Hello,

I'm Thanos from Greece, Athens.

I made a motion simulator cockpit that can be used for either flight or driving simulators using electric motors. See it how it works on flight simulators:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBD9Juqx7PI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dYOmygb5XtQ

Recently I had connected x-sim software with Live4Speed and used the X,Y acceleration data to drive my motion cockpit. It works really well and you can feel even the smaller acceleration effect but...

...While the data are comming right when starting the race, they seem to shift around i.e. from x to y while driving around the circuit. Its like the acceleration data aren't car oriented but circuit oriented...

See the attached photos where I accelerate in various places in the circuit and receive different values for x,y...

http://www.x-simulator.de/foru ... r/pool/LFS_acc_data_1.gif
http://www.x-simulator.de/foru ... r/pool/LFS_acc_data_2.gif
http://www.x-simulator.de/foru ... r/pool/LFS_acc_data_3.gif
http://www.x-simulator.de/foru ... r/pool/LFS_acc_data_4.gif

As you may notice on the photos I gave above, the acceleration direction is indeed relevant to the orientation of the car so you need to use this output to calculate the correct x,y acceletation values. It maybe be a simple calculation like shift the x data to y by the amount indicated on the orientation data. But its beyond my mathematical knowledges.

I know that many commercial motion simulators (i.e. Force Dynamics 301) using these data LFS and somehow calculating the acceleration data to be car oriented.

So if there is a ready math formula for this I would really appreciate it! I could give it then to the xsim programmers to fix it for everyone that use x-sim to play LFS on a motion simulator.


Regards, Thanos

-------------------------------------
Home made motion simulator:
www.motionflightsim.eu.tp

Maybe this helps.

Hi thanos, i replied to you question on x-sim forum, I had the same problem, but used control 40 as you have already seen, that definitely fixed it.
I have been watching your work through IFSBI as well, I am about to build another fully enclosed flightsim with 4 DOF I intend to use prtdrvr for roll and yaw and x sim for heave and pitch through the same motion computer.
goto http://homepages.woosh.co.nz/cwarner/flightsim.htm
email [email protected]

MRT with Demo?

Quote from mcintyrej :

MRT with Demo?

Exactly... Very strange...illepall

mrt and posting with a demo account. has it occured to you that he might not be using his s2 licensed account? the dude has only made 2 posts and joined this month. maybe your right, but maybe your wrong. just give the guy a chance b4 you call for the linch mob

It did cross my mind Dadge, hence the reason I didn't post a million flaming banana's. Pff, i guess i'm a bit jealous about him having an awesome rig too! hehe.

Thats, right. It is indid S2 licensed. But i'm not using it online since I moved to bigger house to have room for my motion simulator. (no internet, no phone yet... )

Anyway I think I found what I needed to make the math formula so the acceleration data will be car-oriented...

I'll have soon ready a page that gives details on how to construct this motion simulator (for free) on your own here: http://www.etherealsounds.com/


Regards, Thanos

Quote from tronicgr :

Thats, right. It is indid S2 licensed. But i'm not using it online since I moved to bigger house to have room for my motion simulator. (no internet, no phone yet... )

Anyway I think I found what I needed to make the math formula so the acceleration data will be car-oriented...

I'll have soon ready a page that gives details on how to construct this motion simulator (for free) on your own here: http://www.etherealsounds.com/


Regards, Thanos

Sorry about the confusion then Hope you can get your rig working properly soon!

Out of interest, do you find that you're hitting the limits of the serial port (in terms of bandwidth) for your motion platform?

Quote from the_angry_angel :

Out of interest, do you find that you're hitting the limits of the serial port (in terms of bandwidth) for your motion platform?

No, not at all. Even if I used only 2400bps for the communication it can handle even more data (i.e. more axis). All is depending on how fast you process the data and drive the motors so to be ready to receive the next set of data in time. The data it receives anyway is just a few bytes (an sychonization character and x,y in the form of HEX(0-255) each.

X-sim software indicates 4800bps as the minimum baud it can work without data loss, but it works for me fine, with the half speed (2400)!

Regards, Thanos

This is my full motion simulator that I recently converted it to car racing simulator with the use of x-sim software. And with the help of this forum I fixed the data output acceleration data.

Its based on the old joyrider design but I motorized it with the use of car windshield wiper motors.

For the motion, I used a Basic Stamp2 microcontroler to read the data from the USO interface of the x-sim. And the motors are driver with the use of Parallax's HB-25 motor controllers that converts the wiper motors to big servos!

http://www.x-simulator.de/forum/uploader/pool/PICT0576.JPG

http://www.x-simulator.de/forum/uploader/pool/PICT0578.JPG

http://www.x-simulator.de/forum/uploader/pool/PICT0579.JPG

http://www.x-simulator.de/forum/uploader/pool/PICT0580.JPG



Full Motion Sim on LiveForSpeed using X-sim #1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWzkWVQ1SMQ

Full Motion Sim on LiveForSpeed using X-sim #2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qffTsdikHlY

Full Motion Sim on LiveForSpeed using X-sim (closeup)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PiZFq6b3ko


Enjoy, Thanos

Thanos, very cool. You might want to try damping the forces since the cockpit seems to be moving more than it should.

How is the latency of this system? From the videos it looked like quite a delay from the on-screen action until the platform was in the corresponding position.
Awesome job, btw! Looks very well built, and I envy you so much!

The latency is very small (below 8ms) and the delay you may see in some cases is from the servo ramping code I implemeted to protect the motors from wear during fast forward-backward action.

After all it performs very well for the junkyard compoments I used. And it costs 30 times less that the professional 301 force dynamics...

Regards, Thanos

Quote from atledreier :

How is the latency of this system? From the videos it looked like quite a delay from the on-screen action until the platform was in the corresponding position.
Awesome job, btw! Looks very well built, and I envy you so much!

Bear in mind the position is irrelevent. What you are after is the acceleration. If the thing tips over when braking really quickly and stops you get the initial jerk, the finishing jerk, and a bit of acceleration in the middle. You also get a small amount of the vertical component of gravity, which is pretty negligable until large angles.

So as you brake you want the device to continue to move throughout the braking zone.

As soon as it stops moving you might as well just be sitting in a chair, leaning slightly.

(Jerk = The rate of change of acceleration)

Ok. I figured it was the vertical component of gravity that was the main force here. Maybe Tronicgr can enlighten us both? And about the 30 times less than the 301, how much HAVE you spent on components?

tristancliffe is right. The motion is that takes first role in simulating acceleration and true vertical force of gravity then... Sometimes there is no time to settle in a stable position to actually feel the vertical gravity force.

I spend 800 euro making it (all PVC pipes, metal dexion parts, motors and electronics, bucket seat). Now I said 30 times assuming the cost of the 301 is around 30k, If I'm wrong correct me...

Regards, Thanos

Quote from tronicgr :

I spend 800 euro making it (all PVC pipes, metal dexion parts, motors and electronics, bucket seat). Now I said 30 times assuming the cost of the 301 is around 30k, If I'm wrong correct me...

You should put together a parts list and a basic "how-to" guide.. I'm sure others would love to try it themselves after seeing your awesome results.

altough i think the movement is exagerated, maybe from the outside point of view, its a fine piece of work there!

Quote from Hollywood :

You should put together a parts list and a basic "how-to" guide.. I'm sure others would love to try it themselves after seeing your awesome results.

Hi to all!

I just wanted to pass by, and show you my Home motion simulator site. Instructions to make my simulators are available, as well the electronics and the source code of the motion module... Although I present it mostly for use with flight sims it can work with LFS too just by switching the motion software to x-sim and attaching on it the momo wheel and the pedals.

Thanos home motion simulator

Regards, Thanos

Hi, my name is Luis and I´m from Mexico y just found this post and I think its awesome what you did. I tried to enter your website but it is not available,could you tell me where can I get the information about your project?...or your new website?...specially about the extraction of the varaibles from OutSim, I think the UDP package that is sent from LFS has to be read by a programm in VB, C# or python am I right? and then i have to do the communication whit USB or serial port.

I´d like to try something like this and any information would be nice.

Thanks and regards

Hi, read victor's post here may help you http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?t=30740 I am no expert but I hope this helps.
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espanol:
Hola, tu leas el bulletin de victor, aqui- http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?t=30740

Yo soy no experto pero espero que esto ayudarte.

Buena suerte.

Hi, thanks for your answer, I´ll see what can I do with that information jeje

If you have more information about this topic it would be great.

Regards