The online racing simulator
#1 - lerts
does forced cockpit view imply other views are faster?
so what is it faster chase view or personalized view? or im wrong here

with personalized view as i can see 4 wheels on the ground i know exactly when each wheel slips but with chase view i see better the line and know better my speed for the altitude of the camera

do you have a recomendation for the fastest view? theres so many options im not sure whats best

i play a lot wwii sims and there cockpit view is a disadvantage but what about racing is it a disadvantage?, here the 2 views i use

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e222/raaaid/view2.jpg

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e222/raaaid/view1.jpg
Personally for me cocpit view is faster, because I can feel the cars position and balance a lot better than with chase view.
#3 - Bean0
FCV first came about when the devs had 'LX Month', with an autocross test using the LX4 or LX6.

I think some people whinged that those using a view other than cockpit had an advantage in that they could see more of the area around the car, making it easier not to accrue penalties.

Back then though, the cockpit view was pretty much fixed, and i for one hated it.
Now though, you can move the view a little, similar to a seat adjustment, and I race using it all the time after getting used to it for a league which used FCV.
#4 - J@tko
I use cockpit view for tin-tops, and custom (on top of the driver) for SS. I find this gives me a better view round, and makes me crash into other people less
#5 - lerts
yeah i think chase view should be the one to be forced there are less crashes that way

a guy was gonna hit me from behind saw it,i stopped braking and avoided collision
Some might be faster, others might not. That is certainly part of forced cockpit view.

Judging from the philosophies expressed (the quest for realism/immersion) by the developers, I think the other motive is that a cockpit view alone is compatible with the idea of being a racing simulator rather than a more arcady game.
Quote from lerts :yeah i think chase view should be the one to be forced there are less crashes that way

a guy was gonna hit me from behind saw it,i stopped braking and avoided collision

I don't think that's particularly true... Mainly because most newcomers to the game are expecting a NFS/arcade style racer and use the external view by default ... and they are the ones wrecking.

Personally, I find it's easier to drive from the cockpit in all cars. There is a slight visibility loss, but if you are paying attention, you know where the cars around you are. What you gain by being inside is a visible g-forces (the way your head moves around), and it's easier to save a spin, because you can see the car coming loose faster (at least for me) when you're in it.

I would think alot of it has to do with age, the younger ones like it outside more (this is just from talking to them in-game...not absolute). I think that if you are of driving age in real life, you are more likely to like the interior view.

And in the end, I like this game better than other games because of the realism... and it's kind of a slap in the face of said realism to drive my car from 10 feet behind it...
#8 - lerts
I go for realism, so it's cockpit all the way.

I'll raise the view a little bit in the single seaters, but thats about it.

Only time i'd use chase view is to check for damage if i've just had a little ding with someone/something.

I wouldn't say a view makes you any faster, it's whatever you're comfortable with.
would you recomend me using cockpit view for being faster?

of course setting g forces moving the head, isnt it?
Chase view can help noobs and bad drivers know what's going on around them, but it won't make you faster. If you're a good, self respecting driver then you use cockpit view, or any other "in car" view if preferences/FPS don't allow the normal one.
I use in car view or sometimes a LFS force like view (no car, just the tires, to see the track and tires better). I've tried chase view, but I don't pick up the car's responses to steering inputs quick enough, and I end up overcontrolling the car with laggy control inputs.

However, it's my belief that for any racing game, that a chase like view, probably just showing the 4 tires, and perhaps slightly higher, is going to produce the best lap times by an expert chase view driver. The analogy for this would be driving a remote control car, with an on board view versus an external view.

Since there are no forces to feel, a good chase view, perhaps with exaggerated yaw effects (yaw that can be seen in the chase view as opposed to yawing the chase view itself), would compensate for the lack of these forces.

Most racing games use audio based "assists", such as exaggerated tire scrub and squeal sounds to help with the game, in spite of the fact that these sounds aren't realistic. The same type of logic would apply with visual "assists" (like smoke from the rear tires to indicate how close to the limits they were, or LFS's force view), but these would be best implemented with a chase like view.

If the goal was the fastest lap times in a racing game, regardless of the physics, then visual "assists" would produce faster lap times. However, it wouldn't seem as realistic. It would be like driving a remote control car (which in essence is a better analogy to racing games than driving a real cars, since there are no acceleration based forces to be felt in a remote control car or a racing game car).
Quote from lerts :yeah i think chase view should be the one to be forced there are less crashes that way

a guy was gonna hit me from behind saw it,i stopped braking and avoided collision

This is a simulator though - you can't use chase view in real life. Get used to using Cockpit view and you will be faster. Chase view is harder to drive for me.
i use chase for now but i will change to cockpit once i get my new comp that will raise my fps.
I use chase view alot of the time but in single seaters i use the cockpit and have done that since i have played the game, i can use the cockpit in the closed cars and see the benifits off it e.g. it's much easy to tell if your going to run wide on the exit of the corner.

Quote from mcintyrej :Chase view is harder to drive for me.

It's only harder because you don't like the way it feels simple as that.

Quote from lerts :a guy was gonna hit me from behind saw it,i stopped braking and avoided collision

Not sure how people can race with alot of fov in chase view it feels like shit if i am to far away from the distance off the car.

Here my setting i use, very close to default i think just with a mess with the fov.
Attached images
Untitled.jpg
To me simulators (be they motor racing or flight) are all about immersion, so I'm in the cockpit.
Simulators to me are also about a level playing field, and I think LFS would benefit from server side options to force drivers in the car where they should be. That way people who don't treat it as a simulator don't impede on people who do.
I've set my view so that I can see the dash of the car while sitting in front of the steering wheel. For me it is the most natural way and I think it is the closest for the real view you get in real car. If I was to have a cockpit with shifters and multiple displays I'd probably change the view so that it wouldn't have the dash visible.



As for setting up your viewpoint in a way it gives you an adventage... well, I think it is a lot easier to see where your tires are and how close you are to other people if you set up your view for that. If I was looking for the best view possible I'd probably pick a view like this:



The benefits are simple and notable:
- the ability to see further, the ability to see "through" blind corners, over the hills and other cars etc.
- the ability to see exactly how much room there is towards the other car, wall; simply so easy to see how much room there is
- can see other cars next to you, helps a lot when battling out positions with multiple cars
- no blind spots of any kind

Not something I'd call realistic at all and sadly I can't force my ways .
Hyperactive, first, both of your thumbnails point to the bonnet view when clicked. Second, how did you get the thumbnail? Is that with bbc code? (or whatever the acronym is for that...)

Lerts (an others as well), your question implies that you are wondering which view is faster, as in, which view would get you the fastest lap time. Then you state about accidents.

When racing, you want to be looking as far ahead as possible. If you are looking at your wheels, you are looking at the wrong place. Looking at your wheels only tells you where you are. Looking as far ahead, tells you where you want to go. You will go where you want to by looking ahead.

Here is where you want to look (not the best example, would be better using a single turn....)



Here is where you do not want to be looking.....



and



There's no point in looking at your wheels or where your car is currently. It is too late. You are already either correctly cornering or not correctly cornering. Looking at the wheels and deciding you are wrong, there's nothing you can do about correcting.

A good analogy is what you learn when motorcycling. You look where you want to go, not where you are going. If there is a giant pothole in the center of the road, and you naturally want to avoid it on a motorcycle, your chances of hitting the pothole are greater if you look at it to avoid it. You should look at your path around the pothole as your control of the motorcycle will tend to follow where you are looking. The same applies to racing.

As for the crashing and seeing others as you stated, "a guy was gonna hit me from behind saw it,i stopped braking and avoided collision." You may have avoided a collision, but 9 times out of 10, you will also completely miss the corner because you are no longer braking where you need to be braking, thus taking yourself out of the race anyways.

Instead, you learn racecraft, which is an awareness of what is going on around you at all times. You are able to have a sense when someone is going to crash into you by not braking, thus, before the start of the corner sequence, you adjust by moving a bit off the line, tapping the brakes to show the brakelights to the one behind, or other techniques. As for other situations with other cars around you, using the mirrors and the left/right views gives you the sense of where everyone is on the track in relation to you. You can't help some who turns into you when beside you or pushes you off the track at corner exit. But with racecraft, it is easier to avoid these situations because you have a pretty good sense of where the other cars are without the need to look at the whole track such as with the views you posted.

Many times you can use the other drivers and how they act and react on the servers to your advantage. You learn from experience of racing with the same people that the guy beside you doesn't hit the apex well when passing and is going to slide to the outside on exit with total disregard of other drivers. You then brake earlier allowing them to pass by, take the apex easier, get back on the throttle faster as he moves across in front of you, and repass him on the exit.
Personally I prefer in-car view and custom view set to a camera on the top of the car.
Quote from mrodgers :Hyperactive, first, both of your thumbnails point to the bonnet view when clicked. Second, how did you get the thumbnail? Is that with bbc code? (or whatever the acronym is for that...)

Fixed. As for how I got those, well, it was just a menial task of copy paste from photobucket as they do not seem to offer that bit straight away...

As for the point of looking at where you are going and not where you are. There are few exceptions or should I say adjustments to those. First off on some corners the shape of the track or some other objects may block your vision when inside the cockpit but not from a roof view or chase view. The corner is a lot easier when you can see where the apex is and where the exit kerbs are. The same with driving on a track with dangerous objects outisde the racing line, like in south city where you want to go as close to the walls as possible. It is easier and more consistent to drive closer to the apexes near the walls with "better" view than watching it from inside the car. Or for racing purposes. You can see much better where the other car is and where you are. Is there time and space to still close the door or take a tighter line through a corner because there is room inside.

I don't really know if it is faster to use some chase or roof view, at least for hotlapping, I'd guess the absolute differences are quite small (I once tried this but couldn't improve my time by changing to hood view). But I'd say that there is defenetive difference when racing and that's a benefit! Even a simple task of stopping in your pit box is a lot easier with some hood cam. Roof cams also make people more aware of their situation but at the same time you are getting used to unnatural aid (soorry :tilt.

I'd say it's unnatural benefit but I defenately don't want to label the "chase cam drivers" as cheaters or anything like that. There's the other side too, performance issues etc. all play their parts too. It's a game but it's a simulation game in which the reality should the target and as such I'd consider any views outside from the cockpit a bit strange, or at least dillusitional
I can't drive using chase view - I just lose all feel of what the car's doing.

The one time I do use it however is on the B & J server, where I set my wheeel to 180 degrees travel too.
I tend to use the custom front wheel view only for hotlapping and then cockpit view for racing.

I figure I am generally a tiny bit faster in front wheel view, but then again some of my race times (with cockpit view) are better than my hotlaps!!

Cockpit view is so much more absorbing tho, and more challenging. Especially at SO tracks trying to miss the barriers by inches thru the tight sections

When all the interiors are complete I hope FCV becomes integral to the game
Quote from HVS5b :cockpit view for racing.

I'm not particularly competitive so I'm often not playing the game 'to win at all costs' - I mainly play to just pretend to be driving a racing car so cockpit view is a preference for me whether it has an advantages or disadvantages at all.

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