No, just a general point that usually 16x aniso shouldn't be affecting perfomance as much as it does in AC. If I'd wanted I could lower the iRacing settings even more and get 124fps with reasonably good graphics. In comparison AC looks like utter crap with the lowest possible settings at 60fps. Of course AC is still in development and hopefully can be optimized further. iRacing just does it in a very efficient way, but you wouldn't know that since you like to think it's utter crap.
Well not to those of you who would like to think that iRacing sucks and is not worth the money. I guess it's one way of reasoning to yourself that you should not invest in it. Call it the worse ever so you won't have to think you might be missing something.
I'm sure you can do without iRacing, there's plenty choice. For me personally they do put quality into to the product. The tracks are excellent as are the sounds. Tyre physics are improving and I can have a hoot in the RUF RWD monster.
Compared to AC, which isn't running nearly as smooth with my aging HD5850 in triplecreen having to drop anisotropic to measly 2x and everything else to low or off to get a steady 60fps, I can run iRacing 84fps solid with 16x aniso. Aniso usually does not tax the system that much but in AC it hits you hard. Hopefully my new 4Gb R9 270x will improve this somewhat. Apart from that I do like the more responsive cars in iRacing as in AC you sort of need to be really heavy footed to get the cars out of hand. I do feel that the tank slappers happen too often with iRacing but as they are constantly working on the title and improving it I do have faith in them.
iRacing isn't that expensive if you purchase in bulk, buy iRacing credits etc you will easily drop the expense in half. And you don't have to buy all the content to enjoy for what it is. And I don't think they can offer the quality for much less as there are not enough subscribers to do that. It's not selling like the GT series as it lacks a lot of "gameplay" which I do miss.
LFS is still excellent but it's falling behind on so many levels it's not even funny.
How are we going to put your perspective into perspective if you claim "the last time I tried it, it sucked"? When was this? Things do change and since you'd rather not state when it was the last time you tried it I'm tend to believe it was a while ago. So stick to your guns but I won't put much weight on your words if you "stay the course"
Well why not just tell us when you tried it the last time and which car (not all of them are updated with the latest tyre model) rather than dancing around the question?
I don't think he was saying he could do a better job. Just saying that while the tyre model is good, it's nowhere near perfect, so the very clever guy who made it in the first place (Scawen) should try and continue improving it. Unless Scawen thought the effort wasn't worth it and best leave the sim in the state as it was since it brought enough income to sustain them the last few years --> no real incentive to get back on the treadmill. But now when the money supply is a bit thinner Scawen felt the need to "whip out a reasonable tyre model" to revitalize the sim once again. I do wish him well on the job, I just wish he would have continued on this track five years earlier.
Only frustration in realizing that for Scawen the S2 license fees were enough to sustain comfortable family life. They wanted to get out of the corporate working life and do things in their own pace.
We don't know the details, but for me at least it seems that LFS has been on a backburner for a long long time now. IF you had been working for the last five years on physics and you get stumped on something hard to figure out, you could have improved the sim in other ways in the meantime.
Oculus Rift support is just a contingency plan to keep LFS 'current'. And see how fast that support was implemented... the tyre model can't be the only thing LFS could benefit from.
I do appreciate LFS for what it was and still is, just a huge potential lost since Scawen prefers relaxed 'hippie' living style and doesn't give a rats ass if WE would like to see the sim improved or not. Keeping the community happy is not a priority. Scawen working for a regular 'nine to five' pace is not a priority or even desired. Only now when the license purchases are dwindling down (as the community does not promote the sim from mouth to mouth anymore) he feels it's time to start working on improvements.
Yeah, like moving a house for some six months... So in a sense you're right. I one doesn't do any work for several years it won't be developed that fast. You actually need to put some work into it. But as long as the license fees keep coming in...
I was a big proponent of LFS when the first alpha came out in what 2002? I even dared to go and try convert the GPL crowd in RSC when LFS didn't have this forum yet. Oh how times change. Even the nicest apple will eventually rot...
Have you tried the Ruf? Doesn't seem like you do. What I read from your posts that you want to have your fun at the price you deem correct, if not, you're going to moan about it, a lot.
You seem to have invested a lot of time on LFS so I can understand you being defensive and hoping Scawen will eventually pull out the rabbit out of a hat.
Robbing a bank? Well maybe if you're a teenager without an income. I would think in Canada the purchase power is pretty high compared to the rest of the world so it really shouldn't be that high of a price.
I just wish Scawen would have announced it some five years ago that he's taken a hiatus from the game development so I wouldn't have wasted my time visiting this forum and hoping for an update. That's what annoys me the most. Don't really care that much for Scirocco.
My sarcasm meter went over the chart with Scaven's last line there... 
Yeah, ummm, nope, doesn't work for me. So much missed potential but which was not very high on Scawens agenda. So much implied promise that never came to fruitition. Even though Scaven has posted that he'll mash up a reasonable tire model update and whatnot it's going to be an uphill struggle to convince people that they should dedicate time yet again for LFS.
It's not a passion anymore for devs, more like a nuisance that needs to be done as revenue from S2 is not sustaining them anymore.
On that note it's good that I have my iRacing subscription valid for a couple years still and I have a $100 credits waiting to make new content purchases. All this 'excess' could have been LFS's.
I wrote that I did turn all those down and it doesn't really help. I don't mind the car moving in the viewport, but I'd rather be without the microstutters in the horizon/road/world... (it's not the framerate, makes no difference even if the fps stay constant say 83 or 100 (60Hz screens).
Edit: Thanks for answering Scawen, I'm pretty sure I've tried turning all the sliders down that affect movement but I'll try again.
A few days ago I drove a couple of laps and remembered why I don't drive LFS that much anymore. I guess somewhere around 2005-2006 maybe, anyway a long time ago Scaven introduced this sharp bouncing movement to the viewport I guess to simulate the road bumbs and what not. It made it really hard to keep your eye focused to the apexes as the screen was juddering all over.
While I can dial in zero to the G-force movements it doesn't stop the world/horizon from juddering/bouncing/chattering. My eyes can't compensate for the quick movement.
IRL if you drive through cobblestone streets whatnot the car make shake but the horizon is still perfectly calm for me, it's really jarring effect. Maybe the revived older version still works with triple screens and doesn't have the pseudo bounce movement for the world....
edit: aah, the good old S1H7, the car jumps around the view quite heavily by the affected G-forces but the horizon stays calm. Now how can I get a similar setup in the current S2 version?
(I know, wrong thread for this but it seems the forum is quiet nowadays so noone is going to be reading the support forum...)
While I can dial in zero to the G-force movements it doesn't stop the world/horizon from juddering/bouncing/chattering. My eyes can't compensate for the quick movement.
IRL if you drive through cobblestone streets whatnot the car make shake but the horizon is still perfectly calm for me, it's really jarring effect. Maybe the revived older version still works with triple screens and doesn't have the pseudo bounce movement for the world....
edit: aah, the good old S1H7, the car jumps around the view quite heavily by the affected G-forces but the horizon stays calm. Now how can I get a similar setup in the current S2 version?
(I know, wrong thread for this but it seems the forum is quiet nowadays so noone is going to be reading the support forum...)
Last edited by aaltomar, .
Of course the v2 dev kit will have a higher resolution display but I don't think the 1080p is set in stone yet. That's the absolute minimum they are aiming at and personally I hope it's going to be higher.
http://www.geeky-gadgets.com/o ... tion-sickness-22-10-2013/
On the embedded video Palmer says that the consumer version is going to be "much more higher resolution" and I don't think FHD would be that. But time will tell.
After the article the first comment says:
4.) Oculus has stated that the first consumer edition will have a display with at a MINIMUM a 1080p display (which would translate to 960x1080 per eye) such as the current HD Prototype. It is much more likely that it will ship with a WQHD (2560x1440 or 1280x1440 per eye) display such as this: http://tinyurl.com/ozbm7wz
Was this sarcasm or do you also think that putting on VR glasses are isolating you from social real life interactions? Like you would be socialiazing when racing...
You could say why even try to simulate racing while you could be socializing and going out with friends. Hell, why are we even frequenting this forum when we could be socializing outside...
Not everyone, but most can I you're an adult and hold a job. The dev kit is around 300 dollars, not that much more than an affordable monitor. The consumer Rift is not expected to be much more.
The current 3D implementations may be crude, but most who have real life experience with the Rift praise the results even at this early stage. With a better screen and positional tracking the result will be even better. I'd say for most people the consumer Rift will be enough to take the leap.
It doesn't have to be pixel perfect. Your brains will filter out the worst. Even the low resolution is something that the dev kit users can ignore after a while. It's not good enough now for serious racing as the resolution is just not good enough.
Of course you can hold the opinion that the Rift is not and will not be good enough, I don't really understand why you would be so pessimistic about it though. It may not be for people with epilepsy and vision problems but then again there are always things that are not for everyone. Maybe not for you either but with 95% certainty it is for me.
Strange that so many write VR off so easily, "not interested"? I mean it has to be the next big thing, personally I'm not interested in 3D looking at a 2D plane with SBS techniques etc but with Oculus Rift coming that's when I get excited! The two independent views per eye and wide field of view really immerses you in the cockpit. You feel like you're really sitting inside the car and looking around with head tracking + positional tracking to look around that A-pillar will bring the experience to another level.
The current Rift dev kit has issues with low resolution but Dev kit 2 will alleviate some of that. Carmack even said that 4k displays are not that far away and from other interviews I've gathered that FullHD is just the base minimum. Hopefully they can source higher rez panels than that for the commercial version. It would be great if they could integrate nVidias new G-Sync so that fluctuating fps won't affect the fluidity of the view. With G-Sync you could have stutter and tear-free experience from anything from 30 fps to 144 fps (if they can get a more higher refresh panel than the normal 60Hz).
Oh and last note on Scawen's update, sounded he's starting the tyre model from scratch again... hopefully it's just the pessimist in me to reading the report...
will bring the experience to another level. The current Rift dev kit has issues with low resolution but Dev kit 2 will alleviate some of that. Carmack even said that 4k displays are not that far away and from other interviews I've gathered that FullHD is just the base minimum. Hopefully they can source higher rez panels than that for the commercial version. It would be great if they could integrate nVidias new G-Sync so that fluctuating fps won't affect the fluidity of the view. With G-Sync you could have stutter and tear-free experience from anything from 30 fps to 144 fps (if they can get a more higher refresh panel than the normal 60Hz).
Oh and last note on Scawen's update, sounded he's starting the tyre model from scratch again... hopefully it's just the pessimist in me to reading the report...
But still, nobody expected that the "unknown amount of time" would be in the order of several years regarding new content. I don't think even the devs expected that at the time either.
Whether it was the lost motivation or licensing it would have been nice to know not to expect anything for "unknown amount of time, development is now paused" etc. But of course that would have been bad businesswise. Better to keep things running with minimal upkeep so that the scene stays somewhat active with people who still have some faith left.
I'm still visiting mostly because of nostalgia. I'm not a driver who likes to compete and drive endless circles around the track just to get that last tenth. What first fired me up when I drove the very first pre-alpha version that was found on the net was the physics and how the cars reacted. Quick forward ten years and what was then new and refreshing feels somewhat dated and dull nowadays (track surface, sound etc). LFS had a great start and growing period which now seems to have totally stalled.
It would be nice to get some closure on the status of LFS, it's been years that we've been in the dark. Personally I think LFS is on life support, critical patches but no new major content planned. Maybe the devs wanted to have a greater success and now are unable to compete against the upcoming and currently thriving titles.
One could say in Racing Legends style "I still wait it... not"
The last thing we heard from these guys was in 2004 and they still claimed they were working on it, sounds awfully similar to LFS's current situation (apart from the fact that Racing Legends was never released):
http://www.west-racing.com/forum/index.php?topic=2395.0
Even when the devs have said that we will inform you when S3 is released, go do something else in the meanwhile, there is still a implied promise that we should not give up on LFS. But the non communication from the devs is irritating nevertheless, the 5 years without new content and the first hourly, the daily, then weekly and then monthly visit to the forums has been for me wasted time. All for the promise "we are working on it". Would have been better to give it us straight "we are not really working full time on it so don't expect an update any day in the forseen future".
Forget the Scirocco, I doubt they have the license for it.
Forget the Scirocco, I doubt they have the license for it.
Would absolutely and will buy the oculus rift if enough games support it. RPG's like Skyrim with would be great and so would driving games. I have a triplescreen setup but I still wan't a more immersive experience. The Rift seem to be focusing on all the right things. The final commercial product is promised to be even better (perhaps a little more resolution?) so it would be a win for the consumer.
On some level it disturbs and annoys me that I look forward more to the content updates than actually playing the game... (I'd wish I could capture the excitement we had with first beta when I tried to lure all the GPL guys to check out LFS at RSC. Then again, I'm closer to 40, so I'm not that easily impressed anymore).
I have all the great sims, a dedicated pit with triplescreen, but since I'm not a competitive person, just beating others is not enough a reward in itself.
So in S3 I'd like to see something akin to a single player careed mode. More ways to win that way versus playing against real people who have dedicated their lives to honing that last 0.01 of a second from a lap... And I also do mistakes, a lot. So in S3 I hope there is something more than a new tire model. At least creating a dynamic single player career path should be a lot more easy to do than a iRacing(tm) NTM (we can have that in AC).
(I'd wish I could capture the excitement we had with first beta when I tried to lure all the GPL guys to check out LFS at RSC. Then again, I'm closer to 40, so I'm not that easily impressed anymore).I have all the great sims, a dedicated pit with triplescreen, but since I'm not a competitive person, just beating others is not enough a reward in itself.
So in S3 I'd like to see something akin to a single player careed mode. More ways to win that way versus playing against real people who have dedicated their lives to honing that last 0.01 of a second from a lap... And I also do mistakes, a lot. So in S3 I hope there is something more than a new tire model. At least creating a dynamic single player career path should be a lot more easy to do than a iRacing(tm) NTM (we can have that in AC).
Scawen, I posted this research paper in iRacing forums and while interesting the "drag race sim guru" (forgot his name) said it doesn't really help with tyre modelling.
I'm sure not by itself it won't but I guess it explains the basic physics behind friction and that is what happens when rubber meets with the road. Of course the changing characteristics of rubber makes the problem quite a bit more challenging. I'm hoping this might give you some new ideas, but hopefully not another 4 year development treck into unknown
http://aipadvances.aip.org/res ... =fulltext&bypassSSO=1
A thermodynamic model of sliding friction
"In this paper it is shown that surface thermodynamics alone provide a solution for a friction force. This force is derivable from the following fundamentals alone a) definition of sliding, b) definition of real contact, c) laws of thermodynamics. When combined with simple contact mechanics, this first-principle model predicts the observed friction laws and the material dependence of friction in agreement with nanoscale measurements."
I'm sure not by itself it won't but I guess it explains the basic physics behind friction and that is what happens when rubber meets with the road. Of course the changing characteristics of rubber makes the problem quite a bit more challenging. I'm hoping this might give you some new ideas, but hopefully not another 4 year development treck into unknown
http://aipadvances.aip.org/res ... =fulltext&bypassSSO=1
A thermodynamic model of sliding friction
"In this paper it is shown that surface thermodynamics alone provide a solution for a friction force. This force is derivable from the following fundamentals alone a) definition of sliding, b) definition of real contact, c) laws of thermodynamics. When combined with simple contact mechanics, this first-principle model predicts the observed friction laws and the material dependence of friction in agreement with nanoscale measurements."
Weee, still here. Occasionally pop in to see if there would have been any significant news about new content or physics update, sadly still waiting. In the meantime iRacing and RBR have been the choice of sims. Currently in S2 the tracks feel too numb compared to iRacing lively laser scanned tracks. Those little bumps, humps and camber changes make all the difference.
Some time ago I drew the conclusion that LFS was on life support and no real progress was happening in content or programming side. Maybe it was so and only now there seems to be a bit of hope that S3 may see the light some day in the future. Hopefully within a year or otherwise I guess Assetto Corsa and the likes will trump the market.
Some time ago I drew the conclusion that LFS was on life support and no real progress was happening in content or programming side. Maybe it was so and only now there seems to be a bit of hope that S3 may see the light some day in the future. Hopefully within a year or otherwise I guess Assetto Corsa and the likes will trump the market.
I hate the effect with passion. Feels like the car has lost all it's rigidity and starting to fall into pieces. Also since you know it's a canned effect and has nothing to do with the road roughness it's very irritating.
FGED GREDG RDFGDR GSFDG