My favourite brand of car manufacturer is now going to be available for me to play as realistic as it gets. I thank you Scavier, with anything involving Volkswagen, you always know you are going to get only quality results. It would be interesting to know if they were easier to work with than when you first put the BF1 into the game.

Quote from amp88 :

snip....

Simple equation.....

If LFS + VWS = more license sales, then VWS = a good thing.

It's that simple.

It's a little selfish and short sighted to see it your way, because it has greater ramifications than your enjoyment of any new added content.

FTR, I am not that enamoured with the VWS, but I can see the economic and farther reaching reasons behind it, therefore, its a good thing.

Quote from danowat :

Simple equation.....

If LFS + VWS = more license sales, then VWS = a good thing.

It's that simple.

Not many people will pick up and buy the game in the way that he thinks, however, things would favour his opinion if the car was a BMW.

Blue flame, as soon as youtube is flooded with videos of Sciroccos racing around South City, everybody's going to ask "what game is that?". I think it's the car that will kindle the most interest in LfS of all the cars ever added.

Quote from ColeusRattus :

Blue flame, as soon as youtube is flooded with videos of Sciroccos racing around South City, everybody's going to ask "what game is that?". I think it's the car that will kindle the most interest in LfS of all the cars ever added.

Of course it will. Volkswagen has the highest credibility in the world and the highest number of followers.

bThe type of people who will join to LFS will be nicer than you guys assume, lets not be puristical about it, just because most of us here have played the game from the beginning, means that we should look down upon those that are new because of a new car?

More money and publicity is just what LFS needs, then everyone will be able to drive the cars they like and they won't need to put up with Gran Turismic or Need For Speedical phyisics.

Let the noobs sign up and be counted, don't treat them as lesser people. Besides most of them have probobly played the demo before, and the Scirocco is JUST what tilts them to buying it.

Would I be right in saying that the Scirocco will have a MacPherson strut at the front, and an independent multi-link (4) at the rear? This would be, as I gather, the first ML suspension in LFS. Interesting to see how well it's modeled.

Also, does anyone have linkage to Scirocco's stock diff? Is it fully open or maybe.. torsen

nice one

I'm sure if LFS had the old Civic Type-R you would see even more people.

It's about time for an update.

Just a few corrections to make :

Quote from amp88 :

I think I'm probably one of only a few people who is lukewarm about the Scirocco. What does it add to LFS? We already have the FXO for a front drive 'hot hatch'. All it really gives LFS is presumably a paycheque to the devs from VW and a slightly bigger audience of people who'll go "OMG, a real car in LFS"

Presumably? In the past game developers paid car manufacturers for the license. We don't expect to ever pay for a license, because it should be the other way round. It's silly to pay manufacturers to give them publicity. Car manufacturers are slowly starting to realise this and in time that will be the case but no, we have never received a payment to include a car. VW wanted us to do the car in time for the GC and we made sure we could do it on our terms.

Quote from amp88 :

Because of the relationship with the FBM's series we got Demo/S1/S2 merged which means if you run an S2 server with demo content you can't stop demo'ers connecting (AFAIK).

Wrong, it's very easy to exclude demo racers, just allow more players than are allowed in the demo, or add one cone somewhere.

Quote from NotAnIllusion :

Would I be right in saying that the Scirocco will have a MacPherson strut at the front, and an independent multi-link (4) at the rear? This would be, as I gather, the first ML suspension in LFS. Interesting to see how well it's modeled.

You are right but no, the LFS one does not have multilink rear suspension. It just has the best available in LFS which is a double wishbone. At some point I'd like to add better suspension types with more complex motion but that has not been done yet.

Quote from NotAnIllusion :

Also, does anyone have linkage to Scirocco's stock diff? Is it fully open or maybe.. torsen

It's weirdy...

Quote :

Electronic Differential Lock
The electronic differential lock permits smooth, comfortable starts on road surfaces that do not offer a uniform level of grip. If one wheel starts to spin, the electronic differential lock will brake the wheel as necessary, directing power to the wheel with greater traction. The electronic differential lock reduces tyre wear and is active up to a speed of about 40 km/h (4MOTION: up to approx. 80 km/h). It is an integral component of the electronic stabilisation program (ESP) and traction control (ASR).

Quote from Stew2000 :

I'm sure if LFS had the old Civic Type-R you would see even more people.

Yes, it would have brought more girls to the game.

Quote from Scawen :

Wrong, it's very easy to exclude demo racers, just allow more players than are allowed in the demo, or add one cone somewhere.

That's not a very elegant solution to the problem is it? What happens if you only want to allow 10 guests and you don't want to have to load a layout every time you start the server?

Ok, so VW didn't pay to get the car in but there are so many improvement suggestions that have been sitting around for months/years that would take less than a week to research, develop and implement. Why does a new car come above those? The type of people who are going to be attracted to LFS because they saw a youtube video are the same type who are going to be instantly put off by a lack of features (like a favourites list for servers...).

Quote from Gunn :

Yes, it would have brought more girls to the game.

hahaha that gets a

I wonder if VW would be nice enough to give permission for a Polo Bluemotion. see how many mpg we can get

Quote from Scawen :

You are right but no, the LFS one does not have multilink rear suspension. It just has the best available in LFS which is a double wishbone. At some point I'd like to add better suspension types with more complex motion but that has not been done yet.

I see, good to know. Thanks for the clarification, wouldn't want to be spreading false info

Quote from Bean0 :

Electronic Differential Lock

Hm, so it acts like an open diff above 40 km/h and an LSD at below. Braking the slipping wheel though? Wouldn't just transferring the torque be enough It'll probably be of use though, when the vtak.. turbo, I mean , kicks in at low speeds.

Quote from amp88 :

Ok, so VW didn't pay to get the car in but there are so many improvement suggestions that have been sitting around for months/years that would take less than a week to research, develop and implement. Why does a new car come above those? The type of people who are going to be attracted to LFS because they saw a youtube video are the same type who are going to be instantly put off by a lack of features (like a favourites list for servers...).

Instead of being purist and slightly hinting towards the thought of LFS 'selling out' maybe you should think about the growth of LFS and what YOU as a player will gain in return. The n00bs are ALWAYS on the public servers, we all know as long-serving LFS players that the league races are the place to be.

You already know that most of the ridiculous run of people are left behind when you are on a private server but it doesn't even seem to be that it's a certain type of PLAYER you are against, but a certain type of PEOPLE.

Quote from Scawen :

Just a few corrections to make :

Presumably? In the past game developers paid car manufacturers for the license. We don't expect to ever pay for a license, because it should be the other way round. It's silly to pay manufacturers to give them publicity. Car manufacturers are slowly starting to realise this and in time that will be the case but no, we have never received a payment to include a car. VW wanted us to do the car in time for the GC and we made sure we could do it on our terms.

Wrong, it's very easy to exclude demo racers, just allow more players than are allowed in the demo, or add one cone somewhere.

You are right but no, the LFS one does not have multilink rear suspension. It just has the best available in LFS which is a double wishbone. At some point I'd like to add better suspension types with more complex motion but that has not been done yet.

Don't worry about this kind of people Scawen, you have better things to think about than the anger of some guy in the forum
Some of them here do no understand the fact that the only place where they can get a product that matches exactly their desires is the restaurants where you tick which ingredients you'd like to see in your salad/burger/<insert your dish here>.

You are right in the way that by no mean a developper should have to pay money to use a RL car in a game. And I am glad that your game is one of the first to change the market behavior of the car companies

All of you three are doing an amazingly great job since the beginning. I hope you continue like this and don't get too bothered by some childish "customer pressure" (whims would be more appropriate) by people who think they know everything about your product. You manage it the way you want, and you should keep this up that way, because you did not create any big deception in the community yet.

A bit off-topic, but I am in close talkings with one of the public relationship executive officers of a famous French go-kart manufacturer (rental karts and race-specs). There's great chances he might be interested by having their product featured in LFS, so do you think I should speak with him about this? Since they need some advertising, I am sure they could provide you with all the necessary data, including chassis-flex models, and license for free if they are hooked. (If you don't care, don't worry, I won't bother doing this, but I am willing to be your ambassador or get you guys in touch together if you are interested, just PM or mail me).

Best regards,

Robin

@amp88

LFS isn't YOUR game, it doesn't and isn't pandering to YOUR every whim.

Even if the Scirocco doesn't add a new car concept to LFS, what it does, is setting new standards in terms of know how and quality to LFS. May be not everybody benefits today from the scirocco, but it demonstrates strongly what can be done in future!

Quote from Zen321 :

no [...] developper should have to pay money to use a RL car in a game.

While I agree that this applies (read: should apply) to all general consumer cars, it doesn't really hold water for some of the pricy exotics (exclusives?) that are a status symbol because not everyone can have one.

The best thing about this whole thing is that, people can relate a real car to LFS's physics. The cars already on LFS are cars that can never be driven by the public (except the RAC [in reality, a person COULD drive the MRT, BF1 or FBM but honestly? No]) so the Scirocco gives LFS even more realism, in just having a real car on the game as lets be honest, as it stands, the Scirocco is the car that we are all most likely to drive rather than the existing real cars on LFS. So it's more realistic so speculate actually driving one. Rather than just dreaming.

Sigh.

What I'm saying is this: the Improvement Suggestions subforum is full of user-submitted suggestions of how to improve LFS. A lot of those suggestions have a lot of backing from members of the community. Why don't the dev team take those into account rather than creating a new car?

I don't see how that is selfish and I'm not an angry person. I'm asking what I think is a valid question. Why is it a stupid question and why does it make me selfish/angry?

What you need to remember is this.....

The development team have their own development path, it's up to them what they put in, if they don't see fit that any of the suggestions in the suggestion forum should be put into LFS yet, then they don't do it.

Believe me, there are 101 things that I think should added to LFS, these may, and probably do, differ to what the devs, and possible a large percentage of the LFS community think "should" be put into LFS.

It's not a stupid question per say, it's just not a relevent one, the answer is always the same, so it's best to just sit back and let things develop as they do, and not get frustrated when they don't go the way you see them.

All you need to remember is LFS isn't a demogracy, heck it isn't even a "normal" working ethic, Scawen doesn't have a "boss", he does what he wants, when he wants, LFS is his "ship" and he steers it in the direction he wants, without any deadlines or any of the other BS thats goes along with it, IMO, this working ethic is VERY, VERY unsual, however, it's one that I bet 99% of the working population would LOVE to do.

So just let the ship find it's own course, and enjoy it as it comes.

Quote from amp88 :

Sigh.

What I'm saying is this: the Improvement Suggestions subforum is full of user-submitted suggestions of how to improve LFS. A lot of those suggestions have a lot of backing from members of the community. Why don't the dev team take those into account rather than creating a new car?

I am sure the devs will take suggestions they deem good enough into account in due time.

Adding the Sirocco to LFS was a unique opportunity for the devs, though, so naturally they put a lot of other stuff on hold in order to get the car ready for the GC. It's only common sense. It would have been a very bad decision to pass up on that opportunity because they had to implement a favourite server list.

Surely you can see that this was the only sensible decision, business and marketing wise?

Quote from amp88 :

Sigh.

What I'm saying is this: the Improvement Suggestions subforum is full of user-submitted suggestions of how to improve LFS. A lot of those suggestions have a lot of backing from members of the community. Why don't the dev team take those into account rather than creating a new car?

I don't see how that is selfish and I'm not an angry person. I'm asking what I think is a valid question. Why is it a stupid question and why does it make me selfish/angry?

If there's existing problems that are important to the community in general, then yes I see your point, but still, you are reluctant to let LFS grow because you fear it will bring a certain type of players/people that you don't like or, you assume that you don't. You can't honestly say that you feel like this because you are trying to spare new players of these problems you feel are in desperate need of attention, so why not just let LFS grow? I don't have any problems with LFS myself, so a new car for me is a must as I was beginning to lack interest, other than on the forums of course.