Hello.
I'm pretty much a newbie when it comes to setups and been wingin' my way into my race setups so far...

But I'm having some problems with certain combos.
FO8 at Kyoto GP Long for instance.
Those "sleeping policemen" barriers.

I would like to know what, barring simply just not going over them, could I do setup-wise to lessen my the damage taken when I ride on them?
Maybe another "obstacle" would be attacking the high curbs on the Fern enviroment too.

I'm most interested on general advice on this issue but if you want to make it more specific, the car used is the FO8.

I'm inclined to work on race setups (thus, starting off heavy and with tyres with less grip and so on, if that's important anyhow). So I'm looking forward for the suspension to last 90min or so.

I've got no idea at all of what to do.
If there's any help on lowering the car or making it taller.
If I have to soften or harden the rollbars (or what else), if the tyres would be better with more or less pressure, and so on.

Any advice will be highly appreciated.
Thanks!

Don't go over them. Seriously, if LFS had realistic suspension damage they'd ruin your suspension instantly when going over them at race speeds.

Ok..
I forgot to comment that "And, yeah if I HAVE to avoid them (like I avoided the sleeping policemen at kyoto gp long with the FO8), I will".
But what I want in this thread is KNOWLEDGE about WHAT can be done (if anything) to the suspension to make it stronger/less prone to break.

It's not only on those "controversial obstacles" that maybe my suspension setup might be lacking a certaing strenght.
There are plenty of "regular" curbs and whatnot that when on full load with a FO8 sometimes damages your car.

While other people go over those and don't damage their cars so.. probably there's some knowledge about what can be done to suspensions to make them stronger?

That's what I want to know.
I'm not asking for a magical advice for me to abuse my suspension and get away with it, I just want to know how to make it stronger to cope better with a mistake or two during a 90min race or maybe just be a little more agressive.

Hope that's not frowned upon over here.

Most damage is taken when the suspension bottoms out. So anything that reduces the chance of this happening will likely reduce damage. So that's longer springs, stiffer springs, harder bump damping or reduced wing angles.

Quote from Bob Smith :

Most damage is taken when the suspension bottoms out. So anything that reduces the chance of this happening will likely reduce damage. So that's longer springs, stiffer springs, harder bump damping or reduced wing angles.

Understood.
Please "clarify":

Longer springs = Higher motion range (on ride height - a "taller" car)
Stiffer springs = Stiffer roll bars (those are the first bars after the ride height bars, right?)
Harder bump damping = Stiffer bump damping...

A softer rebound damping would help even more or that's nonsense?

And the reduced wing angles are good on this instance due to not forcing the car so much into the ground, is that it?

Thanks a bunch, Bob
As always, really helpful to me.

Longer springs (with the same rate) will increase ride height.
Stiffer springs (of the same length) will increase initial body movement for a given wheel deflection. This isn't roll bars.
More bump damping - makes the car body move earlier, rather than the bump just compressing the spring.

Less bump damping would allow the suspension to bottom out, causing more damage.
But most, if not all, will adversely effect the rest of the car.

There are no humps that need to be used in LFS. It will not increase lap times by going round them.

Quote from Meanie :

Longer springs = Higher motion range (on ride height - a "taller" car)

Correct.

Quote from Meanie :

Stiffer springs = Stiffer roll bars (those are the first bars after the ride height bars, right?)

You are correct that these are the bars immediately below the ride height adjustment, but they are certainly not called roll bars.

Quote from Meanie :

Harder bump damping = Stiffer bump damping...

Yes...

Quote from Meanie :

A softer rebound damping would help even more or that's nonsense?

Nonsense.

Quote from Meanie :

And the reduced wing angles are good on this instance due to not forcing the car so much into the ground, is that it?

Correct. The downforce loads the suspension and thus reduces the amount of spare travel at speed. Although it is not likely you would want to change wing angles purely to avoid this kind of damage, as it will affect your performance all the way around the track in quite a large fashion.

As Tristan alludes to, any of these adjustments are likely to make your car handle worse if not properly considered.

Quote from tristancliffe :

There are no humps that need to be used in LFS. It will not increase lap times by going round them.

Thanks for the help.
I understood the "gist" of it.

I've yet to practice there but I"ll be racing on Fern Bay Gold with the FO8 and that chicane after the T1 seems to me to be taken quite agressively in order to come out fast there.

On a full fuel load it's bound to damage the suspension and if you do avoid it it will *surely* increase lap times.

But yeah, it's all a question of balance.
It's no good to run fast and wreck your car.
To finish first, first you have to finish and all that.

But, even being a crap driver, on a FO8 for instance, with a heavy fuel load there are some "curbs" and whatnot that you have to take if you want to be fast that damage your car, yes sir.

I'll just try to "reinforce" my suspension while still avoiding those "obstacles". Any tiny help is most welcome.

Quote from Bob Smith :

...

Thanks again.

Yeah, I won't be severely altering a, hopefully, good setup just for the sake of "suspension strenght".
I just wanted to know what settings I could change that would actually make a difference on that matter in case I wanted to spend some time tinkering with that.

As you all know it's above all a matter of "balance" to have a good set and winning a long race. To be able to take the most damage (when it's "needed" to be faster) and still finish the race.

I just didn't knew squat about it and know I know some.
So thanks.


ps: do we call it simply "springs" then?
ok

Quote from tristancliffe :

There are no humps that need to be used in LFS. It will not increase lap times by going round them.

You clearly didn't look at the KY GP Long hotlaps then...

Some tracks, like Aston Historic Rev may damage springs even when you stay away from curbs, just bumpy road, and most of such bumps are invisible.

And I've checked replay in Replay Analizer. It sais minimum suspension travel remaining is 14mm for front and 8 for rear. The car (BF1 in my case) never bottoms out but still gets damaged.

ok here's another question i'll tack onto this thread, for rally setups, i use max ride height, reasonably soft springs (race wise anyway) and average bump and rebound settings but i still get damage going over fairly soft jumps atc usually when landing, surely rally suspension would be tougher than that? (it would break eventually, but not so quickly)

1) Make sure the springs are strong enough to prevent bottoming out on landing.

2) Don't set the dampers too strong - if they have to absorb all the force, they'll get damaged. Likewise, don't set them too weak, to make sure the spring doesn't have to catch the whole load either. It's fine if the dampers help against bottoming out a bit.

the less the damper's strength, the less they break. I can get near indestructable setups by using low/wmedium springs with as little damping as possible.

Quote from senn :

ok here's another question i'll tack onto this thread, for rally setups, i use max ride height, reasonably soft springs (race wise anyway) and average bump and rebound settings but i still get damage going over fairly soft jumps atc usually when landing, surely rally suspension would be tougher than that? (it would break eventually, but not so quickly)

How many laps are you talking about and what car/stage are you running? Also what Anti-Roll setups are you running? I run RallyX setups quite often and have run 100 lap runs even at FE RallyX (the shorter one) with the demanding run and harder drive.... I can send the set if you're interested but it will later today or when I get back from work tomorrow...

When you land after a jump, you put a considerable extra inertial load through the suspension, so to stop it from bottoming you'll need stiffer springs than you think. Damping is a problem too - too much and you won't use all the suspension travel and your wheels will be overdamped (obviously), too little and the car fill float around and bottom out more easily.

In very basic terms.

Check this out...
http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?t=42584