Hi!

I had an 60 lap race sunday, with the FOX. For about half of the distance everything went good, but then my engine power started to decreese. At the end i felt that i lost 30% of the total power of the car.

I never experienced anything like that before. I knew that overheating the clutch can cause this problem, but my clutch was ice cold during the race.

Then somebody told me that i probably downshifted to early, and that was the cause of the problem.

Anyway, i don't want to make this mistake again and want to be sure about the cause of the problem.

Wouldn't be better if the damage screen would contain all kind of damage? Now i see only suspension damage there.

If it was a long race it is more likely your tyres went off (cooled down or overheated) that caused a big drop in your lap times. Your mind can play tricks on you in a long race causing you to think one thing is wrong when it's another thing entirely.
Adding to that tyres can go off at one end more than the other changing the cars handling attributes significantly, resulting in much slower lap times. I had this very thing happen to me a couple of months ago, I made a set that was well balanced and quick for about the first half of the race but for the last 30 laps it was ratshit. Mid way I was running third, by the end I had dropped several places and my lap times had slipped dramatically. Initially I blamed engine damage also, but on further examination of replays etc I realised the cars balance had changed due to the front and rear tyre temps profile becoming substantialy different to the first half of the race.

Did you save a replay of the race?

Funny how engine damage isn't displayed in a real car either, yet people manage.

-1 for more silly arcade displays.

Quote from tristancliffe :

Funny how engine damage isn't displayed in a real car either, yet people manage.

-1 for more silly arcade displays.

That's true but it would be cool if you could see it after the race. Normaly your pitcrew/engineers could tell you after the race that the car doesn't like your drivingstyle.

+1 but how they will display that damage?

Quote from mxpxun :

+1 but how they will display that damage?

Well, that can be really tricky. As tricky as clutch heat and suspension damage.

Oh, wait...

Quote from Gekkibi :

Well, that can be really tricky. As tricky as clutch heat and suspension damage.

Oh, wait...

maybe engine damage shown in line is good......... but clutch heat should be shown not only in little red line, but also it should show temperature in Celsius

I say no engine damage display and get rid of clutch heat, supsension damage and tire displays whilst your at it (I know that one or two GT cars have had tire temperature sensors but the vast majority do not).

The BF1 probably has tyre temperature sensors, too.

But only show the surface temp (i.e. the ctrl-shift temp) if it's kept in the appropriate cars. None of this core temperature stuff that can't be got in motion (easily).

But by all means show core tyre temps in the pits, along with other realistic stuff. Engine damage might just have to be percentages, perhaps divided up into catagories depending on how advanced the engine model is when damage is properly implemented.

Not that Scawen reads this

I'm all for not displaying all this info..... because of league racing. The problem is, not everyone uses LFS strictly for league racing. Many people just like to jump on public servers and have a spin for an hour or two in the evenings. Others only have time for an hour or two. Thus, folks don't want to spend all their time running laps, going to pits, checking tire temps, adjusting, running more laps...... oops, it's time for bed, we'll do it all over again tomorrow when the server is on a different combo, or the racers are on a different combo.

There's no reason to have damage on display. If you can't control your car the same way after hitting the wall as before, obviously there is damage. But removing tire temp completely would be detrimental to the public racers as they may not want to wait to pit just to check their setup in tire temps.

Server option as removing would really benefit league racing only. It forces people to practice and work on setup as you would IRL. Not everything is about making it exactly as real life though. Some race LFS on public servers for just a bit of fun and don't want to bother that extensively with car setup. Viewing tire temps as you drive is helpful when trying to set up the car before the next public race restarts.

Quote from duke_toaster :

The BF1 probably has tyre temperature sensors, too.

Any evidence of this? I'd have thought in a single seater the aerodynamic penalty of having sensors mounted in the air flow would stop anybody attempting it.

Quote from ajp71 :

Any evidence of this? I'd have thought in a single seater the aerodynamic penalty of having sensors mounted in the air flow would stop anybody attempting it.

They frequently have sensors mounted in the trailing edges of wing end plate vanes, or the rear wheel bodywork flip ups.

I can try and find a few pictures if you like - some are on this forum not so long ago, or you can take my word for it

These temperature probes uses laser-technology (As far as I know they use these on "professional" racing). They aren't so expensive, after all. Then again, if you don't design and build one, it is whole another issue...

Quote from mxpxun :

+1 but how they will display that damage?

Probably the same way they currently give an "arcade display" of clutch temp; tyre temps; tyre loads and suspension damage maybe???

I'm all for having this kind of info, but personally I think it should be restricted to pit stops. Apart from high end, (eg F1), motorsports the driver never has this info to hand whilst on track. Maybe a whole new display whilst pitting giving this info?

Quote from ajp71 :

Any evidence of this? I'd have thought in a single seater the aerodynamic penalty of having sensors mounted in the air flow would stop anybody attempting it.

F1 cars have well over 100 sensors and actuators which monitor and control many parts of the car, just for an example... here's a site http://www.activesensors.com/i ... oducts/motorsportsensors/

Many can even be controled on the fly...


but I don't think everything should be shown on all cars, keeping it real is best... eg. no sensors on road cars

+1 from me, because i often have this problem in league racing. Even i tried to take care of it but it happend.

I even wonder if it is a bug, which happen for some people, because some have absolutely nothing to do with it

and it is definately not the tyres in my case.

I'm not sure how temperature, something that can actually be quantified, can be compared to something so arbitrary as damage.

Quote from tristancliffe :

Funny how engine damage isn't displayed in a real car either, yet people manage.

-1 for more silly arcade displays.

What's an engine warning light for then?

does have to be on an overlay display it could be a simple warning light on the dash
(cause everyone should drive cockpit view)


engine warning light usually shows sensor or emission faults

Oil pressure, maybe?

Quote from Gekkibi :

These temperature probes uses laser-technology (As far as I know they use these on "professional" racing). They aren't so expensive, after all. Then again, if you don't design and build one, it is whole another issue...

They may not be expensive but they'd still require a big pole attached to the upright to mount the lasers on that would get in the way aerodynamically and be very noticeable.

Quote from Xalies :

F1 cars have well over 100 sensors and actuators which monitor and control many parts of the car, just for an example... here's a site http://www.activesensors.com/i ... oducts/motorsportsensors/

Average road cars have a lot of sensors as well but most of them measure nothing terribly interesting that is processed by onboard computers and of no interest to drivers or engineers when everything is running correctly. I see no mention of tire temperature sensors on that site, let alone any suggestion they're being used in F1.

Quote from Turbo Dad :

What's an engine warning light for then?

In racing cars the single large warning light is normally for low oil pressure, which is far more serious than the damage we're getting in LFS atm.

-1 but then I would like all other temp and related displays DISABLED while in a race. If the car does not have the display on the dash you should not see it.

You CAN hear if you have engine damage BTW.

Quote from Forbin :

I'm not sure how temperature, something that can actually be quantified, can be compared to something so arbitrary as damage.

Good point. But some things just aren't known whilst driving along, quatifiable or not.