Today I had an awful racing on CTRA SS1 server, there was a billion of noobs who even didn't bother themselves to learn the track before racing. I got kicked off the track several times during my last lap by noobs who were on their first or second. So the point is that I figured out what could be done in order to stop this mess which is getting worse and worse.

My idea is to allow to race only those who has already made a proper laptime at that track, lfsworld data could be used for this. For example player should have already been made a lap that is less then wr+5sec.

After each track change there could be a short qualifying session for those who don't have their pb's for the track yet, it could be 10minutes long or something like that. Points might be given for qualify as well

I'm sure this would help to improve the racing quality.

Whay do you guys think?

1) You file a report

2) You advance to the higher tiers

3) Even experienced drivers often come across combos they've never driven before, but due to their experience they don't inherently suck at it. With your proposed system you'd kick off anyone, regardless of their skill.

Quote from pauliaK :

Whay do you guys think?

Get off the S1 servers.

The GT1 and GT2 classes on CTRA Race 3 have some of the best drivers in LFS bar none. That will end any awful racing experiences because of other drivers.

yeah i've started to try and stay away from the lower tiered servers, and people are cleaner i think i've only filed a report once and havent had any filed against me, despite the tons of times people have crashed into me, or i've crashed into them. If someone is really really just being a horrible driver, they should be reported...

There is no higher-tiered server running the FBM.

Give the beginners a break, most of them are doing their damndest to take care from what I've seen. I guess you just have to be prepared for anything on the CTRA 1 servers.

I remember when I first started racing online, it was a real eye opener and I much appreciated experienced players tips and more importantly understanding when I made an edjit of myself (which unfortunately I still do). I am quite proud that I have never reported anyone or been reported, well ok I have had a couple of telling offs from Sam for some bad language

I've only reported a couple of people but I would've sent more reports if the reporting system was a bit easier to understand and it didn't occasionally fall over while I was using it.

Recently when I've been on the CTRA servers, I've often sat out races for a little rest and actively watched a few people who I had run-ins with before to see if they are dickheads in subsequent races. So far there's only been one person who I wanted to report (but failed to), so I think the standard is actually pretty good.

Now the replays are stored in a database as well as in a directory, it's going to be easier for me to do a web interface for people wanting to raise reports there. The problem was in creating a replay drop-down by filtering through between 1,200 and 2,200 files in a directory, looking for filename matches. The admins had a "raise report" option, and frankly it was evil. It could take anything up to a minute and a half to create a drop-down. Now that the X-System immediately writes the race filename into a db, it's a simple process of querying that instead. I just didn't get around to it yet. I'll get that done in the next day or so

Quote from Motordirex :

Get off the S1 servers.

The GT1 and GT2 classes on CTRA Race 3 have some of the best drivers in LFS bar none. That will end any awful racing experiences because of other drivers.

Good for you GT racers then. Both SS2 and SS3 servers are always empty or if not theres a ~4000+ points limit at SS3 and racing on SS2 with two different cars is definitely not the way to attract people racing there... Reorganising SS2 might be the way to solve this problem, I mean leaving only one car without any restrictions.

Quote from Lateralus :

There is no higher-tiered server running the FBM.

Exactly... However I won't mind racing with FOX or FO8 but this is currently hardly possible .

Just for Kev, it's now possible to raise a report from MyCTRA, from any server over the last 2 days (by date).

If he doesn't use it, I'll bring my dog over to savage him. She's done a pretty good job of my hand over the last couple of days.. my fault for play-fighting! Ouch!

If he DOES use it, I'll bring my dog over to lick him to death. This could be equally as bad.. her tongue is like a bottle brush, and your nose is the bottle!

How are you and the mutt doing, Sam? You're still welcome to bring her over here any time you like except next Tuesday, when I'll be out.

Note to burglars: I'll definitely be in next Tuesday, and Sam will be here with his dog, which is a Rottweiler he hasn't fed for a week.

Quote from SamH :

Just for Kev, it's now possible to raise a report from MyCTRA, from any server over the last 2 days (by date).

If he doesn't use it, I'll bring my dog over to savage him. She's done a pretty good job of my hand over the last couple of days.. my fault for play-fighting! Ouch!

If he DOES use it, I'll bring my dog over to lick him to death. This could be equally as bad.. her tongue is like a bottle brush, and your nose is the bottle!

great - Can you please remind me which race it was that you were afk on the start grid Sam and caused a huge pile up becuase your mutt had 'disconnected your pedals'.... i need to raise a report

hehe! The dog's doing brill. Some teething problems, but she seems to be fixing those by chewing on my sneakers. The housecleaner bought her a squeaky toy, but she won't chew it.. she just carries it around like a trophy. My shoes, however.. different story! She spends a couple of hours a day sitting like a gargoyle on top of the wheelie bin, watching the folks go by, threatening to lick them menacingly. She's discovered her bark (unfortunately) but she doesn't use it too often

I'd bring her over, Kev, but she hurls in the car at the moment. In the time it took us to get her from the A64 to home, she'd filled the footwell almost to brimming. Honestly, it was so bad, I was tempted to scuttle the car!

Quote from Dru :

great - Can you please remind me which race it was that you were afk on the start grid Sam and caused a huge pile up becuase your mutt had 'disconnected your pedals'.... i need to raise a report

Grrr..

Sam, I don't think Kev is scared of your dog licking him to death.

Have you seen his girlfriend?

:hide:

Quote from pauliaK :

Good for you GT racers then. Both SS2 and SS3 servers are always empty or if not theres a ~4000+ points limit at SS3 and racing on SS2 with two different cars is definitely not the way to attract people racing there... Reorganising SS2 might be the way to solve this problem, I mean leaving only one car without any restrictions.

I was giving you an option, no need to get your panties in a knot.

I do however agree with a 107% type rule. Just because you have a Gold or Platinum license doesnt mean your going to be fast in the track and not be a moving chicane. Its not fun beating someone or losing to them when the lap times are 3 to 4 seconds difference. Id rather win or lose by ten tenths, those are the best races.

Something needs to be done to make the place more freindly, its like a dog eat dog world on ss1 now, T1 is just horrible i find myself loosing so many places avoiding people and letting off so i dont smack the back of them.. only for the back of the grid to come flying in foot to the floor regardless. Smacking my rear end and ended my race or giving me a major bit of damage. It can become frustrating when youve sat there waiting for a spot for 4 races, only to have each of them ended at T1

The weekend was a horrible horrible experience for me. Something defo need to be done just to improve the sportmanship, if anything.
I heard remarks of ""talk to the hand cause the face 8nt listening" whats that all about say sorry and pull over, or at least say bloody sorry after u wreck someones race with retarded moves.

Quote from Spils :

Something needs to be done to make the place more freindly, its like a dog eat dog world on ss1 now, T1 is just horrible i find myself loosing so many places avoiding people and letting off so i dont smack the back of them.. only for the back of the grid to come flying in foot to the floor regardless. Smacking my rear end and ended my race or giving me a major bit of damage. It can become frustrating when youve sat there waiting for a spot for 4 races, only to have each of them ended at T1

The weekend was a horrible horrible experience for me. Something defo need to be done just to improve the sportmanship, if anything.
I heard remarks of ""talk to the hand cause the face 8nt listening" whats that all about say sorry and pull over, or at least say bloody sorry after u wreck someones race with retarded moves.

If you feel you have been wronged, raise a report...that's why the system is in place. The admin team will not take kindly to the sort of remarks you are describing.

I've often been playing on CTRA SS1 recently, and I have to agree with the fact that it's not as friendly as it deserves to be. It's not really about making it "noobs free", or excluding slow people I think this not the point. It's about finding a way to prevent people to drive absolutely recklessly. I've seen slow people that are not a threat or "moving chicanes", and do their best not to cause crashes. And I've seen fast people making very dangerous and illegal moves.

On peak hours, I'd say that about 40-50% of the people do at least one of the following illegal actions a few times in the race :
1 - Rejoining race after a crash without checking if the way is clear
2 - Not leaving a minimal safe distance with the car in front of you before hard brakings.
3 - Abusive tailgating to prevent a pass, with sometimes even voluntary contact (not the best way to protect your life in a single seater )
4 - And the most common of all : not leaving enough room for the car you are overtaking, or that you are trying to overtake. I've sometimes been hit so hard in that situation that I've come to the conclusion that it is either voluntary, or either that the guy was retarded enough to forget that three seconds ago I started to completely overlap him (which unfortunately seems to be true in more cases than anyone would think).

I don't know what you think about that, but even if everyone has probably done 1 & 2 sometimes, at least in his early LFS days, my opinion is that 3 & 4 are absolutely intolerable and can ruin the racing experience of everyone.

As a consequence, when I'm joining the server, I have a somewhat hard time surviving to the end of the first race, even being overly cautious (because I am prepared to everything I previously stated). Once I get a decent qualifying position, ok I can have fun and mostly clean races with the top third of the pack.

Now what to do ? fill reports ? Honestly, I'd be reporting people almost every race if I had to follow strictly the CTRA rules (which are very fair and accurate), and I'm not a fan of repression on such a scale. I'd rather like to see more educationnal measures, something that will make the reckless players realize that it is in everyone's interest, especially in theirs, to offer clean races.

My two cents on the topic : maybe a good idea would be that if you do not finish a race, you cannot enter the following one. With that rule :
- Reckless players would understand much better why one says "to win a race (and points) you first have to finish it", and therefore drive more cautiously.
- Victims of an illegal move would be more prompt to fill reports, as now that motherf^W^W disrespectful player ruined not only one of their races but two. That would help making the place more clean in the long run, though it can be a tough price to pay for the 'victims'.
- Beginners would drive more cautiously, focusing on handling the car safely rather than driving like in hotlap mode and crashing in every lap.

Thoughts anyone ?



PS: All that being said, it's still a pleasure to drive on CTRA and I appreciate all the work that has been done to give us a great racing experience
Yet the place deserves to be much more friendly and I'd like, if not asking too much, to see something to be done about it.

Quote from VinceM :

Now what to do ? fill reports ? Honestly, I'd be reporting people almost every race if I had to follow strictly the CTRA rules ..... I'd rather like to see more educationnal measures

I know how you feel about reporting. Last week i went through a phase of encountering some bad driving for many races/days in a row and had a good rant about it, but the fact is i didn't report anyone and as such nothing was done about it.

Trust me, the only way to see people 'educated' is to report them. The CTRA staff, as they keep telling me, don't mind. That is why the system is there.
I would rather be racing than filling out reports, but in the end if you want the servers to provide the standard of driving you and i expect then there is only one solution. Report.

All good observations, Vince, I'm sure. As Moose points out, though, the long-term solution can only be to report. Raise reports out the yin-yang, the admins will cope. If you have an issue one week with a bunch of drivers acting in a way you know is against the rules, and you raise not one single report against them, you should not be surprised to see the same behaviour continuing into the 2nd week. However, if you raise reports the chances of seeing the same bad behaviour continue into a 2nd week are infinitely reduced.

The CTRA doesn't do very much live admining for a couple of reasons. Firstly because you are GUARANTEED to make a substandard call, if you are admining while racing, or if you are admining on in-server hear-say. When we're in the server, we're just racers like anyone else. (besides there's no joy in the CTRA for us, unless we can fight for our wins like everyone else, on a level playing field.. we want to use the CTRA system too!)

Secondly, CTRA admins are determined to make the BEST calls we can make, on every occasion, and we firmly believe that you can't make that standard of a call on an incident until you've watched it from both the victim and the perpetrator's perspective. The only way for us to make racing incident calls to the standard we have set ourselves is via a replay.

I would suggest regarding a report as an investment in the CTRA. Put in a report, get some cleaner racing out. Until someone's used the reporting system, though, I don't really think they can really begin to suggest alternatives to it. We've built the reporting system to be used.. use it. If you use it and it doesn't work, THEN come up with some alternative ideas. Try it first though, please.

Reporting is the way to go...afterall like Sam says, its not just a 'reporting' that means you are trying to get people in trouble, its not that at all, you are trying to get people to see the error of thier ways and the reporting system does that.... people don't tend to get burnt at the stake immediately, they are normally 'educated' before someone gets the can of petrol

I forgot to reiterate.. we do try to educate rather than legislate. Raising a report will not get a new driver banned, unless it's VERY obvious that their only desire in the server is to wreck as many people as possible. Where they demonstrate ignorance of driving conventions, we will usually just warn them. A warning doesn't show up publicly on a driver's stats page or anything.. it's just a dialogue between them and the CTRA. If they keep persisting with behaviour that they've been warned about before, THEN we'll move on to cautions and holding the driver's licence back. Banning from the CTRA servers is much less about punishing the bad driver, and far more about giving every other driver a break from the "baddy".

[edit]gah! Beaten by Dru! At least it only happens on the forums, never in the servers

::flees::

Quote from SamH :

::flees::

Sorry to hear that, mate. You can probably get her one of those special collars, should get rid of them in a jiffy.