Ok, I put here some of setups that are my own style that I have created, some may like them, some may dislike them, but need place to share them and where to have discussion, opinions etc.

My setups are not good for 5 lap races generally, I try to make them balanced and good to control, but still trying to get speed out of them.

XRG setup is oldest, I have worked quite some time for it now, maybe I work more of it if I get some ideas, but I'm quite happy with it now, does the job.

XRT setup is quite new, not much time have been spend to it, still looking to tweak more later.

RAC setup is most recent and I have used 10-15 minutes for it so far, currently working with it.

Setups are done for BL GP, but also easily adapted to other tracks too by setting gear ratios and possible ride height.

XRG setup might have passenger, can't remember now if it was 5 or 6 with passenger, but it is just small adjustment to dampers and springs if passenger is removed.

Fuel load around 10% is what these have been intended, RAC setup can handle easily more.

If you download setup, make sure you come back and tell me what you liked what you did not liked and if setup was any good for you, also would like to know from really fast drivers that what kind of times they get at BL GP track with these.

If you don't like to comment, then please don't download, inferno setups are surely faster...

Check 2nd page, there is few sets too.

Hmm, I see no comments, but yet those tiny numbers next to links are slowly increasing, shall I remove links or shall I wait for a day, that will I deem in my mind, yet soon must lie to rest and wait for a day of next to come and shall that reveal some answers will be seen

Quote from JTbo :

Hmm, I see no comments, but yet those tiny numbers next to links are slowly increasing...

Well I'll download the xrg setup and give it a whirl then comment for you tonight It would be good actually as I've spent abit of time with the xrg and bl1 on the weekend.

XRG setup is great. Rewards smooth driving and clean lines. Has a tendency to overtseer if thrown into a corner but works well with trail braking. Can be on the power and exit vey early without the back getting loose which is what I like. Managed a new pb around Blackwood in just a few laps compared to the WR setup. Tyres were spot on after some laps, defaintely a keeper. Thanks for sharing.

Quote from Davo :

XRG setup is great. Rewards smooth driving and clean lines. Has a tendency to overtseer if thrown into a corner but works well with trail braking. Can be on the power and exit vey early without the back getting loose which is what I like. Managed a new pb around Blackwood in just a few laps compared to the WR setup. Tyres were spot on after some laps, defaintely a keeper. Thanks for sharing.

Glad to hear that you liked from it

My pb with XRG at BL1 is 1.34.69 with that setup, I think that could go faster but I never get all corners right. Still with same setup I can do 50 laps race easily without changing tires :P

I only tried the XRG set as that's the one that interests me most, hope you don't mind honest answers

After driving alot with the WR setup yours feels abit boat like no suprise there though as the WR setup uses max ARB front and rear Having said that I found it very easy to drive clean laps, it was actually hard to make errors, so I'd have to say it's a very forgiving setup.

I did find that there was an understeer characteristic mid corner which I felt could be improved with slightly stiffer front spring rate and/or stiffer front ARB.

Overall it's not the fastest set but would enable consistent laps with very even tyre wear. I found my best times in it was high 134s and consitently low 135s, this is about 1 sec off my pace with the WR setup so I think you have tended too far towards conserving tyres and making an easy to drive set

So if there was a race with your set as complucery I'd enjoy it very much, but if I had a choice I'd opt for a set more closely atune to the WR setup but with some minor detuning for conserving tyres Nice set though

I tested the set for about 40-50 laps btw

Quote from Glenn67 :

I only tried the XRG set as that's the one that interests me most, hope you don't mind honest answers

After driving alot with the WR setup yours feels abit boat like no suprise there though as the WR setup uses max ARB front and rear Having said that I found it very easy to drive clean laps, it was actually hard to make errors, so I'd have to say it's a very forgiving setup.

I did find that there was an understeer characteristic mid corner which I felt could be improved with slightly stiffer front spring rate and/or stiffer front ARB.

Overall it's not the fastest set but would enable consistent laps with very even tyre wear. I found my best times in it was high 134s and consitently low 135s, this is about 1 sec off my pace with the WR setup so I think you have tended too far towards conserving tyres and making an easy to drive set

So if there was a race with your set as complucery I'd enjoy it very much, but if I had a choice I'd opt for a set more closely atune to the WR setup but with some minor detuning for conserving tyres Nice set though

I tested the set for about 40-50 laps btw

Honest answers are best answers, there we can learn something, if all say just good yes, it would be just pointless

I made setup very forgiving as I'm not very good driver so that making mistake does not cost me too much, also I need set that has ability to stretch as quite often I need to dodge something during races so with fastest set possible there would not be any ability left, but surely could be that it is too far.

Hmm, stiffer front ARB would mean more understeer, same with stiffer front springs?

I have tried to avoid using bugs to gain performance, but with tires I have to make exception, I realise this means that it will not be so fast, but at least damn thing feels like real car and not like skateboard that has super balls as tires

But that understeer is something I have been trying get rid of, however there seem to be compromise between entry oversteer and mid corner understeer, I'm not yet good enough to tell if some setting effects specifically mid corner and other at entry, though.

It might be that I will work on some faster su to XRG in future, but must see, I really would like to wait next incompatible patch until I start to make fast setups and really going fast, hopefully those few bugs are sorted by then. But would need 0.5-1sec off in not so distant future :P

I ordered eye glasses, my vision has gone bad as I can't read too well any more, wondering if those helps with LFS too

Quote from JTbo :

Hmm, stiffer front ARB would mean more understeer, same with stiffer front springs?

From what I have read to resolve mid corner understeer often requires changes that are the opposite to what you think.

I tried your set with front spring rate increased to 72.0 and front ARB increased a little as well and it did improve mid corner understeer alot

Decreasing parallel steer a bit will help midcorner understeer. Midcorner is usually the point where the front wheels are turned the most, and decreasing parallel steer will decrease front tire scrubbing and give you less understeer.

Probably 10-20% will be plenty, but I haven't driven your set yet and can't for another week (don't have my LFS computer).

If I feel I'm suffering mid corner understeer. i.e. understeer in neutral throttle positions, I usually find it is caused by the overall balance of the car. i.e it is too stiff at the front / too soft at the back.

Use a combination of the ARBs and Spring rates to adjust the overall balance in these situations. Remember that using stiff ARBs has the effect of joining the wheels together by transfering forces from one side to another. Springs on the other hand work independently from side to side. For this reason, if you are on a bumpy circuit very stiff ARBs can cause problems over bumps.

GF

hey, I tried your xr gt setup, just out of curiosity. my impressions were:

- I was 1.5-2 seconds slower then with a set similar to the wr set (my pb is 1:33.45)
- I changed the diff to locked instantly, didn't help
- tried using stiffer ARB-s, it helped a little
- what I noticed was that the gearing was very different to my taste, or what I was used to, I only use 2nd for the first hairpin, all the other slower turns are taken in 3rd, which in your set has very low revs and doesn't pull the car out of the corners fast enough.

I think by tweaking your gearing for 3rd and 4th to be closer to 2nd, you should gain another couple of tenths. also using more negative camber will help your cornering speed and as the xr gt is a very easy to drive car and nice on the tyres it shouldn't decrease tyre lifespan that much. Having them a little above 50 degrees or nearer to 60 doesn't loose you as much grip as you lose by using less ARB and more positive camber.

A set needs to be designed around a locked diff, if a locked diff is to be used. Hence adding a locked diff to a more realisitic style setup that I, or (I'm assuming, not checked the sets) JTbo, would make, doesn't help, and switch back to clutch pack or viscous on a WR set will make it handle like a bag of shit.

I find locked diffs are great for FWD but I always use clutch pack diffs on my RWD sets.

Good points all, thx from them, must tweak a bit and look where I end up, there seem to not only one truth but that is how it should be I believe

Problem with rear ARB is that it lifts inner rear so then that leads to stiffening springs, but that makes entry oversteer too much, that leads scrub, which I have found out to be good at 100% with that set, 0% creates great understeer at entry, but perhaps it can be set something between those two

I have set gears so that when I shift up rpms drop to near max torque, shifting up around 6k-6.5k max, saving fuel is one of goals too, with my endurance style driving consumption is 1.0/lap.

To get more speed out from it I surely need to change most.

I used the opportunity to do a few laps in the RAC.
1. I thought it was too soft and thus didn't react swiftly enough (BL GP).
2. I pretty often locked up the right front. Brake bias wasn't good - it took longer to brake and was more difficult to do properly than with a random WR set.
3. The diff wasted a lot of power out of tight corners by spinning the inside wheel. I could have used that power to accelerate.
4. Very unstable on no-power-no-brakes situations. -> Preload. Was better when I braked earlier and led the car into the corner on the power.
5. Nice handling off the limit, got worse the more I pushed.
...Which is contrary to typical WR sets. Those behave poorly if you're slow, but are nice and smooth as long as you push the tyres into high slip angles.

But thanks for giving me a reason to drive a few laps with the RAC.

Vain

Quote from Bob Smith :

A set needs to be designed around a locked diff, if a locked diff is to be used. Hence adding a locked diff to a more realisitic style setup that I, or (I'm assuming, not checked the sets) JTbo, would make, doesn't help, and switch back to clutch pack or viscous on a WR set will make it handle like a bag of shit.

true in most cases, but I feel this particular set was lacking a lot of grip, so my points stand in general to make a setup corner faster. also had I left it at viscous diff, wouldn't have made it any quicker, would it? and it wasn'T the general handling i was telling about, as an xrg can't be that bad at handling whatever the set shall be

I have been playing with Clutch pack now and I just don't get it to work how I would like to, it brakes traction at rear when braking really hard and it breaks traction at late exit of corner with XRT. I'm almost 1 second slower at Aston Grand Touring with Clutch pack at best and then I have to adjust it to almost minimum at power side and minimum at coast side, also brakes need to set more towards front.

Viscous coupling seem to just work better for my style, even it does loose somewhat lot of power to wheel spin.

Vain raises good and valid points there, that is how setup really is, but for my driving style it fits very well, I brake early and use throttle trough corner to control direction and steering controls balance/stance of car, but I still don't slide around corners as that is slow way.
RAC set does not work too well if you try to trail brake, I think it is possible to make such set, but it would make car feel unrealistic and very understeering unless one pushes it really hard.

I do enjoy more from car that feels good and works like a car, than fastest lap time Of course if I can get both that would be great, but seem to be difficult with RAC.

I can be also wrong, I'm not too good driver (mainly 2 second from wr or even more at some combos, for some can get to 1 second range) and I have just started messing with RAC setups.

For suspension I use some formulas, I'm missing one that would calculate correct Hz range, but I can estimate and always adjust, I think that I have gone bit soft for RAC, 2.4Hz as an average, car is bit under 900kg with fuel and driver, so perhaps 2.6Hz might be better.

I have been wondering also tire pressures a bit, I find irritating to use silly low pressures but gain in grip is massive and is very hard to get good grip with using realistic pressure, but if I will get enough annoyed by low pressures that is what I will do even it would mean 2 seconds slower lap times, can't help it, I like realism more than record times

Quote from JTbo :

I have been playing with Clutch pack now and I just don't get it to work how I would like to, it brakes traction at rear when braking really hard and it breaks traction at late exit of corner with XRT. I'm almost 1 second slower at Aston Grand Touring with Clutch pack at best and then I have to adjust it to almost minimum at power side and minimum at coast side, also brakes need to set more towards front.

Isn't it that a higher coast side setting will cause less traction breakage (technical term ) when braking or off the throttle? That's the way it works for me anyways. I use around 60-70% on coast for most of my setups, higher if I don't want the rear rotating as much off throttle and lower if I want the rear to rotate a bit more.

Quote from mrodgers :

Isn't it that a higher coast side setting will cause less traction breakage (technical term ) when braking or off the throttle? That's the way it works for me anyways. I use around 60-70% on coast for most of my setups, higher if I don't want the rear rotating as much off throttle and lower if I want the rear to rotate a bit more.

I found out that it will just loose traction more completely and more sudden if I did set it to such high numbers, I'm starting to believe that I'm just not compatible with clutch pack I'm very sure it is problem with how I like to use my pedals and steering

Well with Viscous coupling I could also turn in better and be on power much earlier, without need to be over cautious with throttle, so I could concentrate to lines more.

Quote from JTbo :

I
For suspension I use some formulas, I'm missing one that would calculate correct Hz range, but I can estimate and always adjust, I think that I have gone bit soft for RAC, 2.4Hz as an average, car is bit under 900kg with fuel and driver, so perhaps 2.6Hz might be better.

Don't get hung up on wheel rates and suspension frequencies too much. If you want the car to react quickly have a stiff set, if you want it to react slower soften the set off.

btw - the lower the front clutch pack diff setting the more the car will swing into the apex at corner entry. Increase the numbers and it makes the car more stable.

As for parrallel steer you need to set this correct for the radius of the most important corners. Big radius turns need high parralell steer settings and tight corners require lower settings. Read about Ackerman Angle to understand why. Please don't ask me about it, I've tried to explain it to so many people on this forum Maybe do a search for ackerman.

Car should be soft as that is how those road cars are, also if I drive one front tire to kerb rear should not get upset, stiff suspension and control is overrated, imo Ok, for race cars and cars that should feel like go karts, very stiff suspension might be ok, but I like from soft but not fluffy

Turbo got too stiff when I increased springs to near 80, when hit curb tail instantly shot to side, very hard to drive such car that have to be straight when floored if there is no perfectly smooth and level road, so that seem not to fit for my driving style either.

Gentlefoot you explained very well this Parallel steer/Ackerman thing, I know basics what it does, but never have considered it enough important to read a lot from it to learn what function it will have to handling, thx from explanation

I must do some comparison video or something from difference with clutch pack and Viscous coupling so you see my problem with it.

Quote from JTbo :

also if I drive one front tire to kerb rear should not get upset

I always use dampers to control the cars handling in transitional states like running over kerbs. If the back kicks out over a kerb then I will either increase front bump or rebound or both or soften rear rebound, bump or both.

I'd be interested to see a video comparison of clutch pack Vs Viscous diffs.

Also, with regard stiffness, stiiffness is created by a combination of springs, ARBs and dampers. I often run high spring rates but low ARBs.

Also, its worth remembering that the amount of grip the track surface gives effects the stiffness you need. On a very grippy surface you need a stiffer set becuase the lateral forces are higher resulting in more suspension bump. Therefore camber angles will be slightly different during high lateral force i.e. more camber.

So when going from say South City to Kyoto you may well need to stiffen the set or reduce static negative camber or both.

Also, if you have a car that oversteers very slightly on a grippy track, move to a less grippy surface and it will oversteer more. So you may need to reduce stiffness at the back/add to the front to achieve the same handling balance.

Videos, not best driving as I was clever enough to pick track that I had not driven with that car, but that is not perhaps most important. Level of car control with different differential and settings is what matters here, imo.

Viscous coupling vs Clutch pack 36/70 vs Clutch pack 10/10

Sorry for bad lap in 36/70 but other laps I managed to do with it were even worse, completely out of control, snapped to slide without warning and overall felt like car would have no weight at all at rear, amount of throttle should been estimated, in other two I can feel if car wants more or less throttle. Same with brakes, but braking was bit more stable to the point, same actually with throttle but with throttle point was way too early.

10/10 was rather ok actually, but some annoyances still, sometimes decided to understeer until I kicked tail out.

Viscous coupling is most predictable and forgiving, best for racing, hotlapping aside there it is ok if only 1 of 100 laps is good, but when racing all laps must be good so need lot of margin for errors too.

Nothing else is changed but diffs, 3-4 laps driven and order of tests were that you can see names in clips at youtube, driver did his best and weather was same, 718 degrees steering set from dfp and same in LFS (718 or 723 it let choose)

I believe that dampers have to be in rather direct relation to springs and springs again to mass, some fine tuning then is possible to be made, but that is where I base everything.
I see setups where springs and dampers are from different cars, setups where ride height is very low but springs and dampers are again from different car, those are fast sets also WR sets some, but very irritating setups, I would not put those kind of settings to my RL car, so I try to stay clear of them with my virtual car too
It is just different view, for road car springs between 2.0-2.8Hz are perhaps limits where I will stay and dampers calculated for those, some fine adjustments can be made but that is what I believe makes realistic handling. Sure there is lot to play with these limits too

Nice vids but difficult to know how it feels by watching. I think there is a difference to our setup approaches.

I use the diff settings to control the amount of spin I get from the inside wheel. With RWD rear diff settings I rarely go above 68%. This allows the inside wheel to spin very slightly giving me a chance to catch any oversteer but also gives me excellent acceleration out of corners.

My front diff lock is generally lower - about 35 - 40%

If I have too much oversteer at corner entry, rather than changing the front diff setting I add some front bump or ARB instead (unless the set is a bit on the stiff side in which case I will do the opposite to the rear settings.

Try again with 68/35 and fiddle with your suspension settings to give you a good balance for those diff settings. I bet you go faster.

Its worth remembering though that every car has its own setup uniqueness. I've never spent any time setting up the RAC so those diff settings may just be inappropriate for the weight distribution of the car. If for example a car is very nose heavy you would want a lower front diff lock to compensate for the natural understeer a car with this type of weight distribution has.

Yes, by watching vid it is bit hard, so here are setups used, should make easier to compare to what one sees in video

I don't drive FWD shopping carts a lot (yes, I have serious attitude problem against FWD ), AWD a bit, but less nowdays, Visco at front is great in those, but RWD mostly and RAC quite bit now as I feel in it driving wrong has most realistic consequences.

Yes, surely we have different approach, but that I find interesting, then there is possibility of learning more

Ok, I try 68/35, but damn thing will understeer so much that I need to set quite different suspension for it.