Yes, it's eyecandy and I want fading brakes and stuff first too... but:

What about different looks for exactly the same car? I don't think it would be such a big deal as the 3d-models aren't this extremely complex anyway (which is perfectly ok, though).

Let's take the XRG as an example. At the moment it looks like a Starion - but you could have maybe one or two alternative bodies like a late 70's BMW 3 series or a Ford Capri.

Or something Lancia Delta'ish for the RTB?

I think the races would definitely look a bit more interesting.

(Talking about looks: why were the rims changed in the last patch. Does anyone prefer them over the old ones?)

you forgot one little thing:

aerodynamics, when this will be generated by it's 3d model the cars aren't the same any more.

Quote from BlakjeKaas :

you forgot one little thing:

aerodynamics, when this will be generated by it's 3d model the cars aren't the same any more.

ARE the aerodynamics really calculated by the 3d model?

No - atm the aero stuff is just one single number (0.35?) for all road - cars.

A better point is that iirc the "weight" of the body affects the weight of the car...

Quote from Jakg :

No - atm the aero stuff is just one single number (0.35?) for all road - cars.

A better point is that iirc the "weight" of the body affects the weight of the car...

LFS's aerodynamics will be a lot more complicated than just one number you quoted (presumably that's a coefficient of drag), an aerodynamic centre and a resultant force from moving in all 7 degrees of freedom are the bare essentials for each car and if the CoD is the same then frontal area must be modeled to get vaguely correct aerodynamics.

this is another example of what is bad for LFS.

What's the point? They'll still have the same engine under the hood...they will still have the same wheelbase and track, same suspension and same everything else...seems like an awful lot of useless effort to gain nothing but pointless visuals...

If I want to drive a bunch of cars that look different but all handle the same I'll go play Gran Turismo....

-1 After a week half of the field will be Nissan Skylines, regardless of which car they are using.

LFS is not a RC game. :wave2:

Quote from Homeless_Drunk :

What's the point? They'll still have the same engine under the hood...they will still have the same wheelbase and track, same suspension and same everything else...seems like an awful lot of useless effort to gain nothing but pointless visuals...

If I want to drive a bunch of cars that look different but all handle the same I'll go play Gran Turismo....

So in your opinion we should forget about the skinning too, right? I mean - in the end there's no point but visuals... and they cost bandwith and CPU power. Why do we have buildings and trees surrounding the tracks? CPU power could be spent on more important things like airstream effect on tyre profile...

Did you ever think about the fact that LFS's output actually ONLY HAS three dimensions, namely VISUALS (probably about 98% of the experience), audio and some force on your wheel?

It'd be just an easy way of having a more heterogenous field without having to really add cars. Of course I'm not against adding another bunch of cars to every class.


... but oh yeah, let's rather have the devs add "realistic" features. just like our beloved clutch-temperature gimmick. this was sssssooooo great and took the realism to a completely new level. this made LFS clutches more realistic than real ones.

Quote from Bandit77 :

So in your opinion we should forget about the skinning too, right? I mean - in the end there's no point but visuals... and they cost bandwith and CPU power. Why do we have buildings and trees surrounding the tracks? CPU power could be spent on more important things like airstream effect on tyre profile...

Did you ever think about the fact that LFS's output actually ONLY HAS three dimensions, namely VISUALS (probably about 98% of the experience), audio and some force on your wheel?

It'd be just an easy way of having a more heterogenous field without having to really add cars. Of course I'm not against adding another bunch of cars to every class.


... but oh yeah, let's rather have the devs add "realistic" features. just like our beloved clutch-temperature gimmick. this was sssssooooo great and took the realism to a completely new level. this made LFS clutches more realistic than real ones.

I'm glad you decided to read way to far into my post...did you do that just for the sake of argument?

What's the name of this thread?

Quote :

Different bodies for the same car

What are we talking about?

Quote :

Different bodies for the same car

Did I ever mention skins? no

I simply said that different bodies on the existing cars to make it seem like there are more cars would be pointless...

Skins can serve a point...they can help you distinguish driver, team and whatever else...what would the point of having different bodies be other than just to make LFS seem like it has more cars than it really does?

Your last comment was just completely off topic and had nothing to do with anything that was said within this thread...but if you can't understand why quite a few people want a more realistic "RACING SIMULATION" then maybe you are playing the wrong game?

naaa, I didn't read that far into your post. it's a question about where to put the limit between "necessary visual gimmicks" and "pure eyecandy".

I mentioned skins because their point is questionable too. For distinction we have the "N" key. Usually the skins only give you a rough clue anyway. Different bodies would even be of help in these situations.

Nevertheless I love the skinning feature, because for me it adds something enjoyable to the game.

The point of different bodies would be - as mentioned - another feature to customize your car, simply because some people like to do so or would rather drive something that resembles a Lancia Delta than a Toyota Celica. No big point, I admit. Just something that adds a bit of joy - and isn't hard to do, most of all.
And as race cars of the same series have fairly similar specs anyway, and tweaking setups change the car's characteristics you wouldn't even feel as if you were driving a VW Polo with a Toyota Yaris Body.


As for my last comment in the last post: ok, it was a bit over the top. But sooner or later we will come to this "realistic, desperately needed features first" argument, and the clutch-feature just made me laugh and cry at the same time. Cry, because it's sooooooo far off, and laugh, because... yeah, we want more realistic features and get something half hearted we'd be better off without.

Believe me, I'm not against realism. You just have to see that you don't make a game experience more realistic only by loading it with "realistic" calculations. It's important how it feels in the end... (X-Plane vs. MS Flightsimulator is a very nice example)

I don't want to elaborate this to I don't know where, but do you know this Simpsons episode where Milhouse becomes Fallout Boy? Where the crew has to paint horses as cows, because cows wouldn't look like cows in a movie? Every joke bears a bit of truth.

Quote from Bandit77 :

And as race cars of the same series have fairly similar specs anyway, and tweaking setups change the car's characteristics you wouldn't even feel as if you were driving a VW Polo with a Toyota Yaris Body.

The XFR and the UFR are the same class, and they feel much different.

Quote from Bandit77 :

... and the clutch-feature just made me laugh and cry at the same time. Cry, because it's sooooooo far off, and laugh, because... yeah, we want more realistic features and get something half hearted we'd be better off without.

i c ya point, and i am with ya, but nevertheless the dev(s) told often enough that fast features that are done for s2 final or s3 that can be implemented fast into current version, should and will be implemented, next to further develop of final stage.

hope u get my point...

I don't get the OP's logic...

He is for realism though he whines when a feature closer to reality is added...

Don't take me wrong, I'm totally for novelty, but I reckon that the core of LFS' experience is how driving feels. And how driving feels (in my mind and I bet in the mind of 96% of the community) is how does your car respond to your inupts and to the inputs made by the bumps, other players, etc.

Realism doesn't only and solely mean photorealism nor feelingorealism. GRID completely outclasses LFS on the graphics field, but I never found a game that simulated that well what I feel when I'm pushing a REAL car in REAL life. Of course, Real life is more beautiful, but if my computer can work on providing me sensation closer to real life rather than graphics closer to real life, then i'll take it. (That's why i really hated GRID).

If you want a feature that will be more realistic and more appealing to the eyes, then I guess providing more sense of speed (I won't suggest how, since it's the devs' job) would be terrific, since the inside view (even if it(s the best for driving) doesn't really gives the impression of going at 100mph when it's the case.

Quote from Zen321 :

I don't get the OP's logic...

He is for realism though he whines when a feature closer to reality is added...

I think you understood "made me laugh and cry" too literally.
The clutch overheating does NOT take LFS closer to reality.

The clutch feature is a good point for a realism-discussion (which actually shouldn't be done in this topic) though.

What is realism, or what kind of realism do you want?

Yes, clutches CAN overheat. But do they in reality? Hardly ever. So having no overheating clutch in the sim is closer to reality than having one that overheats after 6 hillstarts (with a road-like setting).


---

I agree with the rest of your post. I can't even switch to another racing / car sim, as they all feel totally arcade after having played LFS.

+1 for the concept although implementation might prove to be impractical.

Still, IF/WHEN we get realtime generated aerodynamics, this gives problems.

Because then everyone choose the car with the best aerodynamics, and all the others are useless. (you're not racing an XRG to an XRG with better aerodynamics when you know the XRG is slower)

+ you must have the same dimensions etc. etc. etc. etc.

Quote from BlakjeKaas :

+ you must have the same dimensions etc. etc. etc. etc.

... or have the program calculate the aerodynamics based on only one of the different bodies.

I know, I know... realism-for-the-sake-of-realism junkies might have their problems with this, but - as far as I understand - at the moment all the road cars have the same aerodynamics, and no one cares, most probably because it's irrelevant.

As long as two added bodies for an XFG don't look like this:




... it won't be much of a pain to know that their aerodynamics are based on the same old XFG shape.

Quote from Homeless_Drunk :

If I want to drive a bunch of cars that look different but all handle the same I'll go play Gran Turismo....

I think this is an idea which could be easily quenched by having more cars in each class. As for the Granturismo comment, are you sure you can't feel the difference. I can feel difference in handling and performance in every car.

I think we should hope for more cars in each class rather than the same cars in each class with different bodies. As well as the XRG a Celica or maybe a small mid-engined car would be nice too.

Quote from Tomclark21 :

I think we should hope for more cars in each class

Absolutely. Although I think that within one class you will never have a lot of different (meaning really different) cars. That just goes with the meaning of classes.

Quote from Bandit77 :

Absolutely. Although I think that within one class you will never have a lot of different (meaning really different) cars. That just goes with the meaning of classes.

and it's not much harder to implent than the original idea.

Point is, the original idea is pretty hard.

personally, i think a mk1 granada should definately be a contender for a new xrg body, It would add a 1970's ford aspect to the game, something that would be fun! I apologise for my horrific cutting and pasting work, but you get the idea!!

Behold, the XRGranada!!

Quote from danthebangerboy :

I apologise for my horrific cutting and pasting work, but you get the idea!!

Dude! Change the colors to something psychedelic, smooth out the edges, and you have a cool picture. I like it. And I'd definitely love to see such cars in LFS.

Quote from BlakjeKaas :

and it's not much harder to implent than the original idea.

No, it's not hard to implent a new car, I guess... but make one that is equal to the others, so racing them has a point, might be tricky. THAT's why I thought about the cheapo-version of just having different bodies.

Quote :

Point is, the original idea is pretty hard.

I don't see the difficulties, really.

pointless stupid idea that is a WASTE of dev time. Exactly the same car just looking different brings NOTHING to LFS.

In reality the time taken for different models is 95%+ of the work required to create a new car in LFS, just look at tweak. Come on people, THINK about it before you post this sort of IDEA and also........ search. It has come up LOADS of time before with EXACTLY the same responses.