I'm noticing many topics about our n00bs who have wrecked our races, ect. I'm probably right in thinking it's been said before, but I have an idea.

Why not have an option, when creating a server, whether or not you would like drivers to have their racing license to enter. To get the license, you must complete all the tests in 'training' mode. If the host doesnt allow non-license holders, you will have to complete them and get your license before you can enter.

Good idea or not?

Interesting...but i dont like the idea In lfs is pretty much training mode, plus i have to do format c: on my computer for every 2-3 months, and i wont do all train mode for next 2 month

There are good drivers that have always turned 'evil' and cannot race against others well at all.

So even if someone passes the license tests, they wouldn't prevent anyone from being stupid in online races.

If the tests were hard in most cases, then it quite possibly could teach the noobs. But if most servers chose to only allow licensed users who completed the training, then it would be frustrating for some people to come online. If the training was somehow connected to online stats, then I think that would be nice. This would be sort of like a hotlapping competition, but also have your training saved online so you don't have to do it over and over again when reinstalling.

No. Bad idea. I can't be bothered to do them silly tests. In fact, they only belong in "Gran Turismo : The Real Nissan Skyline Simulator (if you like anything else, you can f**k off)"

And that is the attitude of most n00bs. Obviously, if the server doesn't wish for it, you're ok.

But he has a point Marc. Whenever I did the Gran Turismo series, the Training was easy and didn't prove or teach me anything.

I wanted to get straight to racing the fast race cars, but their concept is "you evolve and get better as you progress". That is really bullshit because winning in any car for any race is quite easy. Even the fastest drivers don't want to be arsed with tons of pointless Training sessions. They start the game up for the first time, and don't want to bother with things they know they could pass easily one by one. Noobs on the other hand... they do need a lesson in playing the game and driving certain cars. So it is useful for them. But if you are a fast driver, you don't need to do the training and waste your time...

Thumbs down for that idea.

Beginners and their occasional less-than-reasonable-behaviour are part of every online game, deal with it.

No, improve the AI and i might agree that you ahve to do the basic ones for basic car control. At the monute its stupid trying to do the races whilst not touching the AI at all as they are so tightly packed together and so thick you just cant win.

I recently played through the LFS training and it's much better than GTs as it teaches safe racing around other drivers. It's made me a better racer. GT only teaches racing lines, a skill that evolves naturally in LFS. Having the training mode connected to online stats would be a great idea imo eg servers could demand a certain basic skill level.

Quote from Stellios :

No, improve the AI and i might agree that you ahve to do the basic ones for basic car control. At the monute its stupid trying to do the races whilst not touching the AI at all as they are so tightly packed together and so thick you just cant win.

I experienced just the same, tried it soo many times but I can't get around the corners without being touched by the AI because they just can't drive responsible enough to avoid touching player cars!

Seriously.. Who here has actually wasted thier time, completing all the tests when you can just go online???

e.g. the time when my internet was broken and I couldn't even view the server list.

Seriously, the lessons are fun - up to a point. From this point, online racing is the one and only one could do in LFS

Quote from Stellios :

No, improve the AI and i might agree that you ahve to do the basic ones for basic car control. At the monute its stupid trying to do the races whilst not touching the AI at all as they are so tightly packed together and so thick you just cant win.

Why do I have Pro on every of that lessons then? Bear in mind, I'm far away from being a good driver...

The best cure for wreckers / n00bs are server admins and sensible use of the kick/ban system.

I've already thought a lot about this recently:

Newb is a concept I think is ill-conceived to describe the problem, it implies new or illiterate drivers are the 'problem'. It isn't. Time and time again when practicing for my last league race two of the top drivers got through T1 safely but caused 4 or more cars behind them to crash at almost every start.

What we all want, including the idiots who dont realise they are idiots, is racing where we can get good racing. Most of us are not experienced race drivers though, and not all of us know instinctively what to do in many situations we'll find ourselves in during a race. So how can problematical drivers be pulled up on the behavior?

I hope that by having the means to act upon poor driving when it occurs, and having the balls to step on peoples ego's and tell them they've ballsed up. The only way to do this is much the same as in real racing, with a clerk of the course and a documented complaints and appeals procedure.

Few people would volunteer to be a clerk of the course for most LFS races though, which is why there's so many examples of poor driving in LFS (often by the most non-newb drivers of all, and I ocassionally have to include myself too), but I think most leagues should run a dedicated clerk - and in large leagues use a license system too.

That's why i'm working on the project I am on (see current sig), but more on that after i've moved house and my broadband is installed in about a months time.

What makes a "good" driver there is a question.

New drivers, (dont say Noobs arghhh )

I have seen many new drivers this week who are really slow ,learning the track , etc.. but I would share track space with them anytime, you trust them going into a corner that they will not make an impulsive move that wrecks both of you.

They give you respect on track,and respect is always paid back.

Good Idea Marc, but driving ability does not alway's mean clean racing , human nature and hormones usually bugger it up

John

I'm with Becky, "newb" doesn't necessarily mean "bad'. I've seen people with plenty of experience ruin races more than once. To me "newb" means "work in progress", i.e. someone who is going to get better (the majority do, including me, but it sure doesn't mean "fast" - but that's beside the point ), but in the meantime may very well make some errors, like all of us do from time to time. Even aliens make mistakes but they generally don't repeat them. It's the people who keep making the same mistakes that you have to watch. I believe one definition of insanity is "displaying repetitive behaviour but expecting different results", i.e. braking, after every restart, at the 50m marker at Blackwood in a GTR and wondering why everyone's screaming to kick you

I didn't finish the tests, mostly because they're not all that useful to me as I had plenty of GPL/LFS race sim experience before S2 came out - also because the AI aren't all that great at being practise partners. To me, the tests are a bit like the tests in GT4: Skyline Showcase (i.e. not all that instructive), but thank god they're not compulsory :up:

Having a clerk or marshall system for leagues is a good idea :up: but as far as public servers go, I guess we just have to take pot luck...I don't know if there's much you can do about idiots who choose not to drive carefully except kick 'em...

john: I don't understand why you'd learn a track in an online race, though. I'm a noob and I certainly wouldn't. What's the point? You're not going to win and you're not going to do any good racing until you know the track (you can hardly make a clean pass if you haven't got a clue about the correct speed for the corner...), so the _only_ thing you could possibly do to affect the race is to stuff up someone else's, and that's not a good idea. To me it only makes sense to learn the track / car combo in hotlapping before racing it online.

My eyes are burning again, did someone say noob??

Quote from AdamW :

To me it only makes sense to learn the track / car combo in hotlapping before racing it online

I have to respectfully disagree with that. I like to find a lightly populated server and join in, watch a few laps in cockpit view with the fastest/best controlled car on the track, learn braking points and corner speeds, and take to the track! I always do it the opposite way, learn the track, get fast (fast to me may not be fast to you), then go hotlap. Granted, this has got me into trouble a couple of times, but i dont think i could learn correctly without having consequences to my mistakes! To each his/her own i guess.

While i agree that server admins pay good money for their servers and should be able to do as they please with it, I would never exlude anybody based on skill or lack of. I think it would turn some people off if they knew they had to take pop quiz's before they join a server!


@Becky, lovely idea you got going there, but did you get a patch that i didnt?? Aston Black reversed???

Quote from JohnPenn :

New drivers, (dont say Noobs arghhh )

To clarify, some people perceive a difference between a newbie and a n00b:

newbie: A newcomer who is lacking in skill but does the right thing online and keeps out of peoples way.
n00b: A newcomer who is lacking in skill and behaves recklessly online not caring about taking out other racers because they don't know where braking points etc are.

Everyones a newbie at one point.

Quote from farcar :

To clarify, some people perceive a difference between a newbie and a n00b:

newbie: A newcomer who is lacking in skill but does the right thing online and keeps out of peoples way.
n00b: A player who is lacking in skill and behaves recklessly online not caring about taking out other racers because they don't know where braking points etc are. Often used as an insult

hi i have made a slight edit with an explanation.

its not just a newcomer who is a n00b, it can be anybody, as the term noob is actually a form of insult rather than a statement of fact. like calling a driver you know a rookie, even though he and you both know he isnt, its taken as an insult. ah well i guess im just rambling now i guess u see what i mean even though its kinda unimportant.

Quote from richy :

hi i have made a slight edit with an explanation.

its not just a newcomer who is a n00b, it can be anybody, as the term noob is actually a form of insult rather than a statement of fact. like calling a driver you know a rookie, even though he and you both know he isnt, its taken as an insult. ah well i guess im just rambling now i guess u see what i mean even though its kinda unimportant.

Fair enough, although if you continue to behave like a n00b, eventually you become a wrecker.

Quote from richy :

hi i have made a slight edit with an explanation.

its not just a newcomer who is a n00b, it can be anybody, as the term noob is actually a form of insult rather than a statement of fact. like calling a driver you know a rookie, even though he and you both know he isnt, its taken as an insult. ah well i guess im just rambling now i guess u see what i mean even though its kinda unimportant.

I would also clarify the definition of newbie. A newbie is not someone with lack of skills, but someone with lack of practice and/or experience.

And I agree with your definition of n00b. There are some n00bs who have been here quite a long time and actually know how to lap. They just don't know how to race as in with other's on the track.

And, there is an entire team of n00bs. Though, there's only one who acts like a n00b. His name is tdh... ah, td45... no, er, thd... hmm, th72?... AH! th84!!! Yea, that's him!!!

Hehehe. Just kidding there th84, though you know that. This is just for those who don't know . Now, the picture of him on the other hand....illepall

Quote from farcar :

The best cure for wreckers / n00bs are server admins and sensible use of the kick/ban system.

Amen brother..i agree. That or join some leagues or private events...other than that..use a lot of brakes and stay wide on T1..usually works for me