Quote from zeugnimod :

I can't see how it is good for the sport when the best competitor leaves.

Alonso leaving would not be the worst thing to happen to F1. The FIA will make sure of that.

Quote from 5haz :

As much as you hate Alonso as a person, you have to admit he is a good driver. A bit like Hamilton really, or Schumacher.

I can admit he does have talent, but he is no where near Schumacher. Schumacher wasn't a whiny little tit, either.

Quote from MAGGOT :

I can admit he does have talent, but he is no where near Schumacher.

Ya, he didn't have as many teammates that moved out of his way as Schumacher did

Quote from MAGGOT :

Alonso leaving would not be the worst thing to happen to F1. The FIA will make sure of that.



I can admit he does have talent, but he is no where near Schumacher. Schumacher wasn't a whiny little tit, either.

because Schumacher was smart enough not to say out loud "I want a crap teammate" and "I can't compete if my teammate is at least on the same level as me"~

Quote from MAGGOT :

I can admit he does have talent, but he is no where near Schumacher. Schumacher wasn't a whiny little tit, either.

No, Schumacher was an arrogant and cheating little tit.

We can argue what is worse.

Quote from zeugnimod :

No, Schumacher was an arrogant and cheating little tit.

We can argue what is worse.

I much prefer an arrogant, cheating tit to a whiny tit, personally.

Alonso complaining about a car not having traction control, LMAO!!! He was an aids whore!!! (lol)

However, I do agree that many decisions made for F1's future is ruining the sport. I fear very few teams will be participating for next season. Cost of development, all these companies trying to save money, blah blah. F1 isn't ready for change at this point in time, it will just cost way too much... and be even MORE less-interesting that I may only watch it just to see if any teams can contest with Ferrari and McLaren.

So what do we have in store for 2009?

7 teams to race
Honda team for sale
Torro Rosso converting to shittier drivers
"Green"
Toyota is pessimistic more than ever
Hopefully Prodrive will enter as a team
Horrible looking aero packages
Slick tires
Force India backed by McLaren-Mercedes
Williams not doing jack shit
New Abu Dhabi track
Suzuka is back
German GP may be cancelled
KERS system that nobody gives a damn about
A budget cap
Driver adjustable bodywork/aero
BBC instead of ITV
Magny Cours cut from calendar
Alonso will have bigger eyebrows
Someone in Spain will punch Hamilton

Quote from MAGGOT :

I much prefer an arrogant, cheating tit to a whiny tit, personally.

I prefer whiny over arrogant...because the whiny one knows his place, all he'll do is complain which I can handle while the arrogant one thinks he's the king of the world and talks to you as if your dirt

I know, how about neither?

http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?id=44709

Storm cloud was right (again) typical F1 politics, they are now going to do a standard engine.................if you actually want one. not compulsory, just need to be built to same specs (not sure how they would police that). Nice to see cosworth could make a comeback though

Quote from keiran :

Spot on!

I can't see manufactures sticking around in F1 with a standardized engine or chassis. It's not what F1 is about and takes away the only reason manufactures have to be part of it. They are there to showcase their technology and when it wins, there marketing department can go to town and tell everyone "why" they won.

More like spot off (whatever).

F1 is just an expeinsive publicity stunt, you don't sell any cars or technology and you can't explain any of that stuff to normal folks who have no engineering background. Technology doesn't sell cars, maybe winning does a few but mostly it is down to being there and being on telly. Merc wouldn't sell any more cars if they would win every race and neither would their cars be any better in any way. All the gains you can get from being in F1 is visibility in media. No one buys renault or bmw if they do well in F1. And probably won't buy if they do badly. And shouldn't either.

I've said it before but to 95% of viewers the car are already the same, no one actually gives a shit whether the cars have same engine or bodies because they already look, sound and act like they do. I think Lonso's comment was spot on however, going from V10s to V8s was pretty stupid, did it even cut down the costs? Why not use standardizes V10s instead of V8s or some other good solution. New tech is always expensive to switch to even if making V10s was more expensive than V8s (duhh it less more cylinders). And now kers. Great way to make f1 less cheaper. And after all it is forced technology, is the car even faster with a kers system than without it? Especially if you look the costs that go into it...

I think it is totally pointless and uninformative claim that standardized parts on F1 would have ANY effect on the amount of viewers F1 races have. No one really cares about the tech except the teams themselves. And it's not like the tech development would stop with standardised parts either.

Quote from Hyperactive :

I think it is totally pointless and uninformative claim that standardized parts on F1 would have ANY effect on the amount of viewers F1 races have. No one really cares about the tech except the teams themselves. And it's not like the tech development would stop with standardised parts either.

Pointless and uninformative? I think that to say it wouldn't have ANY effect on the amount of viewers F1 races have is equally nonsensical. Of course it will have an effect, but perhaps not on the scale that some people are making out.

Lots of people are giving knee-jerk reactions to these various changes, because people just do not like change. However, once the change has been lived with for a period of time, people warm to it. It's the sort of thing that's happened in F1 before*, it's the same again this time, and it will happen again in the future.

* See: Pirelli / Michelin / V8 / V12 / Turbo / Slicks / Grooved

Quote from dawguk :

Pointless and uninformative? I think that to say it wouldn't have ANY effect on the amount of viewers F1 races have is equally nonsensical. Of course it will have an effect, but perhaps not on the scale that some people are making out.

Maybe 2% would stop watching and those 2% are the engineers that are left out of job when you don't need 2000 engineers, 1980 would do just fine.

Quote from dawguk :

Lots of people are giving knee-jerk reactions to these various changes, because people just do not like change. However, once the change has been lived with for a period of time, people warm to it. It's the sort of thing that's happened in F1 before*, it's the same again this time, and it will happen again in the future.

* See: Pirelli / Michelin / V8 / V12 / Turbo / Slicks / Grooved

It is called "getting used to something"

Maybe F1 needs changes because it needs changes. There's no reason to change anything unless just for the change itself.

Quote from lizardfolk :

I prefer whiny over arrogant...because the whiny one knows his place, all he'll do is complain which I can handle while the arrogant one thinks he's the king of the world and talks to you as if your dirt

I know, how about neither?

I think Schumi knew his place much better than Alonso. Alonso doesn't just whine, he bitches and belittles his team, who are the sole reason for his success. Alonso needs a backhand to the face to put him in his place.

Quote from Storm_Cloud :

Standard engines is a threat, a bargaining chip if you like.

Sounds very realistic to me. And they're desperate about sending this message "F1 races will not be boring anymore!! turn on your telly puhleaseeeeeeee"

Quote from Storm_Cloud :

It's like the outlandish threats that your wife dishes out - "Put the bins out and if you forget to then I'll cut your balls off"

Difference being, Mrs Bobbitt really did that

Quote from Hyperactive :

Technology doesn't sell cars, maybe winning does a few but mostly it is down to being there and being on telly. Merc wouldn't sell any more cars if they would win every race and neither would their cars be any better in any way.

My experience is most non-technical (and even some technical) chaps around me in the late 90s were still thinking Mercs were some kind of luxurious boats on wheels, nice for showing off your money but not thrilling by any chance.

Then they started winning in F1 and all the buzz was about the Mercedes F1 (no mention about McLaren).

Major changes in styling and their lineup over the years are likely to have played a major part but gaining the top spot in F1 really ignited their mixture Mercedes had acquired a sporty image on par with BMW's, not an easy task anyway.

Quote from NightShift :

Sounds very realistic to me. And they're desperate about sending this message "F1 races will not be boring anymore!! turn on your telly puhleaseeeeeeee"

They're doing a very good job at making everyone do the opposite.

EDIT: http://www.f1technical.net/news/11205

This man makes my blood boil, he's like the Iraqi intelligence minister when the US invasion was going on "There is nothing wrong, no enemies in our country at all!".

Yeah maybe F1 is in no bigger crisis than 'any other company', but at the moment 'any other company' is in major crisis. Plus F1 isn't a company, it should be a bloody racing championship!

If Ferrari suddenly build an indycar chassis, then perhaps the lambs up top will change their mind, thats what happened last time FISA tried to bring in sweeping engine changes in the 80s.

Quote from Hyperactive :

I've said it before but to 95% of viewers the car are already the same, no one actually gives a shit whether the cars have same engine or bodies because they already look, sound and act like they do. I think Lonso's comment was spot on however, going from V10s to V8s was pretty stupid, did it even cut down the costs? Why not use standardizes V10s instead of V8s or some other good solution. New tech is always expensive to switch to even if making V10s was more expensive than V8s (duhh it less more cylinders). And now kers. Great way to make f1 less cheaper. And after all it is forced technology, is the car even faster with a kers system than without it? Especially if you look the costs that go into it...

I think it is totally pointless and uninformative claim that standardized parts on F1 would have ANY effect on the amount of viewers F1 races have. No one really cares about the tech except the teams themselves.

You have a point, slightly exaggerated though. Most fans care only about the driver championship. Ferrari is red and McLaren is silver, that's enough difference for them.

If there are some tech related areas that Average Fan cares about, it's still related to the engine. Like sound. I think actually surprisingly many would rather choose standard V8s over non-standard turbos... just shows how much average fan really cares.

Most people watch F1 because it's F-freakin'-1.

Quote :

And it's not like the tech development would stop with standardised parts either.

That's bit of an oxymoron. Ok, it wouldn't stop completey, but it would be rather pointless since any advantages would be outlawed in a way or another.

Quote from MAGGOT :

I think Schumi knew his place much better than Alonso. Alonso doesn't just whine, he bitches and belittles his team, who are the sole reason for his success. Alonso needs a backhand to the face to put him in his place.

Sorry, Alonso is one of the main reasons for Renault's success at the end of last season. Not the other way around. I'm sure Renault wouldn't have had any race wins with Piquet and Bourdais etc. as drivers.

Quote from deggis :

If there are some tech related areas that Average Fan cares about, it's still related to the engine. Like sound.

The more intresting bit is the smell actually. the mclaren always smelt like it had a wood fire under the engine cover

Quote from robt :

The more intresting bit is the smell actually. the mclaren always smelt like it had a wood fire under the engine cover

It did.

We have enough single make championships as it is thanks, I'm waiting to see what will happen if Ferrari starting threatening to quit.

Quote from lizardfolk :

this is so weird...not even NASCAR enforces standard engines...

Seems like he's pissed off at the removal of driver aids. It requires more talent and skill to drive as well without these, and it's more of a spectactle for the views. I say bring back the 1950's with those Mercedes and stuff that drifted everywhere. That's what I'd call a spectactle!

Quote from zeugnimod :

Sorry, Alonso is one of the main reasons for Renault's success at the end of last season. Not the other way around. I'm sure Renault wouldn't have had any race wins with Piquet and Bourdais etc. as drivers.

Just to add to that, Renault have made there intentions clear all season that they are determined to keep Alonso in there car for next season... I doubt they'd do that if they felt he `bitched` and `belittled` them

Quote from Hyperactive :

More like spot off (whatever).

F1 is just an expeinsive publicity stunt...

It's a conduit for advertising. Pretty much all professional sports are this way.

Quote from Mattesa :

It's a conduit for advertising. Pretty much all professional sports are this way.

True true, but at least Bernie hasn't got his greedy mits on Bog Snorkelling yet

Quote from NotAnIllusion :

What are the NASCAR budgets like in comparison?

the top teams run about 20 million US$ per team...
but i have read a "showstring budget" runs arounf 12Million US dollars
champ car before the -remerge- were running $3-5 million a year
indy car budgets have crept up a bit as well.
why F1 needs to spen anywhere from 180-450 million is crazy
constructors for chassis and engine can certainly help cut costs i think...
but it would end up being a defacto spec series like waht happened to CC and IRL..

Quote from S14 DRIFT :

Seems like he's pissed off at the removal of driver aids. It requires more talent and skill to drive as well without these, and it's more of a spectactle for the views. I say bring back the 1950's with those Mercedes and stuff that drifted everywhere. That's what I'd call a spectactle!

well alonso did win 2 races this year in a puke car vesus the Ferrari and McLaren..
one was caution related the other was talent- he can do the business
a two time world champ is a very skilled driver, are there better? have there been better? sure- but alonso is no slouch
I don't imagine he is pissed at losing driver aids, as much as the loss of driver aids to cut R&D costs rather than actuallt improvce the racing
ChampCar did not have traction control or power steering or active anything
what did this do for the spectacle? the best teams still made it look easy and the good driver were still the good ones

Quote from GT Touring :

why F1 needs to spen anywhere from 180-450 million is crazy

Considering a single top soccer player can be transferred for as much as 30 mln £, it does not look crazier to me than any other top-level, over-rated, ad-ridden, useless, stupid sport