph northbound road, but in the southbound lanes, and the road immediately turns to the west where he had a head on collision with another car.
Personally, I will speed up a bit when oppurtunity presents itself, such as a large section of open freeway (no traffic) appears, or a "rabbit" passes by in open section, meaning that if I let the "rabbit" continue to gain on me, there's little chance of trouble or a ticket (my last ticket was for 65mph towards the end of the Carter mandated 55mph speed limit on previously 70mph roads, back in 1984). Otherwise, I just go with the flow. Morning commuters seem to be the fastest local drivers, speed limit is 65mph here, but most are going around 70mph to 80mph (slow lane to fast lane) on a local freeway in the morning. In the evenings, there's too much traffic (shoppers added in to the mix), so it's pretty slow going.
The highest speeds occur on roads where it's known that the highway patrol most tolerates the speeds. There are isolated sections of interstate 5 between Los Angeles and San Francisco where it's not uncommon to see traffic doing 85 to 90mph. On the other hand, the speeds from Los Angeles south to San Diego, or north east to Las Vegas are slower (more tickets issued).
My last comment for this post is about Nordschleife. Why do they let motorcycles run there? This is basically a pay to play on a complicated race track, 13 mile, 70+ turns, and there are a lot of accidents, and many of the motorcycle accidents are fatal, due to having armco instead of run off areas, even for very experienced riders like Joerund Seim.
Because they have not been instilled with proper driving attitudes. This is not an individual problem, but a social problem.
When little kids are sitting in the back seat of their family car with mother/father driving, they learn from their parents what "normal" driving is. If their mother or father get aggressive or angry while driving, this behaviour is transferred to the children. If mother or father is often critical of other drivers, then this attitude of arrogance is picked up by the children. If mother or father frequently run red lights or ignore give-way signs, children pick up on these bad habits too.
If you tell someone that they're bad drivers, you'll usually get a very cold response. People take driving very personally, and an insult to their driving ability is taken more offensively than when compared to, for example, an insult against their knitting or gardening ability. This attitude needs to change.
Skills can be learnt. The driving curriculum is NOT adequate to begin with. This inadequacy is not because defensive driving skills are bad for beginners, but because these skills are currently considered to be exclusive and require some degree of driving talent. What this means is that there will be some people who are allowed to drive now, who would not be able to drive to newer, higher standards.
Because such increase in standards will have a massive public backlash, governments are fearful of introducing them. Most drivers think they're pretty good. Imagine the outcry if a large percentage of drivers lose their license because they're not good enough.
Pilots don't get a solo license without learning to deal with stalls and spins. Boating licenses aren't issued without a safety exam. Why should driving licenses be issued when a candidate has little or no defensive driving and collision avoidance skills?
False sense of skilfulness comes from poor tuition. Simple as that. A lot of advanced or defensive driver training takes place in skid pans and racing circuits. That's just ridiculous. A driver will be driving and applying those skills on public roads with real traffic, not on closed-off roads, airfields, skid pans, and race tracks.
Race track and skid pan training does boost egos, that is true. I feel amused when drivers do a one or two day training course at some skid pan and think they can safely handle oversteer or avoid a collision. Truth is, a one or two day course only brushes the tip of the iceberg, and is easily forgotten after several months of non-use. But some drivers feel they have more skills after taking these courses because these courses teach car control skills that are usually related to rallying or racing drivers, who are especially considered by young drivers to be "cool".
Defensive driver training should be given on real roads, and impart skills that are more related to thought process rather than car control. It doesn't even need to involve intense physical skill.
Concepts like these can greatly improve one's hazard perception and planning ability without boosting of ego:
- Commentary driving
- System of vehicle control (Information, Position, Speed, Gear, Action)
- Limit points (you should only be driving slow enough to stop in the distance you can see to be clear)
Learner drivers benefit from those skills because they augment skills that learners severely lack: hazard perception and forward planning. Careful, guided tuition will help to accelerate a new driver's ability to perceive hazards, anticipate traffic behaviour, and respond to hazards in a safe and predictable way.
What experienced drivers can't do after 30 years of driving on their own can be taught to a new driver within a month using proper training methods.
Wow, that was a long rant.
Street Racing Opinion?
(252 posts, started )
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