To be honest, I didn't even notice that you'd posting the settings! Now I do, I shall have a go with them in the near future. And I'll be honest, and I'll try to like it, and I'll play it for more than 30 seconds to give it a fair chance.

I'll let you know after I've had a go. Who knows, I could be converted by the experience

no you can't haha

Well, no, probably not. But I'll go into it with a relatively open mind. And I try and drive like in reality, rather than adapt to rFactor. If it's realistic and good then I should be able to do that. If I can't then it'll probably fail the test (not including obvious sim racing perks, like excessive engine braking on entry and slightly more aggressive throttle application).

Just for the sake of scientific research, can you also do the same thing for LFS? Or have you already?

I'd personally be interested in realism ratios between your F3 and, for example, the LFS FOX, and the same between your F3 and rFactor's nearest equivalent (I dunno what it is, can't remember).

I have a bit in the past, but I'm so used to LFS that it's hard to be entirely fair. But I know that when I drive in real life I use a lot of stuff the LFS has taught me, and when I drive in LFS (like the other night, which was the first time in months) I never thing "hang on, in real life doing this doesn't cause this".

But so far, when I jump into rFactor, I tend to have a coronary because EVERYTHING is wrong. Hopefully it can be resolved with a decent car mod, a decent track mod, and some decent ini/cfg settings.

I'm hoping to to a similar experience with nKP, but it's so bugged and crap at the moment it's not worth my time. I won't bother loading the steaming pile of crap until (if) it's patched.

Niels Heusinkveld identified some fundamental flaws in rFactor's programming, I think, that really called into question whether or not a realistic feel in rF was even configurably possible. At least that was how I read it. Last I saw, though, RSC was busily trying to hustle Niels out of the back door, and silence or cloak his thread/s on the topic. I dunno the end of that story.. but if it's as I read it, you may be on a hiding to nowhere.

Maybe. But I did pay money for it, so it's only fair to try and get some enjoyment out of that money

Can't argue with that!

I think the caterham mod has the best representation of what the RF engine can do, in a context comparable to what we can find in LFS. It has the most "elastic" feel slightly over limit and you can be pretty confident when the rear slides around, but not in the arcadish fool proof kind of way. Compare to the LX4 it actually feels less pinsharp and have more mass, which is the opposite of most rf mods around.

Which mod is that exactly? I'd bet there is more than one Caterham mod, so I prefer full, unconfusable titles or links to things (the major problem with modding platforms).

Quote from tristancliffe :

...But I did pay money for it, ...

Even it was for free, it suxxors....!

Sean Edwards (a real Porsche 997 racer) who is currently leading comfortably the rfactor PCC2007 championship on F1RST3, has admitted that PCC2007 physics are total crap! In fact he has given feedback for the development of another PCC rfactor mod, the Porsche Carrera Cup France, but I haven't tried it, so I don't know if it resembles reality better (actually I have never driven a 997 in rl).

Perhaps there's no need to get into all the trouble downlloading mods and tweaking settings Tristan, if absolute realism in physics is what you are always seeking for. rFactor just doesn't get well in that area generally.

I just suggested the above combo because I had real fun the other day there, despite the physics flaws. It was a pleasant break from LFS.

But if you do take the time to do some rfcator testings, then physicswise there supposed to be better mods around insetad of PCC2007. Just let me know to have a look for them (Caterham, Niel's C6 and I think Skoda Octavia Cup are amongst them).

Quote from tristancliffe :

Which mod is that exactly? I'd bet there is more than one Caterham mod, so I prefer full, unconfusable titles or links to things (the major problem with modding platforms).

AFAIK there's only one Caterham mod and so far to my experience it's the only mod worth fooling around with since the Corvette, although predictable in handling, is a pig of a car.

However it's also covered in the crunchy/messy forcefeedback implementation that rF has (even if you try to save it with realfeel).

Quote from JJ72 :

I think the caterham mod has the best representation of what the RF engine can do, in a context comparable to what we can find in LFS. It has the most "elastic" feel slightly over limit and you can be pretty confident when the rear slides around, but not in the arcadish fool proof kind of way. Compare to the LX4 it actually feels less pinsharp and have more mass, which is the opposite of most rf mods around.

It could be that this mod was the point of reference in the development of the Real Feel Plugin

Quote from migf1 :

It could be that this mod was the point of reference in the development of the Real Feel Plugin

Remember that all the RealFeel plugin does is take the SteeringArmForce calculated by the physics engine and transposes it to the FFB system.

The reason for using the Caterham mod to develop the plugin was that at the time the Powertec and Hayabusa Caterhams were the only cars available for rFactor that had been developed using carFactory and hence had suspension with no glaring flaws.

In the current release of the Caterham mod it's still only the Powertec and Hayabusa that have carFactory suspension and tyres with any pneumatic trail. For the upcoming release they've all had the carFactory treatment though

Quote from TechAde :

Remember that all the RealFeel plugin does is take the SteeringArmForce calculated by the physics engine and transposes it to the FFB system.

The reason for using the Caterham mod to develop the plugin was that at the time the Powertec and Hayabusa Caterhams were the only cars available for rFactor that had been developed using carFactory and hence had suspension with no glaring flaws.

In the current release of the Caterham mod it's still only the Powertec and Hayabusa that have carFactory suspension and tyres with any pneumatic trail. For the upcoming release they've all had the carFactory treatment though

It feels a bit strange that you say that because when you drive the Powertec/Hayabusa in rf they feel the worst of the bunch and sometimes really awful while the R500 feels more like an agile and light car but not ball breaking stingy. It still doesn't have much of the agile, low power-to-weight ratio feeling and the icy spins are still there. Tbh. especially the powertec, even if it has way too much power, drives really awfully. Not saying that it is the fault of carFactory but I can't see any evidence that car factory has had any positive effect on those cars

Most of the mods in rf feels like either tires or suspension is made ok but then the other is made really badly. Like with the PCC porsches, the tires are imho not too bad (aside from really strange braking), on very flat track it feels ok but even the tiniest bump just causes insta-understeer and the suspension feels like it just ...vanished or something. Another good example of this is imho the new Ferrari 288GTO. Basically the tires feel ok but the suspension is really awful. Without looking at the data (and understading what it actually means) the car just feel so strange that it is beyind this world. Under braking and acceleration it swings like a grandma on nukular wheelchair but when you get some air under the car on the humps and bumps on the 'ring the car has absolutely 0 suspension deflection when it comes down.

I am very suspicious whether carFactory will have (any) major impact on how much better the mods may become. So far the results have been not very couraging and people still believe that harder is always more realistic. If carFactory has started some kind of change in rf, I wouldn't know but it seems the progress is basically non-existent. Iirc carFactory does not do tires which is really the biggest issue with all rf mods and the part where the mods would need lots of improvements

Quote from Hyperactive :

Most of the mods in rf feels like either tires or suspension is made ok but then the other is made really badly.

...

Another good example of this is imho the new Ferrari 288GTO. Basically the tires feel ok but the suspension is really awful.

Try locking up the brakes in a straight, flat line in the 288gto stradale and maybe you can give it the double prize. I tried several 100km/h stand-on-the-brake-pedal braking attempts and any modern ABS system would be envious of the results - (of course I checked and triplechecked I had no driving aids enabled).

The only "good" part I found was that the steering didn't go dead when understeering and that it had one of the least notchy/damaged-steering-rack feelings to it.

But generally I agree - the "stradale" version of it is like a high school lab experiment concerning springs.