If 34mpg is defined by "drinks fuel like Charles Kenedy drinks Whisky"... I dread to think what you'd _really_ think if you had a faster car.

I get about 26 tops, if I drive _very_ conservatively.. but as I don't, I'm looking closer to 12-18. That said, being a RWD does infinitely increase the fun factor

Seriously though.. "faster" and "more economical" don't really go hand-in-hand.

Hell.. for sh!ts n giggles.. why not look for a BMW E30 318iS. Most definitely quicker than than the proton and with the right wheels doing the driving.. infinitely more fun



Regards,

Ian

Quote from tristancliffe :

Something different - a Toyota Sera

I had to look that one up.

Heck with Jakg, I want one of those!

I had a Geo Storm back when I was 20, basically a POS Isuzu imported for Chevy. It looked generally like that Sera. That little thing handled like a slot car after I put some Pirelli P500 tires on it. The problem the Storm had was, it had some Chevy parts on it. Beings I am a huge fan of Toyota after trading my Storm in on a used Toy Hilux 4x4, I would love to have that Sera available over here. I'd buy it in a heartbeat!

My brother set up, but no longer runs, the Toyota Sera Owners Club (www.toyotasera.co.uk). I don't know how many are known in the States, but I'm sure some found their way over there... You've just got to find them. Quite close to Paseo/Starlet running gear and platform, so parts are easy to get hold of too

Quote from Ian.H :

I get about 26 tops, if I drive _very_ conservatively.. but as I don't, I'm looking closer to 12-18. That said, being a RWD does infinitely increase the fun factor

You drive a f'in BMW!

The next model up from my car (the Proton Impian, i.e. one without a 10-15 year old Mitsubishi engine in it...) weighs more, and gets 42 MPG from a 1.6 with more power.

Even my friends bloody Volvo 460 gets more MPG than me and costs less to tax (and the same to insure) - and he's driving a sodding tank :P

The Sera looks unique, and the SLSS sounds pimping :P But it's not cheap - (£2.5k!) and as it's an import the insurance company will bend me over a barrel(same for the jumped up Neon, Chris :P).

Any other suggestions?

Quote from Jakg :

You drive a f'in BMW!

[ snip ]

I wasn't having a pop.. just that faster _normally_ means less economical. If I wanted something that drank less than my car, I'd have to consider something a little slower etc etc

The only place a "faster car" (by this I'm really referring to something with a bigger engine) is likely to be more economical is on the motorway where the engine has to work less to achieve higher speeds.

Just sounded like you were wanting the best of both worlds (faster and more economical) that don't often meet



Regards,

Ian

All I'm saying is that for what my car is it's quite uneconomical - there are cars out there that are faster, better and yet still drink less fuel (i.e. an Astra).

Maybe you have a fuel leak? I'm only getting 20mp(US)g, which is 24mp(Imperial)g city in my car because I have a fuel leak. Either that or something is causing my car to run rich. Probably a little bit of both. I need to do a compression test lol

The quoted mpg of the car is 34 - the actual one needs me to fill up and measure it because my actual fuel gauge says I get 150 miles on the first half a tank and then I get about 75 on the second half of the tank (every Wira seems to do this :X)

My car does it too, just not that bad!

Fuel economy is only had by going slow, and in a faster car you will not be going as slow as you would in the slower car (figure that one out eh? =)

Economy is really had by keeping the engine stoich, but I think there is a wasteage factor when accelerating that gets worse the faster you accelerate, otherwise we would get the same gas millage regardless on how fast or slow we accelerate. I understand that different engines performe better/worse blah blah blah, but you hopefully get my point.

What I am getting at is even if they do post XXX for gas milage they don't mean didly unless you are driving like a grandma, and then whats the need for a faster car then? Other than burning more fuel and get less economy than you do now.

An Astra is an option too.

Quote from Jakg :

there are cars out there that are faster, better and yet still drink less fuel (i.e. an Astra).

well yes thats what you get for buying a proton

Based on your specs, Jack, I'd say what you need is something like this Passion Wagon.

I'm off back to bed

It was free :P

Chris - I understand a faster car should be less economical, but my cars engine is quite inefecient as it is (now quite old - it's been in cars from at least 1993 if not earlier) Mitsubishi Orion 4G15 design. Like I said - a bigger, heavier car with more power and a larger engine could well be more economical with a more efficient engine.

I said faster because it seems silly getting anything slower than what I have now, and because anything bigger would probably need a beefier engine to catch up - when I say bigger i mean a 1.6 or even a 1.8, not a 2.5L 240 HP monster :P

EDIT - I'll pass, thanks.

I am still open to suggestions on cars (will be looking at prices / insurance etc tomorrow) - I dont need more than 2 seats (but 4 / 5 is nice), would like something more comfortable than i've got now. Like I said - the Volvo 460 seems to be great, esp seeing as you can get the fully specced versions with 14 million miles but all the options for pretty much peanuts - but i'm rubbish with cars :X

My fuel economy doesn't change that drastically from when I drive spirited to when I drive normally. I mean, as long as I don't floor it. The kind of car that I drive runs extremely rich in open loop. But as long as it's in closed loop it makes no difference. Except when I do 50/50 city/highway driving, then I average about 26mpg US gal/31mpg Imperial gallons. And, before my fuel leak I got 36 miles per gallon US (43mpg imperial) when driving solely on the highway for about 180mi.

I really need to lean my car out. It runs way too rich on the top end. It saves detonations, but cuts the power down, by as much as 30HP! And I 'should' get better fuel economy.

That Moris sounds interesting.

Yeah, on my car, which produces 124HP stock, some people who have installed megasquirt have gotten gains of about 30HP. Which makes sense. 124HP is kind of sad for a 1.9L motor.

Quote from Jakg :

I said faster because it seems silly getting anything slower than what I have now

i can think of a reason why you should

Quote :

when I say bigger i mean a 1.6 or even a 1.8, not a 2.5L 240 HP monster :P

you know you can get a 3l 240hp supra mk3 in your budget
gas mileage wont be great though

Stop driving like a granny - they get awful fuel consumption. Floor it more, get to your cruising speed quicker using quite a lot of revs. Then cruise in a suitable gear (top, probably). This uses less fuel overall than taking 50 seconds to reach 60mph. Honest.

Quote from tristancliffe :

Floor it more, get to your cruising speed quicker using quite a lot of revs.

I think you should change that to "use as much throttle as possible without your ECU going into open loop mode". For those of us with cars that run overly-rich in open loop.

hmmm... this might sound weird, but go for an 80's american. they are tough cars, and they get okay gas mileage. When my bro had his '91 Camaro RS, he got like 23 mpg out of it. Besides, its not what you drive, it's how you drive it. He'd take it easy when it comes to saving gas (and tires ), but when he needed to put his foot down, it got him up to speed limit without a problem. So before you laugh at me, think; have you seen an American do this before? I have, and I have proof! My other bro's '87 Jeep Cherokee gets I am going to guess 23 mpg also. Jeeps are tough, too, just make your u-joints are tight in the back! My brother tried to do a burnout in my other brother's Jeep (which it can do), and the bolts that hold the U-joints for his drive shaft snapped in half . Anyway, just try an american car. you might like it.

Ok, I am trying to think out of the box here, all these models are/were available "in the area", and in the price range, I have no idea about MPG or insurance group....

Alfa 145 1.6
Alfa 147 1.6
MG ZR
MG ZS
MG TF
Vauxhall Tigra
Ford Puma
VW Lupo 1.4 sport

I think they may be a bit expensive on insurance, and i'm not sure if I can afford them either, but i'll have a look.

It doesn't necesarily need to be a hot hatch - something like an Astra or a saloon could be nice...

Quote from tristancliffe :

Stop driving like a granny - they get awful fuel consumption. Floor it more, get to your cruising speed quicker using quite a lot of revs. Then cruise in a suitable gear (top, probably). This uses less fuel overall than taking 50 seconds to reach 60mph. Honest.

It's surprising how many people think that slow steady acceleration means smaller fuel consumption. Even more people seem to be in hurry to go fast to stop on red lights, which is just silly, as getting to move again always takes the most fuel.

Driving economically can be fun and not as dreadfully boring as it may sound. It's a game of not trying to stop, reading the traffic and sportish accelerations.

I wouldn't bother with an MG ZR since they're just factory-riced Rover 200s and obviously subject to just as much head gasket failure as any other Rover

Try insurance companies Adrian Flux (who specialise in things like hot hatches) and Sky (who specialise in Japanese, imported and modded cars).
I went through Sky and they undercut my previous lowest quote (Admiral) by about £200. Mention my name if you sign up

For your totally crazy I-wish-my-car-had-cost-that-much price tag you could pick up a nice Mk1 Seat Leon. They 1.9 diesel gets good mileage and being a 5-door diesel should also get you a lower quote.

Haven't read all the posts so appologies if it's already been suggested.

How about a Clio? I used to have an 1.4RT (93 model - you should be able to get something newer), that was sub 12 sec 0-60, nimble and fun to drive. No idea what kind of condition you'd get one for under 2k though.

Quote from Ian.H :

..... with the right wheels doing the driving.. infinitely more fun

and infinitely more dangerous in the hands of an inexperienced driver.

IMO the most powerful RWD car a new driver (especially those under 25) should be allowed to drive are Morris Minors. Oh I don't care about them killing themselves but the statistics all show young inexperienced drivers are a lot more likely to take someone else with them, either passenger or other road user.