Quote from Dajmin :

the moon - it controls the tides and therefor the winds.

Actually, the Sun "controls" the winds. Local heating, from solar radiation (affected, also, by the type of terrain and its absorbing/reflecting properties), produces regions of hotter and cooler air, and consequently lower and higher pressures (due to the thermal expansion and compression of the air), and air then moves from regions of higher pressure, to regions of lower pressure. Such air movement is wind.

Tides are a result of different magnitudes of external gravitational forces, acting upon different parts of Earth, as Earth rotates and thus changes the position of its parts, wrt external gravitational fields - especially, that of the Moon, although the the Sun's gravitational field also has an influence, affecting the comparative heights of tides, during different times of a year.

I'd like to believe that there is some sort of 'higher power' or something like that, but I'm not willing to dedicate my life to worship or church every week, nor change my lifestyle to suit religions.

Though I really don't understand why so many people bash other religions, let people believe what they want. =)

Quote from jayhawk :

God loves you unconditionally, whether you know it or not, want it or not.

No he doesn't. He doesn't love you either, because he's not real. You're hurtling through space on a huge rock with just us other random collections of organs for company, with nothing better to do than sit around getting fat until you die.

Quote from jayhawk :

The next time religion makes you angry, think of the elderly woman sitting in a pew, or kneeling in a temple or mosque, praying for her sick husband to be better.

That's false hope, though. What's the point?

Quote from jayhawk :

Think of how every Sunday a whole family, as a family, goes to church together. Think of the joy it brings to people who need it.

You have to wonder why they need to find joy in fairy tales. If reality sucks so much then why would they seek pleasure in praising an imaginary being who made reality suck that much?

Whichever way you slice it, religious people come out looking pretty irrational.

Not once did I attack your choices in life with derogatory terms, did I? No.

So why jump on me? Does it make you feel better? If so, fine. Good luck in your future, may you live to be old and wizened.




Nice try for attempting to get a flustered reaction out of me, though. Proved my point.

Quote from jayhawk :

And as I stated, you look like a petulant child. Not once did I attack your choices in life, did I.

Nor did I attack yours. You did state that god was a factual entity though, which I disagree with, so I stated that it isn't, it's a fairy story.

As others have pointed out, on balance, religion does more harm than good. And it's really no longer relevant - we live in considerably more enlightened times now, we know that the stars aren't supreme beings, we know that miracles don't happen, and we know how many animals you can realistically accommodate on a ship of given dimensions for forty days and nights.

You'll be telling me I should respect the beliefs of Mormons next.

Quote from jayhawk :

So why jump on me? Does it make you feel better?

We're arguing the relevance of religion. You picked the corner opposite me. What do you want me to do?

Quote from WizardHat :

Though I really don't understand why so many people bash other religions, let people believe what they want. =)

That in itself is usually fine for most. But the stereotype of a religious fanatic is that they cannot accept others who believe something different than their faith. I believe I dont need to explain more (BTW watch the documentary "Jesus Camp")

Religion pisses me off.
It's caused nothing but suffering, harm, and hatred between people.

Not to mention the whole "God hates fags" thing.

Quote from thisnameistaken :

we live in considerably more enlightened times now

I see you are quite a bit more optimistic than I am.

Percentage-wise I think ignorance levels have not changed, stupidity certainly not; you still see masses of people doing the same things over and over through-out documented history. It's just that, in our modern society, you get more people, since what people proved to be better at than any other animal was copulation (shepherds of the world might contradict this), and you can hide in a horde of like-minded zombies of your preference ready to howl "brains" to anyone you think doesn't have one - which really don't amuse any of the other zombies and they just howl "brains" back at you because you obviously don't have one either.

Quote from Klutch :

Not to mention the whole "God hates fags" thing.

What's amusing in a grammar school sort of way is that British restaurants could get away with having that on signs in the no smoking sections.

Quote :

The next time religion makes you angry, think of the elderly woman sitting in a pew, or kneeling in a temple or mosque, praying for her sick husband to be better.

I've always been curious about this, I meen never has anyone ever been miraculously healed from an amputation, so why do we believe it was Gods work when somebody recovers from cancer? I would dearly love to hear a religious rationale for this because I dont understand it and i'm interested to hear the reasoning behind it.

Quote :

Not to mention the whole "God hates fags" thing.

As I mentioned in another thread recently about how the current Church does not represent the word of the bible even remotely, Timothy 1:10 is a mistranslation, a very recent mistranslation too, appearing as it did in bibles produced in 1958 and onwards, and Liviticus is a holiness code for Priests to follow. Nowhere else does the bible have anything to say about homosexuality. It's ok to be gay, it's not ok for a girl to have sex before marriage though - those girls must be stoned to death on the day of their wedding.

Bible is the most sold fantasy book. Some chap made it couple thousands of years ago and people liked it so much they started to believe in it.

I mean come on? How many jesus lovers can you even take seriously? Especially the ones who try to convert you...

I quit believing in god when I gained some age to even understand that thing. As soon as I started to understand it I stopped believing on that doodoo, I`m a realist now, if you call them that? I don`t believe in anything untill I see it myself.



AND BTW, if everything happens on god`s will, how come we don`t let all the rapists, mass murderers and child users go, just because "It`s god`s will for that to happen, he wanted that"

Quote from jayhawk :

God loves you unconditionally, whether you know it or not, want it or not.

That love would have been a lot more convincing if it had prevented my wife from having a miserable childhood. Or if it had given Anne Frank a non-posthumous literary career.

Quote :

The reason why is because he sacrificed his only son to forgive the sins of the world.

Only son? Big deal. He could have had many more sons if He had wanted to. Millions. Or even some daughters. Besides, unlike human parents He got His son back, in full health.

Better still, He could have spared Jesus some suffering by simply saying "OK folks, sins are forgiven." Instead, the son had to die a painful death. What kind of dad is that?

Quote :

so give Jesus a break, huh?

Sure. His Dad didn't.

Quote from Qvarnis :

Bible is the most sold fantasy book. Some chap made it couple thousands of years ago and people liked it so much they started to believe in it.

correction - it was written by a whole load of people spanning a good few hundred years, which is why the whole thing is so ****ed up, especially revelations

In the feeding of the five thousand, I don't think a miracle occured. I think Jesus was just REALLY mean with the size of the portions...

"Speck of bread for you, and a fish scale... NEXT! Speck of bread for you, and a fish scale..."

Quote from Becky Rose :

Nowhere else does the bible have anything to say about homosexuality. It's ok to be gay, it's not ok for a girl to have sex before marriage though - those girls must be stoned to death on the day of their wedding.

Sodom and Gomorrah?


Quote from wikipedia:

Quote :

There are two prevailing views of the sin of Sodom in Christian thought. One is that the destruction of Sodom was due to inhospitality, as illustrated by the gifts of God to Abraham for his gracious action, contrasted with consequences of the behavior of the city's inhabitants. First we see hospitality and the way we should act, then inhospitality in that the people of Sodom seek to mistreat the newcomers. The second view is that the cities were destroyed for homosexuality.

Quote :

Sodom and Gomorrah?

For my argument i'd use your quote, lots of evidence for the other conclussion isnt there... Not so much evidence for homosexuality incurring them the wrath of God, what we do have though is modern opinion on the conclusions to be drawn.

I'm not overly familiar with this tale in the bible, it's been too many years since I was lashed to a desk to read the bible, but I dont recall this tale being about homosexuality and I font the conclusion drawn in that wiki posters argument a little odd from my recollection of it. Am I wrong? I dont know, and i'm not about to buy a bible to refresh myself unless I start losing this argument ! lol. Really, what specific evidence is there regarding homosexuality in this tale?

Quote from Becky Rose :

For my argument i'd use your quote, lots of evidence for the other conclussion isnt there... Not so much evidence for homosexuality incurring them the wrath of God, what we do have though is modern opinion on the conclusions to be drawn.

It's a hard question indeed. As Bible is a book of interpretation and there is no a concrete reference to homosexuality it's all on how you want to read it

Here you have the main article in the Wiki discussing Cristianism and homosexuality. Some references are listed here:

Quote :

A number of passages from both the Old and New Testament of the Bible are commonly used in the debate over homosexuality including Genesis 19:4-29, Leviticus 18 and 21, Romans 1:18-32, 1 Timothy 1:10, 1 Corinthians 6:9-10 and Jude 1:7. The arguments over these passages have centered on the extent to which these passages are still relevant. In addition, recent scholarship has produced interpretations of Biblical passages which, according to these scholars, reveals that the Bible never advocates a blanket criticism of same-sex relationships

Whatever... the official position of the Vatican and the catholic community is clearly against homosexuality, advising them to practice chastity to avoid the eternal fire

In fact the official position of Islam about homosexuality is the same (probably more agressive) and (as you may know) they get that conclussions from the same book.

Quote from RocksGt :

and (as you may know) they get that conclussions from the same book.

'One faction thought the doughnut diner hats should be red, the other thought they should be blue'

Quote :

Whatever... the official position of the Vatican and the catholic community is clearly against homosexuality, advising them to practice chastity to avoid the eternal fire

In fact the official position of Islam about homosexuality is the same (probably more agressive) and (as you may know) they get that conclussions from the same book.

I dont really care about what organised religion says on anything because their views carry the weight of the prejudices and convictions of Bishops, not the word of the God they supposedly represent.

Then again the Bible itself is the views and opinions of a few disciples and not in itself the word of God. The only word of God in the bible is some stone tablets, the rest of the book is the interpretation of those tablets by uneducated close minded neanderthols from 20 centuries ago, but only the views that conform to the opinions of various powerful clergy along the way - for the rest you have to read the apocrapher, do that and you soon start wondering just how much of the gospel, is actually gospel.

Quote from Crashgate3 :

'One faction thought the doughnut diner hats should be red, the other thought they should be blue'

Lister: Do you mean they had a war over whether the doughnut diner hats
were red or blue?
Holly: Yeah. Most of them were killed fighting about that. It's daft
really, innit?
Lister: You're not kidding. They were supposed to be green.

Quote from dougie-lampkin :

Fair play to the Hindus, they have themselves covered no matter what religion God turns out to be

Um, don't you mean Buddhists Rob?

Quote from Becky Rose :

I've always been curious about this, I meen never has anyone ever been miraculously healed from an amputation, so why do we believe it was Gods work when somebody recovers from cancer? I would dearly love to hear a religious rationale for this because I dont understand it and i'm interested to hear the reasoning behind it.

Lourds?

Quote from J@tko :

Lourds?

Beg your pardon?

Quote from Becky Rose :

Beg your pardon?

(I spelt it wrong )

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lourdes#Sanctuary_of_Lourdes

Quote from J@tko :

(I spelt it wrong )

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lourdes#Sanctuary_of_Lourdes

Nowhere on that article do I see any reference, substantiated or otherwise, that an amputee has been healed. Although apparently some other diseases where. Why can't God cure amputation if he can cure cancer? He did afterall make a whole woman out of a single rib right? According to one popular theory based upon a litarary mis-conception anyway .

I am willing to be proven wrong, i'd like to be, it would help me understand all those people who pray for cures.

Quote from Becky Rose :

Nowhere on that article do I see any reference, substantiated or otherwise, that an amputee has been healed. Although apparently some other diseases where. Why can't God cure amputation if he can cure cancer? He did afterall make a whole woman out of a single rib right? According to one popular theory based upon a litarary mis-conception anyway .

I am willing to be proven wrong, i'd like to be, it would help me understand all those people who pray for cures.

EDIT (2) Ignore me.
EDIT: Some still say its evidence for god. Others wouldnt (God that sounds like a GCSE Divs answer )